Prog, Rolling Stone & Class Distinctions.

SteveG wrote: As so many old vs new prog posts have come around lately, I want to dig up one of my pet peeves with Rolling Stone magazine, who viewed progressive rock as a music manufactured for British class distinctions. And I quote: Why British bands feel compelled to quote the classics, however tongue-in-cheek, leads into the murky waters of class and nation analysis.... The class divisions and the crushing weight of high culture flourish essentially untrammeled. Rockers seem far more eager to ‘dignify’ their work, to make it acceptable for upper-class approbation." John Rockwell on progressive rock The Rolling Stone Illustrated History of Rock & Roll, 1978 ... Do the RS comments above regarding class distinctions ring true?   And if so, how does that view reconcile with 21th century Prog groups like Opeth, Dream Theater, Pain of Salvation, Katitonia and Tool?   And how do feel about RS magazine after reading that quotation?

One of the things I don't like about this kind of "pro" writing is that I don't feel like I'm reading the quote in English. "Why British bands feel compelled to quote the classics" sounds like a question, but it's followed by "leads into the murky waters of class and nation analysis", which needs a subject. Eh, John.

Edited by Dayvenkirq - January 22 2015 at 11:29

I didn't know Rolling Stone was ever relevant. They jump on sensationalist stories with little regard for facts then right when they're called out on it, they say we probably should have looked into it more first." 

WeepingElf wrote: I may add that (here in Germany, at least, but it seems to be the same in other countries) despite prog being shunned, Krautrock is considered cool.  For whichever reasons.  And those writers who despise prog but endorse Krautrock usually think that it was strongly influenced (if not outrightly pioneered) by Stockhausen.  Oh well.

 

jude111 wrote: WeepingElf wrote: I think the main reason why magazines such as Rolling Stone neglect prog is that these magazines are not as much about music but about sex, drugs and rock'n'roll, i.e. scandals of rock and pop stars.    Nah, I think it's simpler: Rolling Stone was an American mag, comprised of mainly American critics, and therefore promoted American music, and behind that, Americna ideology. Rolling Stone's notions of rock was pretty conservative: if music strayed from its country music and blues roots (i.e. Chuck Berry, Jerry Lee Lewis, Elvis), then it was needlessly highbrow and "European." (Anyone remember how strongly Rolling Stone promoted Bob Seger, Tom Petty and Jackson Browne as rock's "saviors"?!?!)   Prog is mainly European. Sure, there's the odd Canadian prog band (Rush), the odd American prog band (Kansas), the odd Japanese prog band, etc. - but it's still largely a European genre (UK, Italy, Germany).   If anyone was in the US after 9/11 and saw all those American TV reporters wearing their little American flag pins on their suits and ties, then you know that nationality trumps any other loyalties, whether it be to Truth, journalistic standards and integrity, or musical aesthetics. Music critics are no different. (Even British music critics look down their noses at, say, French popular music, and treat it with, at worst, derision, and at best, patronizing bemusement.)

The "prog embargo" in the music press is not just an American phenomenon, and I don't think it can be chalked to prog being "not American" alone.  Here in Germany, the leading rock magazines - the German edition of Rolling Stone and Musik Express - never write a line about prog.  Visions regularly mentions "Progrock", but that doesn't refer to actual progressive rock, rather it is a term used in alternative rock circles for music that is sometimes prog-influenced, other times not.  It sometimes seems to me that this usage of "progressive" is in part derived from the usage of the word in EDM circles, where it is entirely unrelated to progressive rock.

At least, the classic rock magazines write about 70s prog, and the heavy metal magazines about progressive metal.  Eclipsed used to write much about prog, but that has been decreasing issue by issue, and it's now little else than yet another classic rock magazine.

It seems that since the "punk revolution", the dominant attitude is to consider rock music that is best kept "pure and simple", and those who seek more sophisticated music should go for classical or jazz, and not abuse rock'n'roll for their purposes.

rogerthat wrote: ^^^  Not just French bands but American bands too.  I remember reading a rather needlessly scathing review of a Steely Dan concert, apparently written back in 1972.  I don't grudge the reviewer his opinion but he basically devoted the entire first para to arguing how American bands tended to be just an overhype unlike their (apparently far superior) peers in Britain.

Edited by The Dark Elf - January 18 2015 at 19:56

WeepingElf wrote: I think the main reason why magazines such as Rolling Stone neglect prog is that these magazines are not as much about music but about sex, drugs and rock'n'roll, i.e. scandals of rock and pop stars.

Edited by jude111 - January 18 2015 at 15:52

Ha Ha NY Dolls! I walked out on their show once, as soon as they appeared on stage in drag. Bowie is one thing. But these guys were not 5 David Bowies! 

^Rolling Stone contributor John Landau  became manager for The Boss after the album Born To Run went ballistic.

HackettFan wrote: I come from an American perspective certainly. I ask, though, when did it become the case that geeks were to be understood as elitists? ...

HackettFan wrote: I come from an American perspective certainly. I ask, though, when did it become the case that geeks were to be understood as elitists? Believe me Rush fans were regarded as the former and not the latter. I mean seriously, quoting the classics is something you can do without being upper class. Zappa did it just fine. Yes, it requires some sort knowledge base, but surely even in England the lower classes had some amongst the ranks with some affinity for exercising their intellect.

Of course, exceptions to the rules always exist and for sure it is in 70s England that there was some indivuduals who were happily whistling Wonderous Stories, Songs From The Wood  or The Lady Lies while waiting for the Unemployment Benefit, Form 40.

Edited by Svetonio - January 18 2015 at 04:02