Genesis: Better without Gabriel?

to answer the question, i would say it depends....

for the drumming performance, no doubt: ATOTT and W&W are the best ones hands down!

for the poignant electric guitar solos, W&W is the best one.

for the best jazzy and best technical performance, ATOTT is the album.

for the catchiest tracks, ATOTT, ATTWT and W&W win hands down (many too many, ripples, blood on the rooftops)

on the other hand,

 

 the best & elaborated compositions are on the albums with gabriel, especially Fxtrt and selling.

the most complex tracks are on the gabriel albums.

the most prog tracks are on the gabriel albums.

the best overall albums are some gabriel albums: fxtrt and selling.

the best keyboards parts are on fxtrt and selling.

 

Finally, the best vocals are ..... on the Collins albums! just listen to ripples, blood on the rooftops and ATTWT and you'll see!

 

Edited by greenback

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!

Not again,Gabriel's Genesis is miles better.Collins ruined a great prog band.I despise this odious little fricking arse of a man.

 

For the record, my favourite albums by the G-Men are the three 'big' releases: Foxtrot, SEBTP and LLDOB. However...

Genesis post-Gabriel is definitely not better, but I wouldn't go as far as to say they are 'worse', more like just different. I liken it to a painter who has his hand cut off. Same inspiration, same tools, but with just a different outlet (hopefully his other hand).

A Trick of the Tail and Wind & Wuthering are seriously quality Genesis albums. So maybe the question should be is Genesis post-Hackett better or worse?

Gabriel doesn't have the most gifted voice in the market, but he has something special, he transmits the message he wants, he plays with the feelings of the listener and makes you a part of the plot of the song or album.

I always give this example, but it's really clear, In The Cage is the most descriptive track I ever heard, Gabriel not only tells the story of Rael trapped in the rocks cage but he describes the feelings that pass by Rael's mind, his physical symptoms, his anger and pain plus the solitude and disappointment when abandoned by his brother John.

I always feel the pain and claustrophobia made more evident with his famous semi yodeling almost as a desperate cry for help:

Stalactites, stalagmites
Shut me in, lock me tight.
Lips are dry, throat is dry.
Feel like burning, stomach churning,
I'm dressed up in a white costume
Padding out leftover room.
Body stretching, feel the wretching
In the cage
Get me out of this cage!

Of course the lyrics and the dramatic lyrics (By Gabriel) help a lot, because nobody can be emotional with Misunderstanding, but Phil is unemotional.

Phil's voice is nice for the soft stuff, but he sings in only one tone and he's incapable of transmitting emotions, when he tries to be dramatic he only shouts, for example listen the touch me, touch me part of The Musical Box by the two vocalists and the difference is very clear in favor of Peter.

Iván

 

Better withOUT Gabriel?! Are you sure you didn't type that wrong?

Syzygy wrote: Post Hackett Genesis was

Good point, well made - The usual debate divides Genesis into Gabriel/Collins eras; what few people highlight is the fact that Genesis remained a high profile progressive rock band, with a consistently high quality output not until Gabriel left, but until Hackett left.

Afterward, there was a very patchy album in "and then there were three", followed by "duke", "abacab" etc etc....

Methinks we usually put the dividing line about 4 years too early - discuss...

Genesis was better without Steve Howe !!!!!!!!! 

Edited by Velvetclown

Velvetclown wrote: Genesis was better without Steve Howe !!!!!!!!!

That's completely untrue. Steve Howe made Genesis what they were.

I'm presuming I'm the only person here who's been scolded by Phil Collins ... and that for asking him a question which wasn't subtle enough to hide the fact that I much prefer Gabriel-era Genesis ...

It happened during a video conference interview in 1996. Twas my first year as a journalist for Malaysia's The Star newspaper, and Phil was promoting the Dance in the Light album ...

Phil's two notable quotes ... "Do you want Steve Hackett's phone number? Actually Steve is one of those people I found where all we had in common was the music, and when we stopped playing together, we had nothing to say to each other. I've seen him once or twice at Michael Rutherford's parties, I think" and equally tellingly ... "I don't think I'm doing the same old sh*t all the time" ...

Sigh ... it's tough as a journalist not to go fawning over your heroes ... ( I think Phil's drumming was particularly outstanding on Nursery Cryme, Foxtrot and Selling England by the Pound ... plus I really love the haunting song In The Air Tonight) ... but I obviously went too far in the other direction on that occasion...