To which age group do youse belong? |
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Archisorcerus
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 02 2022 Location: Izmir Status: Offline Points: 2520 |
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Megistus
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 25 2023 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 111 |
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OK... so I'm new here and don't want to bump heads with anyone, but for my tuppence-worth, I think it is very relevant what age "spread" we have on this forum.
Undoubtedly, there was a "golden age" of prog so that would mean a likely bias towards those who lived through it... but equally interesting is how many younger people will always search for something a bit different in their musical tastes, whatever era they live in. For me, the afore-mentioned PT and JT happen to be two of my favourite bands -- for differing reasons, but it's certainly true that I got into PT because of the era I was coming of age in (mid-90s). I'm not sure I can get on board with the idea that "true" prog fans should roll their eyes at the likes of the more commercially successful prog bands. I'm sure there are numerous threads debating the issue of "what is prog anyway?".. some people might think it has something to do with highly complicated chord progressions, but for me it's about "surprises", something you never imagined or even thought possible coming out of your speakers. That's why the word progressive can be attached to any genre, and I think certain sorts of people of all ages will always look for that. Possibly bands like the above have reached the point where they either can't or won't dare to surprise anyone, and maybe that's them protecting their commercial interests. But then there's always something new to find out there... and forums like this are a huge help.
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Jared
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 06 2005 Location: Hereford, UK Status: Offline Points: 17688 |
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^^^ that's a great post David, a warm welcome to the forum....
I agree very much with your last sentence; you can hardly expect Ian Anderson to go pushing the envelope at his time of life; indeed most of the big beasts of the 70's haven't done so in more years than I can count. SW continues to do so, although he may not choose to via PT, which is why he has several vehicles through which to express himself artistically. I very much like the idea of 'surprises'... I'll look forward to hearing my next one through a speaker near me, very soon...
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Nogbad_The_Bad
Forum & Site Admin Group RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Offline Points: 20320 |
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Welcome aboard, apologies if we seem a little testy in this thread, nothing wrong at all your premise posted.
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 16456 |
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Hi, I don't dislike SW ... and I have all the PT material all the way to the end, except this new album, that I don't think is worth buying, mostly because I am retired and on a fixed income and stuff that has all the shine in the world and nothing else, just isn't my preference. I do think, that SW is a bit over rated, but that's not a big deal ... many don't care for him or PT either. He does have some studio skills, but I think that when he concentrates on that, his own music (and consequently PT's) end up suffering. That's just a feeling ... sadly I was not impressed with the last PT album ... heck, the SW "HCE" is far better and more "centered" even in terms of the studio work done to it. I do not dislike Alan Parsons, and I have the first 5 albums. The only thing I do not care for is that he did something to a band, and then his own band, that was not new ... EXCEPT to rock music, that had not really done a whole lot since Tom Dowd and George Martin (and others) ... and all of a sudden, it seems like Alan Parsons invented sliced bread! He, basically, did to a rock band EXACTLY the same thing that was being done to the best orchestras the world over ... but since we, here, don't give a damn about classical music a whole lot, and don't listen to much of it, it's difficult to say something without getting everyone's feathers all shook up ... if one studies the studio work done to orchestras for the last 75 years, one learns quickly that rock music was a good 20 years behind ... possibly more ...
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 16456 |
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Hi, They know who they are, and above all, they don't spend their time making hacker comments about a lot of stuff ... it that's how you show your class as an Admin ... politeness is not even a choice ... not to mention the "pride" that some folks hide under which makes them feel superior, Admin or not. I do NOT write anything as a matter of pride, as it is about the ART itself ... not your comments, or anyone else's. Let's just say that we should be gentlemen and agree to disagree.
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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Jared
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 06 2005 Location: Hereford, UK Status: Offline Points: 17688 |
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Well, there is something we have in common. I also have all the PT material except the new one, which didn't grab me sufficiently to purchase the disk. I probably will in time, but I have been enjoying going back over a raft of 70's stuff recently, which I either haven't listened to in years or in a few cases, am listening to for the first time. When someone reaches the profile level of SW, there is almost an inevitability that two things will happen. The first is the 'over-rated/underrated' debate ensues; usually those within the prog sphere will say the former while others who have discovered him more recently and die hard fans will claim the latter... this all requires a degree of perspective and ultimately as you say, it's neither here nor there. The other, you alluded to in your previous post, which is the extent to which he is pushing boundaries these days and hence being truly 'progressive'. There are very few artists who can genuinely continue to create new sounds throughout their musical careers; as we know, most of the prog giants were truly innovative for a period of time during their 20's and early 30's, before settling into to something more predictable. In this regard, SW has been more 'prog' than most, but no-one is an unquenchable font of new musical form and new ideas do slow down, the more established an artist becomes. Maybe his slowing down includes remixing a raft of prog classics; in which case he is still providing us with an invaluable service. Sadly, I think where you have ruffled some feathers in this debate is your offhand dismissal of PT & JT as 'entry level' prog artists who have too many threads dedicated to them, when in your view they are no longer creating enough new ideas to warrant them? I'm sorry you are of that opinion if that is the case....
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Greenmist
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 10 2020 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 294 |
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Im in catagory D
But never got into prog music until my 30s Edited by Greenmist - January 26 2023 at 13:03 |
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Progishness
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 10 2020 Location: Planet Rhubarb Status: Offline Points: 2565 |
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Yep and to spout utter twaddle belittling everyone else's comments with his musings and turning every conversation round to his pet subject, i.e relating everything to what may or may not have been played on American FM radio decades ago.
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"We're going to need a bigger swear jar."
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AFlowerKingCrimson
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 02 2016 Location: Philly burbs Status: Offline Points: 16548 |
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I'm curious how you found out about the lesser known or obscure prog in the late 80s. There was no internet (as we now know it) so I'm just curious. For me it was from reading rock books then accidentally finding catalogs in catalogs so kind of an indirect discovery.
Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - January 26 2023 at 18:58 |
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TonyAMO
Forum Newbie Joined: September 19 2020 Location: South Gate Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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b. 21
got into prog when i was 18 i think |
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rik wilson
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 28 2021 Location: MATTHEWS,N.C. Status: Offline Points: 591 |
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From Mersybeat; psychedelic; Detroit metal ; glam ; 60's fusion ; Berlin school ; all these influences combined ,amalgamated, and saturated my psyche into progressive rock ( it was not a genre in my world but everything pointed in that direction over the years and adapted the prog term. I'm seventy two and I love the music that became known as prog. I play prog still and wish to be the best little prog freak I can be. After all when the Beatles began to introduce strings and mellotron I WAS HOOKED.
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Cosmiclawnmower
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 09 2010 Location: West Country,UK Status: Offline Points: 3082 |
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E, 59, only an amateur bass/guitar player (a pretty rubbish one ). Got into progressive music alongside psych, space rock, some metal and alternative punk, Reggae and folk from early teens onwards, crewing for local bands and going to lots of free festivals. My tastes are still very wide and diverse and ive often had some stick for this though most of my muso mates at the time were equally eclectic in their tastes.
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The Dark Elf
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: February 01 2011 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 12788 |
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Re-read the asinine comment you just typed. Re-read it as many times as necessary until you realize what a pompous tw*t you are. You are under some demented delusion (that gets worse as you start sundowning later in the day) that your insults are somehow important. That they are not arrogantly prideful. That they are about "ART". However, you are continually disemboguing patrician prattle regarding how your artsy-fartsy family had a library that rivalled Alexandria before it burned. And then you regurgitate the 3 or 4 bands you think are superior (Guru Guru, Djam Karet, et cetera, ad nauseam, blah-blah-blah), and then you make lame analogies to theater that don't apply, and opine about broken down radio stations from the 1960s that are no longer applicable to any current discussion about prog. Shut the front door, grandpa, and go take your meds. |
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Archisorcerus
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 02 2022 Location: Izmir Status: Offline Points: 2520 |
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See below, The Dark Elf. How I take pride in being "the most active" person of the forum on movie threads. And how humbly the creature you're talking to solely talks about "ART". BTW, my statement about having been the most active member of the forum concerning movie threads was an objective truth. And the whole context of that discussion had nothing to do with rodomontade for my part. Yet, I don't expect an utterly egocentric robot to be able to get that.
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Archisorcerus
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 02 2022 Location: Izmir Status: Offline Points: 2520 |
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Oh and, I wasn't even talking to that entity. I was saying that objective truth to SeanTrane just for clarification, and to make my point thereafter.
Edited by Archisorcerus - January 28 2023 at 01:37 |
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Archisorcerus
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 02 2022 Location: Izmir Status: Offline Points: 2520 |
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That programmed robot can even be triggered by the word "active" and see it as "pride". Lol. Poorly coded... Ludicrously, even.
Edited by Archisorcerus - January 28 2023 at 02:45 |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 16456 |
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Hi, I have mixed feelings about what I said, but mostly, it might just be that SW has been listening to too much other stuff and working it, to the point, where he can not listen to himself enough ... as it might get influenced by something else he heard. As a writer, and artist, I imagine that you have to listen to YOURSELF first and then apply it, and I keep thinking that this is not happening ... but yeah, it might just be a thought, however, not how I work or write at all. I, rarely, depend on anyone else, or anything else, since all I write happens in my dreams and visions, and I merely try to write down that "movie" quickly before it goes away ... can hardly change it, since it won't be the same, but that's what I "see" and work from. I know many other writers that have agreed with me on this, and both Daevid Allen and Gilly Smith, were the first to agree that really helped, and he joked that I might be trying to steal Burroughs work ... "hardly" said I!
I tend to look at the whole catalog, not just this piece "compared" to the other piece. However, a person is a person, so seeing the "same thing" is normal, but when I look at my favorite artists, writers and film makers, they rarely repeat themselves and are continuously finding new things to play with and work with ... I go back to Bunuel, Godard. Gilliam, Huxley, Picasso, Stravinsky ... and of the rock folks, someone like Peter Hammill, that might still sound the same, but hearing his recent live performance ... wow ... I wanna see that ... NOW! I think there is a certain INTERNAL side that is being given a flow, and that is the part we "don't understand" and it happens to be one part that inspires us the most. I'm not that "extreme" in terms of some of the things those folks have written and done but I think I can see how it takes place ... on the other hand I like to bring up the opening of Fellini's INTERVISTA, and tell folks that many times I am that kid taking a pee in the river! That in itself has nothing to do with everything else around him ... the kid had to take a pee, and if you have kids you have seen similar many times, and yet ... we look at it ... and get upset of the complete image. I don't write for "meaning" ... I'm too embarrassed to do so, since I can hardly explain my own ideas clearly as it is, so I let the visual do the work ... if there is "meaning" so be it, if not, then so be it. But, in my days with the YGDRASIL JOURNAL OF POETIC ARTS, a lot of the poems I wrote were like film and visuals for me ... not quite the word pounding (and rhymes!) that many think makes poetry ... and to me this is where rock music has failed. "Singing" has become more important than the "poetry" ... and that means that the words themselves are not important, so taking a SW or IA as examples, at times, just don't feel quite as true to their source for me anymore, and their words are more a personal feeling then they are something of stature and depth. It's difficult to say ... but this is the best I can explain it. Of the "old" folks, the only ones that still have it are Peter Hammill, Fish, on a blue moon day Bob Dylan, Kate Bush and the lady from that one crazy band in the east that also screams, sings, and talks ... and punches the music really well ... in their case, FOR ME, they DEFINE THE MUSIC by their words, instead of the music and beat defining the lyrics. It makes for VASTLY different music.
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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mellotronwave
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 30 2021 Location: Belgium Status: Offline Points: 7702 |
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I youse to be over 60 :-)
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JamWalk
Forum Newbie Joined: October 07 2020 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 38 |
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C
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