what was your benefit from being a PA member ! - Progressive Rock Music Forum

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Slartibartfast View Drop Down

Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam

Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
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Points: 29625

Posted: December 14 2011 at 06:27

Moogtron III wrote:

I did find some music here too

Sorry, but that's not allowed.

Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

OT Räihälä View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: August 09 2005
Location: Finland
Status: Offline
Points: 514

Posted: December 14 2011 at 09:24

ExittheLemming wrote:

^ I think your reviews are very honest but seldom support your judgements e.g. you describe Pink Floyd (Animals) in particular and Black Sabbath in general as both being pretentious without really saying why. You have nailed many of the flaws in Crimson's Islands very succinctly and although your views on Sgt Pepper are refreshingly irreverent you appear to dismiss the album because it is NOT Prog - Proto Prog has never been, is not and never will be considered a fully fledged Prog sub genre.

Goodness me, someone's really read those reviews! Confused

I can't remember now what I was thinking in particular when I wrote that Black Sabbath was more pretentious than Uriah Heep in the early 70's, but I think that I made myself very clear, why I think WYWH and Animals feel to me pretentious. That is, compared with earlier Floyd albums, because I don't find any kind of pretentiousness on DSOTM and/or Meddle and the earlier records.

What comes to Sgt Pepper, I personally find it less interesting as music than the other Beatles records between 1965 and 1969 (Revolver and Abbey Road form the pinnacle of their output; five star records independent whether they are prog or not). Sgt Pepper is closer to conceptual art, and its value lies in its cultural significance, rather than in good compositions - but that's just my opinion. I don't consider the album prog enough to be evaluated along the same lines as i.e. my other great favourite, Gentle Giant, and as I wrote, that nipped away one star. And I'm a huge Beatles fan! Only night before yesterday I was singing along with Sir Paul (and 15 thousand others) in the Hartwall Areena concert. Smile

Composer - Click to listen to my works!

ExittheLemming View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11415

Posted: December 14 2011 at 10:16

Yep, I read a lot of reviews and I think your's are good but you don't put enough flesh on the bones to support your ideas (many of which I actually agree with) I wasn't having a go at you but just reciprocating your honesty. I admit that Floyd ain't a big Lemming favourite (post Syd that is) but I honestly couldn't consider Water's lyrics pretentious in the slightest (in fact I'd agree that DSOTM has the least pretentious, most secular and unnervingly human lyrics of ANY popular music album full stop) Sgt Pepper is for me Pop's sacred cow and as much as I enjoy most of it would endorse your greater affection for Revolver and Abbey Road (Rubber Soul trumps it as well in my book)

rogerthat

Prog Reviewer

Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869

Posted: December 15 2011 at 00:41

If I may...I just had a read through some of your reviews @ OT. And when you call certain music pretentious, it would make it more informative if you could qualify what it is that makes it pretentious to you. I agree with ExittheLemming that I have never thought of Floyd as pretentious. They were rather matter of fact, if anything, and Waters's lyrics are less poetry and more bald expressions of a young man's feelings about the world...perhaps that is why they appeal to so many listeners, I don't know. While I am not so harsh on WYWH, I get what you are saying and it is less inspired coming on the heels of DSOTM. But it is only poor execution, not really Floyd pretending to do what they were not capable of...on the contrary, they were capable of much better things.

And as between Sabbath and UH, it was definitely the latter I considered pretentious, especially with that unwieldy vibrato of Byron. Sabbath always seemed to be just wanting to have some fun with their music and the Heepsters seemed to do a bad job of appearing serious. That is of course just my opinion but maybe a little more elaboration would help.

Moogtron III View Drop Down

Prog Reviewer

Joined: April 26 2005
Location: Belgium
Status: Offline
Points: 10616

Posted: December 15 2011 at 02:23

Slartibartfast wrote:

Moogtron III wrote:

I did find some music here too

Sorry, but that's not allowed.

No, of course not. On a music site the last thing you ought to do is do some musical discoveries Confused

Your sense of humour is going down, Bartman Sleepy

OT Räihälä View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: August 09 2005
Location: Finland
Status: Offline
Points: 514

Posted: December 15 2011 at 08:40

rogerthat wrote:

If I may...I just had a read through some of your reviews @ OT. And when you call certain music pretentious, it would make it more informative if you could qualify what it is that makes it pretentious to you. I agree with ExittheLemming that I have never thought of Floyd as pretentious. They were rather matter of fact, if anything, and Waters's lyrics are less poetry and more bald expressions of a young man's feelings about the world...perhaps that is why they appeal to so many listeners, I don't know. While I am not so harsh on WYWH, I get what you are saying and it is less inspired coming on the heels of DSOTM. But it is only poor execution, not really Floyd pretending to do what they were not capable of...on the contrary, they were capable of much better things.

The former is what I was referring to with the remark that all finer nuances of the lyrics won't necessarily open to non-native English speakers, even though one would understand every word and sentence. Sometimes a non-native speaker tries to find higher meanings in the lyrics, even if there weren't any such intention behind the sung words.

IMO Floyd should have left the longing for Syd Barrett to DSOTM because Brain Damage says all that was needed, but instead they started flogging the dead horse with Shine On... Also, they pretend to be just ordinary guys who don't know music business after having just shifted a billion units of their previous record.

The problem is, the term pretentious lacks any real definition in this context, it's rather a stamp that is put on anything that a listener doesn't find inspirational. Perhaps it's quite synonymous with "dull"...

And about the latter: as I already admitted, I don't remember what I was thinking of when I compared Heep's "pretentiousness" to Sabbath's. Let's say they were both much less pretentious than the average glam rockers of the 70's.

Composer - Click to listen to my works!

rogerthat

Prog Reviewer

Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869

Posted: December 15 2011 at 09:52

Yes, I get what you are trying to say about WYWH. I have somewhat similar feelings. I could never truly warm up to Waters's singing on Shine On, it never felt sincere enough to me. Gilmour did a much better job on Pulse. I think Waters in the 70s was a very shrewd and savvy man and it almost felt like, bereft of ideas, he pushed the band to make a concept album around Barrett because the fans would readily lap it up. And so they did, of course. I have some issues with the stodgy pacing of both SOYCD tracks too. But yes, something like dull, forced, insincere is what you are looking for. Yours is a very open ended interpretation of the word 'pretentious' and the word by itself is not so open ended in its meaning so it might sound like you are throwing out an accusation to address whatever's your complaint with the album.

That's a good point about a non native speaker's notion of English lyrics. I am a non native speaker too but maybe I am a bit more interested in the language so I didn't really have that problem. Further, that carefully concealing the real meaning of a song is not something I would find objectionable (I have heard that Time is actually about drugs and there are not a whole of hints in the lyrics and maybe some rather local references completely pass me by), but that is more a matter of taste.

infandous

Forum Senior Member

Joined: March 23 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2447

Posted: December 15 2011 at 14:54

Didn't read all the posts, but I have to say, I curse this site on a regular basis when I think of all the money I would have if not for discovering prog archives. The lost shelf space, the broken jewel cases, the strange looks from passers by when I'm playing a CD in my car. Not to mention the quickly ended dates when I put on Comus. Curse you PA!!! You've ruined my life!!!!!

On the other hand, I really love prog music, so I guess having so much more of it now isn't so bad Embarrassed

colorofmoney91 View Drop Down

Prog Reviewer

Joined: March 16 2008
Location: Biosphere
Status: Offline
Points: 22774

Posted: December 15 2011 at 15:52

I found friends here; people my own age who like the music I listen to, or people who like to talk objectively about music with me.

Most of the older members of this site don't like me though :\

Dean

Special Collaborator

Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout

Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575

Posted: December 15 2011 at 15:54

colorofmoney91 wrote:

I found friends here; people my own age who like the music I listen to, or people who like to talk objectively about music with me.

Most of the older members of this site don't like me though :\

Most? A slight exaggeration - most aren't aware you are a member here.

What?

Glimmung

Forum Newbie

Joined: June 06 2011
Location: NJ
Status: Offline
Points: 36

Posted: December 15 2011 at 16:36

Thanks to this website I can now live on a strictly progressive rock diet. Thank you all very much.
Progarchives and Gmail. The Only 2 websites I Visit.

Formentera Lady View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: August 20 2010
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1768

Posted: December 17 2011 at 12:17

Before I knew PA, I listened to the same 100 albums over and over again for many years. And I thought, prog died in 1989. Now with PA I discover new artists and albums every day, old and new, and my knowledge about prog is exploding!

Visit me in Second Life to talk about music.

Ytse_Jam

Forum Senior Member

Joined: December 08 2011
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 502

Posted: December 17 2011 at 17:17

PA makes me angry because here I find so much good music but I don't have time to listen to all of it

ExittheLemming View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11415

Posted: December 17 2011 at 18:44

Glimmung wrote:

Thanks to this website I can now live on a strictly progressive rock diet. Thank you all very much.
Progarchives and Gmail. The Only 2 websites I Visit.

Strict diets never end well (people always end up looking like they need ironing) A healthy balanced diet would include Pop, Jazz, Classical, Folk, IDM, Indie and Prog at the very least Wink

Edited by ExittheLemming - December 17 2011 at 18:44

rogerthat

Prog Reviewer

Joined: September 03 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 9869

Posted: December 17 2011 at 23:55

And rock?

ExittheLemming View Drop Down

Forum Senior Member

Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11415

Posted: December 17 2011 at 23:58

rogerthat wrote:

And rock?

Whoops...erm yes. Throw in some Algerian polka, roll back the carpet, uncork the wine and say hello to the low fat anchovy nearest to you.

Edited by ExittheLemming - December 17 2011 at 23:59

Atavachron View Drop Down

Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator

Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Offline
Points: 64643

Posted: December 18 2011 at 00:54

colorofmoney91 wrote:

I found friends here; people my own age who like the music I listen to, or people who like to talk objectively about music with me.

Most of the older members of this site don't like me though :\

I like you fine... but that creepy avatar I'm not so sure Tongue

colorofmoney91 View Drop Down

Prog Reviewer

Joined: March 16 2008
Location: Biosphere
Status: Offline
Points: 22774

Posted: December 18 2011 at 09:48

Atavachron wrote:

colorofmoney91 wrote:

I found friends here; people my own age who like the music I listen to, or people who like to talk objectively about music with me.

Most of the older members of this site don't like me though :\

I like you fine... but that creepy avatar I'm not so sure Tongue

I've actually made a creepier version for me to use after Christmas Tongue

Hanashukketsu

raul_siberian View Drop Down

Forum Newbie

Joined: February 19 2012
Status: Offline
Points: 29

Posted: October 24 2012 at 21:16

Thanks to this site I found bands like:

Ambrosia, Kestrel, Khan, Happy the Man, Maxophone, The Greatest Show on Earth, Samla Mammas Manna, Spring, Gypsy, Shaa Khan, Gracious!, Babylon, Mesage, Samurai, Supersister... And much More!!! Wacko

The Doctor View Drop Down

Special Collaborator

Honorary Collaborator

Joined: June 23 2005
Location: The Tardis
Status: Offline
Points: 8543

Posted: October 24 2012 at 21:18

They send me a big fat check every month for posting here. And the health insurance is beyond compare.

I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you?