Why did you reject Within Temptation? |
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NaughtyShrink
Forum Newbie Joined: November 21 2009 Status: Offline Points: 10 |
Posted: November 21 2009 at 10:50 | |
That isn't the reason why I was acting a little rude, it's to be noticed. To use your own words, think about it: Who mostly gets what they want in the world? Those who whines the most and loudest. You want examples? Check the politics, every single case there is an outcome of this psychological factor. |
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UMUR
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 19 2007 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 3012 |
Posted: November 21 2009 at 10:51 | |
Iīm a bit losfer words here. . Well Iīll say one thing. A simple please might do the trick ( and some arguments why you feel Within Tempation should be regarded as a progressive act). Calling the team ignorent and imcompetent wonīt help much. Now you got the silk hand from me. Iīm not sure other members of the team will be as forgiving.
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NaughtyShrink
Forum Newbie Joined: November 21 2009 Status: Offline Points: 10 |
Posted: November 21 2009 at 10:51 | |
Toto were never very progressive... Although neither are Nightwish or Mew... Whatever.
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Easy Livin
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: February 21 2004 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 15585 |
Posted: November 21 2009 at 10:54 | |
I'll close this thread to let things cool off meanwhile. PM me if anyone wants it re-opened.
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Pekka
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 03 2006 Location: Espoo, Finland Status: Offline Points: 6442 |
Posted: November 21 2009 at 11:03 | |
Imagine if the team votes went 5-5 when deciding the band's eligibility and they had to make a final decision. Now would they think "oh let's take them in because that one dude was so admirably persistent" or "let's not take them, if only to annoy that one whiny loudmouth ass"? This is just a hypothetical situation with no contact with this case or the people involved. |
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Finnforest
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 03 2007 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 16913 |
Posted: November 21 2009 at 11:05 | |
Certainly some truth to that, but you're going to find PA to be an exception, I predict. If you are respectful and make a solid case (which we're still waiting for), you'll be heard. If you want to go down the muddy road, you'll get no where fast. I sense you could go either way here. Make the right choice |
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Logan
Forum & Site Admin Group Site Admin Joined: April 05 2006 Location: Vancouver, BC Status: Offline Points: 33095 |
Posted: November 21 2009 at 11:05 | |
I've never been involved with the Prog Metal team, but it's commonly not that simple for teams. Progfreak provides a record of votes, but team members commonly discuss and debate potential additions before recording their votes at progfreak. Something to bear in mind, though, is that team members often do not have access to all the musical material and it is not that uncommon for bands to be re-evaluated (but there are so many evaluations and so much work being done such as preparing additions that being asked to re-evaluate can be onerous and, well, not a joyful task). A team like Prog Metal deals with a lot of proposals, and does a lot of work for the site, and obviously don't have unlimited funds to buy albums or unlimited time to listen to albums (it's voluntary work and can be both very time-consuming and expensive for the individuals). It's saddening that people don't appreciate the time and effort people put into this. They gain nothing personal from having an album added or excluded, but try to do their best for the site and community. |
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Just a music fan passing through trying to fill some void. Various music I am into now: a youtube playlist
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npjnpj
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 05 2007 Location: Germany Status: Offline Points: 2720 |
Posted: November 23 2009 at 07:22 | |
The 'Prog Related' genre is misnamed anyway and should be renamed to 'Stuff not even remotely Prog but some of us like it anyway, so there!'.
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UMUR
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 19 2007 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 3012 |
Posted: November 23 2009 at 08:05 | |
I think thatīs a slightly disrespectful way of putting it, but the prog-related definition should probably point out that the genre is only for artists that have been greatly influential on progressive rock. Not for artists who are slightly influenced by progressive rock or have some lose relation to progressive rock.
The below lines are copy/ pasted directly from the definition:
- Without being 100% Prog, received clear MUSICAL influence of this genre, AND
- Are widely accepted as MUSICALLY influential to the development of Progressive Rock by the community, AND - Blend characteristics of Progressive Rock with mainstream elements creating a final product that despite not being part of the genre is evident that are close to Prog. If I were to decide I would delete the first and the second point and only keep the middle one. That way no one would misunderstand that Prog-related is only for artists who have been musically influential on progressive rock. This is just my opinion of course. Feel free to form your own. If my interpretation is the interpretation that is generally considered ( by the admins who control the Prog-related sub) the correct one those changes to the definition would be greatly appreciated. Itīs the most common conclusion people come to when the artists they suggest are rejected in another genre. If I canīt get my artist included in this or that sub Iīll suggest them for Prog-related. People should be left with no doubt of what Prog-related means. The definition is a bit vague as it is now and prone to a lot of misunderstanding and even worse a lot of frustration. Personally I donīt see why an act such as Within Temptation should be considered for the Prog-related genre. They havenīt been influential on the progressive rock/ metal genre. They are a symphonic metal/ rock act that might or might not qualify for the progressive metal sub, but calling them influential on the progressive rock/ metal genre wouldnīt be my choice of words. |
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JLocke
Prog Reviewer Joined: November 18 2007 Status: Offline Points: 4900 |
Posted: November 23 2009 at 11:00 | |
''Why did you reject Within Temptation?''
Well, because we listened to them, and decided that they weren't fit for this site. Simple enough explanation? Now I'm just waiting for the ''Why did you reject Toto'' thread to show up next. Hey, this method of complaining repeatedly worked to get Metallica added, so why not? Actually, I don't mind Metallica being here, so obviously I'm joking around. |
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MontrealRick
Forum Newbie Joined: July 26 2009 Location: Montreal Status: Offline Points: 10 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 11:34 | |
I think a new vote is in order.
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Long live Prog!!!
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Marty McFly
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 23 2009 Location: Czech Republic Status: Offline Points: 3968 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 11:49 | |
Nooooooooooooo
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There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless,"
-Andyman1125 on Lulu Even my |
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Dean
Special Collaborator Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 11:56 | |
There has to be a justifiable reason for re-evaluating a band, normally through new material being available. Simply insisting on a re-vote until a pass is achieved is not going to work. Also, since this band has previously been rejected they now qualify as a "Controversial Band" which means that any subsequent vote by the PMT has to be unanimous (ie all active members must vote and all must vote "yes" for them to be accepted).
Edited by Dean - January 17 2010 at 11:57 |
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What?
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MontrealRick
Forum Newbie Joined: July 26 2009 Location: Montreal Status: Offline Points: 10 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 12:06 | |
I see...too contraversial for my taste.
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Long live Prog!!!
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Dean
Special Collaborator Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 12:08 | |
^ I don't see how "your taste" has anything to do with it
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What?
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Windhawk
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: December 28 2006 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 11400 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 12:36 | |
Well, when my pal MontrealRick thinks the decision merits rethinking I'm more apt to listen to him than many others with similar issues.
Someone who's been as active in the world of prog for so many years as he has kinda tends to get my attention when speaking up ;-) That is a personal point of view though. |
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Websites I work with:
http://www.progressor.net http://www.houseofprog.com My profile on Mixcloud: https://www.mixcloud.com/haukevind/ |
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Dean
Special Collaborator Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 12:41 | |
^ that isn't what I meant Olav.
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What?
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Raff
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 29 2005 Location: None Status: Offline Points: 24392 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 13:57 | |
I don't know Within Temptation unless for one or two songs, and am not too fond of those female-fronted, symphonic metal bands (regardless of whether they are prog or not - just a question of personal taste). However, I'd like to point out that they are featured in # 4 of Classic Rock presents Prog (a magazine that seems to have been quite successful, seen as has already reached # 5, and is set to continue), as well as on other prog websites (DPRP and Sea of Tranquility come to mind).
As I wrote last week somewhere in the CZ, people who like prog use more than one resource (I know I do), and they're bound to see bands elsewhere that are not featured here, and wonder. However, with the so many controversial additions we have had over the years, we cannot claim this is due to a purist approach to prog - therefore, we might end up coming across as a 'neither fish nor fowl' kind of thing, and lose a lot of our hard-won credibility. Just my two cents... |
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micky
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46828 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 14:04 | |
sort of makes the 'archive' in the site name look stupid doesn't it.... for all the fear of driving people away with 'dubious' additions... the site should REALLY fear driving people away for what doesn't get added.... and being a joke of a site at that. The list is growing of 'recognized' prog bands that this site has not.. or will not add.
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The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
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Windhawk
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: December 28 2006 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 11400 |
Posted: January 17 2010 at 14:09 | |
No disrespect intended Dean, I guess I should have considered my phrasing better in this matter.
I apologize. |
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Websites I work with:
http://www.progressor.net http://www.houseofprog.com My profile on Mixcloud: https://www.mixcloud.com/haukevind/ |
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