The Christian Thread

Perhaps.....
I do believe in fair and balanced so you know we can't have the atheist thread running this show alone!

Back in business, I see. 

A question I hope some scholarly folk maybe able to answer:

We all know that the Romans documented their history pretty well at the time of the life of Jesus Christ.  It is also said that most historians believe Jesus was baptised by John the Baptist.

However, is there any mention of Christianity and Jesus in any of their primary sources from around the time?

I realise this was going on in a different area but the Romans occupied the Hellenes and Turkey.  I would have thought they would have mentioned this supposedly divine guy named Jesus in their writings?

JJLehto wrote: James wrote: A question I hope some scholarly folk maybe able to answer: We all know that the Romans documented their history pretty well at the time of the life of Jesus Christ.  It is also said that most historians believe Jesus was baptised by John the Baptist. However, is there any mention of Christianity and Jesus in any of their primary sources from around the time? I realise this was going on in a different area but the Romans occupied the Hellenes and Turkey.  I would have thought they would have mentioned this supposedly divine guy named Jesus in their writings? I may be wrong, I'm no expert... But I thought the Roman Empire DID have a listing for Jesus Christ, and all it said was he was executed at age 33 for being an enemy of the state.

Oh, that's interesting.  Could you mayhaps find a source for this?

James wrote: A question I hope some scholarly folk maybe able to answer: We all know that the Romans documented their history pretty well at the time of the life of Jesus Christ.  It is also said that most historians believe Jesus was baptised by John the Baptist. However, is there any mention of Christianity and Jesus in any of their primary sources from around the time? I realise this was going on in a different area but the Romans occupied the Hellenes and Turkey.  I would have thought they would have mentioned this supposedly divine guy named Jesus in their writings?

Realize that to the Romans, Jesus was relatively unimportant.  Also, to most Romans (there were a few exceptions early on), Jesus wasn't a "divine guy."  Pilate only had him crucified to appease the local population.

We do, however, have the insightful writings of Josephus, a Roman citizen, who not only made several mentions of Jesus, but also is a reliable source regarding the destruction of Jerusalem and Judaic culture at the time.

Since some of you are more educated on the matter, can someone tell me if this is correct.

My freshman year history teacher told us the Roman Empire did have a file, (I guess is the word) on Jesus Christ that said he was executed at the age of 33, for being an enemy of the state.

Anyone verify if this is true?

James wrote: Ah but surely some guy who called walk on water, convert water into wine and other such "miracles" would be noticed by Romans, whether he was favoured or not? So a guy who could do all that was relatively unimportant? Sings Shania Twain's "You Don't Impress Me Much" Henceforth, I think he was just some dude.  Nothing divine about him.

You forget that in the ancient world, such acts were not seen as so...out of the ordinary.  I mean come on- you're telling me the ancient Romans were geniuses in matters of modern science?  They had their own mythologies and legends with just as much bizarre occurrences taking place.  Also, the Old Testament is full of people raising the dead, healing the sick, and so forth.  Jesus wasn't the only one.

Remember- to the ancient people, a "miracle" wasn't so great because of what happened, but because of why it happened (Read Matthew chapter 9 in this context).

Epignosis wrote: James wrote: Ah but surely some guy who called walk on water, convert water into wine and other such "miracles" would be noticed by Romans, whether he was favoured or not? So a guy who could do all that was relatively unimportant? Sings Shania Twain's "You Don't Impress Me Much" Henceforth, I think he was just some dude.  Nothing divine about him. You forget that in the ancient world, such acts were not seen as so...out of the ordinary.  I mean come on- you're telling me the ancient Romans were geniuses in matters of modern science?  They had their own mythologies and legends with just as much bizarre occurrences taking place.  Also, the Old Testament is full of people raising the dead, healing the sick, and so forth.  Jesus wasn't the only one. Remember- to the ancient people, a "miracle" wasn't so great because of what happened, but because of why it happened (Read Matthew chapter 9 in this context).

But those Roman myths and legends were just that.  They were also ancient and much like the Bible has done, everything has been twisted from reality.

So for someone in their current time to perform such "miracles" is just silly.  Sure, he may well have been a healer of some kind (raising the immediate dead could be possible; it is now, for instance).

We don't see these miracles by anyone now (and yes, I realise they're not this divine guy named Jesus either) and nobody saw them back then either.  People have just written fictions based on him and some of the aspects of his life, just as the Romans and the Egyptians also did (although their own Deities are probably even more fictional and less likely based on real people -- in my opinion).

I don't think he wrote anything, personally.  Therefore what he told us was never put into writing.  What you read as his, was not his words at all.

That's how I see it anyhow.

And no, I have no proof and neither do you.