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Stargazer vs Achilles Last Stand
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Cristi View Drop Down
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Why not make it a poll?

I prefer Achilles. Stargazer is a bit overrated.


I don't think newbies can create polls.
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Derek50 View Drop Down
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Saperlipopette!
Please attach the poll. We will vote. Thank you very much.
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Achilles is the pinnacle...this is the peak of ZEPP. All 4 members gave it 100%. Page's guitar overdubs are simply superb. Nobody does that now. The song feels powerful, nerve. Jimmy's guitar cries and the solo just goes into the soul. A monumental composition...on the backbone of which Iron Maiden built their career.
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Points: 46985 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 02 2025 at 02:44
Originally posted by Derek50 Derek50 wrote:

Saperlipopette!
Please attach the poll. We will vote. Thank you very much.


That can't be done.
Also it seems polls can't be created in the Proto-Prog and Prog-Related Lounge, I forgot about that.    
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Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:

Outside of the song in question and Nobody's Fault But Mine, I don't think the songmaterial is particularly memorable. At times the band themselves sound uninspired. Fewer killer riffs makes a good chunk of the album largely forgettable for me as well. If this is a good example of unified sound, I'd rather have something less unified.


As much as I love Achilles Last Stand, the rest of Presence is frankly a huge disappointment. This album gets a free pass because Plant recorded his vocals sitting on a stool, recovering from an auto accident. I have a place in my heart for Hots on for Nowhere, but the rest of the album I can take or leave. In fact, I would even say that Candy Store Rock and Tea for One are some of the band's WORST material.

In Through the Out Door > Presence
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^ 'For Your Life' is a great little rocker, and 'Nobody's Fault but Mine' is one of their best blues tributes.   I think for longtime Zepheads, it is overall a very satisfying album as well as a fascinating break from their typical fare.
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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Originally posted by Steve Wyzard Steve Wyzard wrote:

Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:

Outside of the song in question and Nobody's Fault But Mine, I don't think the songmaterial is particularly memorable. At times the band themselves sound uninspired. Fewer killer riffs makes a good chunk of the album largely forgettable for me as well. If this is a good example of unified sound, I'd rather have something less unified.


As much as I love Achilles Last Stand, the rest of Presence is frankly a huge disappointment. This album gets a free pass because Plant recorded his vocals sitting on a stool, recovering from an auto accident. I have a place in my heart for Hots on for Nowhere, but the rest of the album I can take or leave. In fact, I would even say that Candy Store Rock and Tea for One are some of the band's WORST material.

In Through the Out Door > Presence


They're both pretty bad, IMHO, but Presence has at least three tracks I can like (Out Door doesn't): I kind of like Tea For Ne, Achilles is good, but drags on for 3 or 4 minutes too long. Nobody's Fault But Mine is definitely my fave on that album.

It doesn't help that the Hypgnosis artwork is horrendous. Clearly in the line of the awesome Floyd's WYWH (with the 4 elements) and Bad Co's Desolation Angels (I think Zep turned down both projects).


But then again, I didn't like much Graffiti either.
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Why not make it a poll?


He explained why he can't yet.

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Stargazer is a bit overrated.


Blasphemy.

P.S. LZ is overrated.
eBay
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Saperlipopette! View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Sean Trane Sean Trane wrote:

But then again, I didn't like much Graffiti either.
If only I was around so they could have asked me for advice, we would have known Physical Grafitti as this 1 LP classic instead:

A1 Ten Years Gone
A2 Trampled Under Foot
A3 Bron-yr-Aur
A4 In the Light

23:06

B1 Kashmir
B2 Down by the Seaside
B3 In My Time of Dying

25:05

-for me that would have been pretty much perfect (but maybe it would be better to kick things off with Trampled).
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^ Nonsense, you've eliminated some of their best material---   Custard Pie, Wanton Song, Nightflight, Houses of the Holy, Black Country Woman... even In my Time is good if a bit maudlin.

Phys Graf is really a Blues record with some synth stuff thrown in.   But as it was recorded mostly in the Stones' mobile studio and has a ton of harmonica and craggy guitar, this was a very bluesy LP.   You can almost hear the pops & cracks of an ancient bluesman's vinyl record revolving on an old turntable.




Edited by Atavachron - July 02 2025 at 15:56
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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Love "The Rover" too.
It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood...Road Rage Edition
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Saperlipopette! View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

^ Nonsense, you've eliminated some of their best material---   Custard Pie, Wanton Song, Nightflight, Houses of the Holy, Black Country Woman... even In my Time is good if a bit maudlin.

Phys Graf is really a Blues record with some synth stuff thrown in.   But as it was recorded mostly in the Stones' mobile studio and has a ton of harmonica and craggy guitar, this was a very bluesy LP.   You can almost hear the pops & cracks of an ancient bluesman's vinyl record revolving on an old turntable.
Sure, nonsense to you. I didn't think you'd all agree, and no one will agree 100%. You obviously enjoy that bluesy style more than I do. That said, I mostly like those songs you mention as well. But not as much as the 48 minutes I selected for my version. Those are the essentials for me. I gave myself the challenge of making imo bloated double album into a 1 LP (just for fun), so there's simply no more space left. I would have played those two sides a lot more than I bother with all of the actual album's four sides. It's not so much that I struggle with the specific songs, but I don't think the material in total is strong enough to keep me interested for 85 minutes. Side four in particular feel like basic Led Zep tunes, that I've heard done better on earlier albums. Not terrible, not terribly interesting.

...I love In My Time... and that's why I included it.

Edit: Yes, a lot of it

Edited by Saperlipopette! - July 03 2025 at 02:58
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Derek50 View Drop Down
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Friends... but to me Achilles never seemed drawn out. These 10 minutes fly by in a flash. And in general Presence is somehow underestimated. Tea for one is the greatest blues of Page and is only slightly inferior to Sins))
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The discussion has died down, or are there not enough Richie fans on the forum?)))
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Originally posted by Derek50 Derek50 wrote:

The discussion has died down, or are there not enough Richie fans on the forum?)))
I don't think that's the issue really. A poll was made and Stargazer leads quite comfortably 9-4. But what more is there to discuss any further? For most what slice of music that speaks to you the most, is intuitive and primarely non-verbal. Stargazer hits me differently than Achilles. It just does. I'm not sure I actually want to know exactly why this is. I feel it in my gut. That's good enough for me. It doesn't take anything away from the latter track - which is still great (amazing, really) for what it is.   
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