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Progressive Indie? |
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siLLy puPPy 
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15418 |
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 Posted: February 09 2024 at 19:53 |
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We evaluated SUFJAN on the Eclectic team recently and i've owned most of his albums for over a decade so i'm quite familiar with him and his style. I've listened quite intently too. Art rock is the perfect category for him but if he was to get on PA then i'd agree that CROSSOVER is the most appropriate place for him. I have not heard the ALL DELIGHTED PEOPLE EP so maybe that will be his ticket for inclusion. I'll check that out soon :) (function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'85310c495e829872',t:'MTcwNzUzMzQ2Mi4wNzMwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
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siLLy puPPy
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15418 |
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Posted: February 09 2024 at 19:06 |
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I haven't heard that album in a while. That is definitely his most progressive album but to my ears it's more of an experimental orchestrated pop album much like The Beatles on Sgt Peppers. I'd be OK with Sufjan in Crossover but to my ears he's just not progressive rock. The debate between progressive meaning experimental and fresh vs progressive rock in the classic sense has been debated ad nauseam on this site with the consensus that this site is the latter and not the former. If we were to simply call it the Prog and Experimental Archives then that would be much more inclusive and in that case Sufjan would surely fit in. To me he's art pop, art rock, chamber pop but not progressive rock. If he gets voted to be included though i'm not going to throw a tantrum. I'll just write some reviews because he's definitely crafted some EXCELLENT albums especially THE AGE OF ADZ. (function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'8530c62429fe96c3',t:'MTcwNzUzMDU4OC45NTMwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
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allmediareviews
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Joined: February 09 2024 Location: MN Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Posted: February 09 2024 at 15:52 |
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MPAR - Modern Progressive Art Rock
https://rateyourmusic.com/list/SoundscapeMN/favorite-modern-progressive-art-rock-albums-200-1/ |
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Logan
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Posted: February 09 2024 at 11:38 |
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Nothing progressive about Sufjan Stevens. I would not even pretend to understand the arguments behind that thinking. To me he is, to use a term I like from Mike's site, prog adjacent, but Prog or not, he is definitely progressive in his approach to music and the music definitely has progressive qualities.
I would have no issue with him in PA, but don't care that much how we classify genre-wise. But yes, I agree, he is truly progressive even if not at all Prog. To me he has enough in common with music and approaches under the Prog umbrella. Sticking to Prog-as-genre leads to less progressive music because a big part of being progressive to me is not being generic, changing approaches, being able to be unconventional. I would have thought Crossover if in PA, which split from our old Art Rock category. Edited by Logan - February 09 2024 at 11:40 |
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Saperlipopette!
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Posted: February 09 2024 at 11:17 |
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The way I see it Sufjan Stevens is a progressive artist in the truest sense of the word. But of course he isn't "Prog" as such. Sufjan would have fitted nicely in Art Rock when that was a sub genre
here. It's replacement Crossover is a better fit than Prog Folk imo. Here's a source that indicates he is progressive. Genre descriptions on some of his albums on RYM: Illinois, Age of Adz, The Ascension: Progressive Pop Aporia, Meditations, Lamentations, Revelations, Celebrations, Incantations: Progressive Electronic All Delighted People EP (but an hour long album): Progressive Rock, Progressive Pop This song is closer to Gentle Giant than your average indie band really. |
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siLLy puPPy
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15418 |
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Posted: February 09 2024 at 07:17 |
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Well personally i find nothing progressive about him. Art rock / art folk isn't progressive. I've not seen one other source that indicates he's progressive and i've heard most of his albums personally and don't find him even remotely progressive. I'll get to AUA when i get to it. Everything has been hectic and focusing on team duties has not been a priority. (function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'852cb9c719b8fa36',t:'MTcwNzQ4ODEzOS40ODcwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
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Gordy
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Folk/Eclectic/PSIKE/Metal/Post/Math Team Joined: January 25 2007 Location: US Status: Online Points: 4522 |
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Posted: February 09 2024 at 07:00 |
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^Sufjan is currently undergoing evaluation in Prog Folk with two Yes votes. 🙂
Speaking of "progressive indie", we still need to hear your thoughts on AUA, Mike. Edited by Gordy - February 09 2024 at 07:01 |
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siLLy puPPy
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15418 |
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Posted: February 09 2024 at 06:08 |
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Neither are progressive rock. Art rock yes but no prog. We rejected Sufjan not too long ago. (function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'852c5602eb86944c',t:'MTcwNzQ4NDA1My4wNTEwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
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Xeroth
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Posted: February 08 2024 at 22:17 |
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I've been thinking about this too. Most are probably related but still don't feel terribly proggy as the genre sits. I agree with some mentioning The Decemberists. One of my favorite alternative-folk indie artists is Radical Face. The concepts and unusual structures makes many of the songs feel progressive. Especially The Family Tree trilogy. The most recent production also is experimental and creative. Prog Folk maybe?
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I once was cool, but now I'm cold. Can you please turn up the heat.
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AFlowerKingCrimson
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Posted: February 08 2024 at 10:33 |
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Maybe also Wilco and Sufjan Stevens.
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Awesoreno
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 21:39 |
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The Dear Hunter sounds more like prog pop meets emo/pop punk to me. Though I guess there's somewhat of an indie vibe. When I think of "indie" nowadays, my brain immediately goes to more of the shoegaze-type stuff.
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mellotronwave
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 17:14 |
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Midlake ?
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Golden Mean
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 11:43 |
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New Jersey's Moon Rabbit Retreat nicely blends indie elements with a progressive rock style. They really couldn't be labelled as crossover prog or post-pock. These New Jerseyans are exactly that: a progressive indie-rock band. Their 23-minute-long EP should be listened to in its entirety.
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AFlowerKingCrimson
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 11:08 |
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The Pineapple Thief and Gazpacho (and even some of the middle period Porcupine Tree) seem to have alternative influences but I'm not sure about Indie.
Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - February 07 2024 at 11:09 |
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siLLy puPPy
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15418 |
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 10:22 |
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For sure. I don't know why these terms stick when they lose their original meanings. There is a distinct "indie" sound though for many of the bands labeled as such. Sort of out of tune and just slightly off if that makes any sense. Agree with Dapper about Glass Beach. New indie prog rock that should be here. For(function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'851d4dcdad3967f5',t:'MTcwNzMyNjQzMC40MTYwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
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Lewian
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 10:18 |
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By the way "Indie" is an even worse genre label than "Prog" and that means something. I have heard such a lot of utterly boring and cliched Indie rock, to the extent that I sometimes tend to think whatever has anything interesting in it really should be ruled out from being called "Indie" by definition. Although what I know of what has been mentioned in this thread is certainly good stuff.
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Dapper~Blueberries
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 09:42 |
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Well, The Dear Hunter is certainly one, and probably the most popular of this kind of subgenre. Same goes for Mew and Vylet Pony (though they are less indie rock and more indie pop) and maybe even King Gizzard And The Lizard Wizard & Thee Oh Sees. Additionally that new Glass Beach record that came out last month could be considered indie prog. Edited by Dapper~Blueberries - February 07 2024 at 09:44 |
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D~B
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Golden Mean
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 09:12 |
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siLLy puPPy
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 09:02 |
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^ some of their albums are more chamber pop, some chamber folk I'm not really sure where the term alternative rock yields to indie but many bands like Mansun are more referred to as progressive alternative rock or progressive Britpop of all things :D (function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'851cd88cfa222524',t:'MTcwNzMyMTYyNy43NjgwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium none; visibility: ;" width="1" height="1">
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Golden Mean
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Posted: February 07 2024 at 08:58 |
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Saperlipopette! wrote: