God |
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moshkito
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 04 2007 Location: Grok City Status: Offline Points: 16222 |
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This is one of my biggest problems with English ... I can do this and now the difference in Portuguese, but saying it here, it gets completely misunderstood and turned around to make it seem like it's something completely and totally else than what the issue is about! English, here, is not taught as a language, thus the kind of subtlety that you just mentioned is not appreciated or understood. Besides, now a days, it's all a letter or two so it fits the smartphone ... explanations, as would be the normal case in this board, go completely unread for the most part!
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Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
www.pedrosena.com |
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CosmicVibration
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 26 2014 Location: Milky Way Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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Reincarnation is a fundamental teaching in all the major religions of the world. Or at least it used to be, as in the case with Christianity. |
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CosmicVibration
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 26 2014 Location: Milky Way Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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The tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao. - Lao Tzu The god that can be defined is not the eternal God. God’s abode is beyond all vibratory creation. As Jaketejas mentioned, He is not confined by time and space. God is beyond the little ego’s understanding. Beyond any thought process; beyond the scope of our imagination. The human intellect can only get so close with certain
attributes. I think first and foremost
should be that of Unconditional Love. Just
think about that- Unconditional. There’s absolutely no reason for fear. Fear will only distance you from that which you seek. It may also be somewhat erroneous to think that God created the universe, but rather that an infinitesimal part of his infinite being became the universe. Even though His existence is beyond the material, astral and causal, He is very much present in every single atom in the cosmos. God is everything; there can be no limitation or confinement. He is personal and impersonal, formless but can take on any form. He can appear as Light, Mother, Father, Divine Friend or any other form a true devotee holds dear.
Due to the law of cause and effect, free will may not be that apparent. Karmic reach spans numerous lifetimes and seemingly seals our fate. Because of our free will we ventured off and subjugated ourselves to delusion. |
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Jaketejas
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 27 2018 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1969 |
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I admit to being confined in part by my own rational thinking. I cannot see how, if God exists, that a creator God can be both God the creator as well as the physical stuff (matter) that God created. Because of the law of cause and effect, I can agree that our choices are limited, but nevertheless we still have the ability to exercise free will to an extent. I most often have the choice of whether I'm going to do good or evil. Also, how such a God would choose to intersect the created universe is beyond my understanding.
However, going back to my earlier comments, I can't see how states or qualities or emotions (love, anger, etc.) can by themselves always be construed as good or evil. A mother who loves a child so much that another child is treated unfairly is not doing good. A mother who loves her children equally, as well as treating her neighbors' children fairly would be doing good. A person who expresses anger at an unjust system may very well be doing good. Jealous anger because someone else won a prize would be the opposite of good. So, good and evil seem associated with the application of the right quality at the right time and place, like playing the right notes in a beautiful song. If such a creator God was then going to intersect the creation, then it may be to show us an example of how to live. |
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lazland
Prog Reviewer Joined: October 28 2008 Location: Wales Status: Offline Points: 13279 |
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I like the point made about God not wishing to create automatons, but humans with free will. That is what I believe, but that there will be a case to answer for your actions in the next phase, call it judgement, heaven, whatever.
I have been studying Judaism a great deal in recent times, and have been thinking seriously about converting, or at least trying to live by Noahide principles. Torah speaks to me in a way which the New Testament or Pauline Epistles never have, and I thoroughly enjoy reading the words and works of Jonathan Sacks especially, who combines a deep faith with reason, humour, realism, and the stark truth that we can only aspire to be the best we can within the confines of human nature, and that is the real message of God. The Almighty has provided us, through direct interventions, with a template of how to live our lives, and I appreciate the fact that Judaism, above Christianity, deals with the here and now, rather than with the afterlife. We all have a choice in life. Follow the path of light, or that of darkness. Life is terribly hard for so many people, and I appreciate deeply the riches and happiness I enjoy, more so as I get older, and more deeply spiritual. It is my belief that mankind simply has to mature. In reality, many of our leaders actions are no better than those of warlords of times past, and Jewish texts deal with that history, consequences, and outcomes very directly. Far too many of us also still follow idiots in power, most of them vain and narcissistic, without any free will, or thoughts as to the consequences of our support, at all. There will, hopefully, come a time when we can all live in peace and harmony, with riches and peace for all. There.....I have finished on a nice Jon Anderson note |
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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
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patrickq
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 18 2015 Location: the New England Status: Offline Points: 508 |
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Edited by patrickq - June 25 2019 at 15:01 |
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patrickq
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 18 2015 Location: the New England Status: Offline Points: 508 |
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What’s hard for me to understand is why he would subject us to such misery. You could have free will in a universe without rape, war, mental illness, etc. |
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Jaketejas
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 27 2018 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1969 |
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I think that is hard for a lot of people to understand, including myself. ThIs is a tough question and one for which there are no easy answers that I can see. One argument that is often used is that without good and evil, there can be no free will. You disagree, but can we argue the alternative? And, related to that, it is sometimes only in great difficulty that we find out who our true friends are, what we are capable of in terms of doing good or evil, and what we are willing to sacrifice of ourselves for doing what's good. Nevertheless, this viewpoint is not something to say to someone who is experiencing great grief or pain. Probably the best thing to do in that situation is to love them, comfort them, and for me ... keep my mouth shut.
I'm not following the previous commenter's rationale for choosing one religion over another. |
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lazland
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He doesn't subject us to such misery. That is the point. We do it to ourselves. |
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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
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Jaketejas
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 27 2018 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1969 |
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When someone else wrongs you, I don't think it is logical to say that you are doing it to yourself. Also, there are factors outside of human control (for example, natural disasters). I think I follow pq's sentiment.
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Jaketejas
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 27 2018 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1969 |
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Mental illness seems, to an extent, deserving of empathy. But, certainly I've met incredibly decent people who suffer from mental challenges, while I've encountered some really smart but extremely self centered people who are really lacking in the empathy department and have no diagnosed mental illness.
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lazland
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He stated rape, war, mental illness, not natural disasters. I meant mankind doing it to itself in a collective manner, which I would have thought, was somewhat self-evident. Obviously not. Natural disasters is an entirely different matter, and it is very easy, and, indeed, understandable that we look for something to blame, usually the higher authority of God. There really is not an easy answer to this. Theologians, philosophers, priests, and mankind full stop have been trying to answer this for millennia. Certainly far greater minds than I. My viewpoint? It is just the way the universe is. Why is it like that? I have absolutely no idea, but I keep searching for the answer. Sometimes, lack of knowledge is the beginning of wisdom, no? |
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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
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Jaketejas
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 27 2018 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1969 |
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I just don't think you can lump mankind together when it comes to good and evil. I think each of us has, to an extent, a choice. I would agree that our tendencies may be towards the latter, but those tendencies may be overcome by following the conscience, which seems to be a gentle nudging from something and someplace difficult to define. Some would argue that it comes from God. There is also a difference in choosing to pursue good or evil as a way of life, and in making mistakes (sometimes, actions of evil - willful but regretted or unintentional) along the way.
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Jaketejas
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 27 2018 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1969 |
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I added natural disasters because they are often outside of our control. Mental illness is also, to an extent, beyond our control.
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Jaketejas
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 27 2018 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1969 |
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Anyway, considering all of my thoughts on this forum, I try to show how my own rational thinking has brought me to a set of logical conclusions. If God exists, then ... Now, if I choose to believe in this creator God, the question becomes what religion is congruent with this philosophy of moral law? If I don't choose to believe, then I have to rationalize other explanations to justify the basis for moral law (good and evil) and conscience. Either avenue becomes a matter of faith.
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CosmicVibration
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 26 2014 Location: Milky Way Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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Without duality, this includes good and evil, there would be no creation. If I want to start a war, rape and pillage God will not stop me. He will not punish me. He will only shy away, far away. However, all actions, including words and thoughts will ripple throughout the universe and come back to us like a boomerang. We are causing our own natural disasters or paradises. It’s No-no-no-no-no-no-nobody's fault but mine. – the mighty Led Zep |
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Quinino
Forum Senior Member Joined: June 26 2011 Location: Portugal Status: Offline Points: 3654 |
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We are imperfect mortal beings and hopelessly alone in the world (and we all live with the conscience of that inescapable human condition, more or less deeply ingrained, of course, it varies greatly) - humbly believing there's an entity that personifies an ideal we should compare us to and try emulate, well, many of us can and do use that faith - of any flavor, choose one - to drive across this valley of tears the best we can (results may vary hahahha !!!)
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Atavachron
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^ Nicely said. |
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"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy
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CosmicVibration
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 26 2014 Location: Milky Way Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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Religions seem to be filled with half-truths and useless dogmas. I think mainly because of miss-interpretations of the cryptic writings. That and a control factor. Gandhi once mentioned that he followed and saw no difference between Hindu scriptures, the Bible and the Koran. I think that if Jesus, Muhammad, Krishna, Buddha and any other such masters sat around the table there wouldn’t be any arguments, only harmony. Now put their followers around that same table and they’ll be at each other’s throats |
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Jaketejas
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 27 2018 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 1969 |
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But do you understand the reasons why you decided to choose the path that you did? "Because of my parents ..." was not a satisfactory answer for me. I needed to be able to rationalize, as far as I could go, which path I decided to choose. Some people just choose with their hearts. For me, it had to be a bit of both ... rational thinking and heart. |
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