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Overrated Masterpieces?
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Poll Question: Which of these do you feel may be a bit overrated?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
14 [14.43%]
31 [31.96%]
12 [12.37%]
16 [16.49%]
24 [24.74%]
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cstack3 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

ITCOTCK and SEBTP both have less than stellar moments but relative to the others DSOTM takes the cake for being by far the most over rated.

Aye.  I agree.  DSOTM is a very fine album, but I feel it is far overrated.  I prefer their prior album "Meddle."
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Originally posted by Upbeat Tango Monday Upbeat Tango Monday wrote:

Originally posted by flyingveepixie flyingveepixie wrote:

I don't think any of the albums mentioned here are particularly overrated, in fact CTTE and Selling England are two of my all time favourites.  It's all just a matter of opinion...

Personally I can't stand any of Steven Wilsons music and I think he's a great big fraud but everyone else seems to think he's some kind of god and he's not mentioned here anyway so I can't vote for him, and probably no one would agree with me anyway......all just opinion innit....



Nah, you are not alone. I think Wilson is a hack as well. Every single one of his albums is calculated and robotic, he lacks passion, musicianship and the ability to create something organic. Anyway, I'm glad he's not in the poll since I wouldn't put him near these great artists.

I am also not into Wilson or Porcupine Tree at all (also not into most prog after seventies). But I can understand why some people´s love them.
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Dark Side of the Moon. Yes, I like it, but it’s much overrated. And it’s leading to the poll. I took a bit of flack for claiming DSoTM was overrated in another thread. Where were you all then?
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It is also my opinion that Thick as a Brick drags on a bit too long at certain parts, so it's my choice. DSOTM comes second. Anyway I love all of them and think their fame is well deserved, as many said here. I'd rather call stuff such as Kansas, Neo-Prog, Canterbury and some more recent bands overrated, even considering they didn't receive the same praise.

And since we're talking about the exemplar prog works I guess we could've included something from ELP aswell, just to see how it went? 
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A toss up between CTTE and ITCOTCK for me; simply because I find the others far more rewarding to listen to..
I voted CTTE
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Originally posted by Shrek the Progre Shrek the Progre wrote:

It is also my opinion that Thick as a Brick drags on a bit too long at certain parts, so it's my choice. DSOTM comes second. Anyway I love all of them and think their fame is well deserved, as many said here. I'd rather call stuff such as Kansas, Neo-Prog, Canterbury and some more recent bands overrated, even considering they didn't receive the same praise.

And since we're talking about the exemplar prog works I guess we could've included something from ELP aswell, just to see how it went? 

So there is prog you like?
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Originally posted by Mortte Mortte wrote:

Originally posted by Shrek the Progre Shrek the Progre wrote:

It is also my opinion that Thick as a Brick drags on a bit too long at certain parts, so it's my choice. DSOTM comes second. Anyway I love all of them and think their fame is well deserved, as many said here. I'd rather call stuff such as Kansas, Neo-Prog, Canterbury and some more recent bands overrated, even considering they didn't receive the same praise.

And since we're talking about the exemplar prog works I guess we could've included something from ELP aswell, just to see how it went? 

So there is prog you like?


Yes plenty, but it is my opinion that their music refers too much to classic prog albums and doesnt compensate that fact with superior musicianship. That said I might have my issues with 80s music and everything that resembles it...

Anyway, it could be thay im just too much into more recent prog and havent given enough listens to post-golden era works.
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I voted for Dark Side. It is a brilliantly engineered album. But I only like Any Colour...However the other picks are all far far superior. And anybody who claims to like symphonic prog but doesn't like The Raven....is a complete fraud IMO...
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Originally posted by Shrek the Progre Shrek the Progre wrote:

Originally posted by Mortte Mortte wrote:

Originally posted by Shrek the Progre Shrek the Progre wrote:

It is also my opinion that Thick as a Brick drags on a bit too long at certain parts, so it's my choice. DSOTM comes second. Anyway I love all of them and think their fame is well deserved, as many said here. I'd rather call stuff such as Kansas, Neo-Prog, Canterbury and some more recent bands overrated, even considering they didn't receive the same praise.

And since we're talking about the exemplar prog works I guess we could've included something from ELP aswell, just to see how it went? 

So there is prog you like?


Yes plenty, but it is my opinion that their music refers too much to classic prog albums and doesnt compensate that fact with superior musicianship. That said I might have my issues with 80s music and everything that resembles it...

Anyway, it could be thay im just too much into more recent prog and havent given enough listens to post-golden era works.
Well, I think there has made some great music in the eighties, also after that, but not that much in prog...but we just have so different tastes. My favourite music commonly is mostly made in the 60-70ties.
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I went for Thick as a Brick.    Does nothing for me, wheras I like all the others
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^ I always felt that album by Tull was overrated also......the first 6 minutes are a nice prog track ...after that the album basically repeats the same theme and music. Tull was far far better at the mid-length proggy rock folk track where Anderson 's biting lyrics explored a single thought/idea per song. Albums like Stand Up, Benefit, and Aqualung are far better musical and lyrical statements imho.
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^ Agreed. Thick as a Brick has some nice moments but it does drag out way too much. I find it really hard to sit through the whole album. 
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^ last three posts
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Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

I'd say that all of these in all probability have been both overrated and underrated by some individuals (claims made that are untrue, improbable or lacking evidence). The most compelling case in this thread for being overrated is for In the Court of the Crimson King (common claims that it surely was the first true Prog album), but I will abstain from voting. The album I least like of these is Close to the Edge, but to me, whether one likes it or doesn't shouldn't be a deciding factor, but instead it should depend on objective evidence and sound arguments for people overrating it (dubious or questionable claims to greatness or outright wrongness made out of ignorance).

I think that too many individuals claim that other people hold something in too high esteem just because said individuals don't appreciate it -- that not only often tends to show a lack of perspective and nuanced thinking, but also a lack of humility.

 

What Logan says here just about covers my thoughts on this. All these lps are in my collection, all have a place in my head and heart but none are in my top 20 favourites and all have their flaws in my view.

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Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Albums like Stand Up, Benefit, and Aqualung are far better musical and lyrical statements imho.

amen brother.. that was when Tull was a band.. not a Ian Anderson solo/ego trip.... I was surprised.. then again not surprised to read Steve Howe turned down the Tull gig when told he was merely to play.. no songs.. ie very limited creative input
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Originally posted by Argo2112 Argo2112 wrote:

^ Agreed. Thick as a Brick has some nice moments but it does drag out way too much. I find it really hard to sit through the whole album. 


I do enjoy the album, but indeed it drags on in some places. That's why I love so much better the live version of the song on Live Bursting Out... much more consistent, and it's got just about the best of the song.
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I am repeating myself, but Thick really doesn´t drag me at all, not although I heard it first time already in the eighties, still always when I listened it, it´s full pleasure to me from the beginning to end. Ian´s egotrip or not, it´s anyway masterpiece and the best Tull-album, there is nothing bland as there is in that Yes-albums first side of the same year. To me it seems somebodies who says opinions about it have listened it last time 1972, it really doesn´t repeat it themes, there are just lots great, sad melodic themes that many progbands (specially the most of new bands) should learn about.

I think I am not going to waste my time in this place a lot anymore that seems to become sh*tethrowing club of masterpieces.
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Originally posted by Mortte Mortte wrote:

I am repeating myself, but Thick really doesn´t drag me at all, not although I heard it first time already in the eighties, still always when I listened it, it´s full pleasure to me from the beginning to end. Ian´s egotrip or not, it´s anyway masterpiece and the best Tull-album, there is nothing bland as there is in that Yes-albums first side of the same year. To me it seems somebodies who says opinions about it have listened it last time 1972, it really doesn´t repeat it themes, there are just lots great, sad melodic themes that many progbands (specially the most of new bands) should learn about.

I think I am not going to waste my time in this place a lot anymore that seems to become sh*tethrowing club of masterpieces.


I wouldn't get that upset Mortte; I too post very little to the forum these days because of the sh*tethrowing... TAAB doesn't drag to these ears....I'm still finding bits in it that still raise the hair on the back of my neck some 46 years after first hearing it. And side 2 is just as good as side 1; IMHO. .....Do you believe in the day?!                I do
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Overrated? I don't know. now, over exposed and/or over played? That's a whole different discussion. 
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Originally posted by Mortte Mortte wrote:

Originally posted by Upbeat Tango Monday Upbeat Tango Monday wrote:

Originally posted by flyingveepixie flyingveepixie wrote:

I don't think any of the albums mentioned here are particularly overrated, in fact CTTE and Selling England are two of my all time favourites.  It's all just a matter of opinion...

Personally I can't stand any of Steven Wilsons music and I think he's a great big fraud but everyone else seems to think he's some kind of god and he's not mentioned here anyway so I can't vote for him, and probably no one would agree with me anyway......all just opinion innit....



Nah, you are not alone. I think Wilson is a hack as well. Every single one of his albums is calculated and robotic, he lacks passion, musicianship and the ability to create something organic. Anyway, I'm glad he's not in the poll since I wouldn't put him near these great artists.

I am also not into Wilson or Porcupine Tree at all (also not into most prog after seventies). But I can understand why some people´s love them.



When I listen to music I use simple criteria. Those include, do I like the song? Does it appeal to me? Do I "connect" with it in some way? If any or all of those are true, then I like the song. It doesn't matter if it's prog, pop, jazz, classical, etc, etc. What it comes down to is, if I like it, I like it. I try not to get bogged down by who is or is not a hack or derivative or lacking in passion. If I like the song, I like it. Simple as that. I think that some prog fans (although this is not exclusive to prog fans) are over serious snobs with a large stick up their asses, who use justifications based on said snobbery to look down their noses at certain artists, or certain types of music. I know. I used to be one of those. In some ways, I still am. Even now I can't abide rap/hip hip and country, although there are a handful of songs from both of those genres that I do enjoy, but only a handful.  I also can't imagine limiting myself to only 70s prog. There is a ton of wonderful stuff out there just waiting to be discovered. Expand your horizons. You might be surprised.


Edited by Jeffro - October 05 2018 at 05:46
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