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Can Prog Be Prog Without Drums?

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Poll Question: Please give examples of successful prog without the use of drums
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40 [86.96%]
6 [13.04%]
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BrufordFreak View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrufordFreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2018 at 16:44
Originally posted by Man With Hat Man With Hat wrote:

It is really hard to be rock music without drums. I'm not going to say impossible, but really, really hard. I can't really think of an example. Although this does lead me to think what it would sound like if you take famous classic rock songs and eliminate the drum tracks. But that's a tangent...Anyway, if it's not rock, it can't be progressive rock.
 
That said, of course you can have progressive music without drums.

The "unplugged" or "all acoustic" phenomena experimented with precisely this!
Drew Fisher
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrufordFreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2018 at 16:46
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:

Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:

Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

What we have here is a failure to communicate.
 
Sorry, your reply to my original statement made me think about the difference between rock & roll and rock when it occurred to me whether rock & roll lends itself to being progressive in the sense of progressive rock. 
 
But in response to your original reply, what is it that makes a completely acoustic piece of music rock? 

I guess what would make you think that playing just acoustic is not rock? Again, I mentioned The Beatles' "Eleanor Rigby", which is devoid of all guitars, bass, keys and drums, and yet it is considered one of the finest rocks songs ever composed. Also, if one listens to the hundreds of folk-rock bands that were spawned from Bob Dylan's fertile acoustic womb, there are thousands of acoustic-based rock songs.

The divergence from blues or rhythm and blues-based rock and roll that occurred when Dylan strapped on an electric at Monterrey was at first a folk/rock synthesis (as employed at the same time by The Byrds, Simon & Garfunkel and The Beatles), so "acoustic rock" has been a staple rock genre since the mid-60s, predating prog elements, but only by a short time (The Beatles were to incorporate acoustic guitar folk rock with strings on "Yesterday", and became even more adventurous on the Stockhausen-influenced strident and staccato strings on "Eleanor Rigby" and Eastern sitar on "Hide Your Love Away"). Humorously enough, an acoustic version of Simon & Garfunkel's "The Sound of Silence" appears on the album Wednesday Morning, 3 AM, and the electric version with drums is on the next album Sounds of Silence. Each has virtually the same vocal tracks, so is one rock and one is not? LOL

These early classical, Eastern and folk influences in rock then merged with the burgeoning psychedelic scene and psych folk was born (bands like the It's a Beautiful Day, Donovan, Incredible String Band, and Tim Buckley, along with Jefferson Airplane and the Moody Blues on occasion). 

By the late 60s/early 70s, true progressive folk-rock ran parallel with the primarily British 2nd Folk Revival (with folks like Renbourn, Jansch, Martin Carthy, Nick Drake and folk-rock bands like Fairport Convention and Steeleye Span). Prog folk would include Comus, Jan Dukes de Gray, Jethro Tull, and Renaissance, who combined both folk and classical motifs. 

Roy Harper had a foot in both camps, but an album like Stormcock  is definitely progressive folk rock. Please listen to the song I provided earlier, "The Same Old Rock". It has multiple time signature changes, dense lyrics with a heightened sort of poetry that was a hallmark of folk rock since Dylan, classical influences, difficult chording and one hell of an instrumental section towards the end.

Another instance from around the same time, Led Zeppelin's "Battle of Evermore" has no electric guitar, bass or drums. There is Jimmy Page on mandolin, John Paul Jones plays acoustic guitar and recorder (and an EMS VCS 3 that is used as a voice effect), and Robert Plant and Sandy Denny of Fairport are singing. Not a person here would say it was not a "rock song" because there are no electrics or drums.

Jethro Tull has countless songs that employ just acoustic guitar and strings, like "Reasons for Waiting", just acoustic guitar and organ, such as "Sossity", long acoustic passages in Thick as a Brick and A Passion Play, or simply straight acoustic rock songs like "Solitaire", "One White Duck / 010 = Nothing at All", and "Salamander" that exhibits classic influences, blues, folk and rock in one concise 3 minute progressive package:



By the way, don't ever say just two acoustic guitars can't rock:









AWESOME post!!!

Drew Fisher
https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/
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BrufordFreak View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrufordFreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2018 at 16:52
Originally posted by Mortte Mortte wrote:

I don´t think prog or music commonly needs any particural instrument. And in great folkprog there are not full drums, only percussions.

I LOVE your perspective! A capella prog (Les Voix Mystères de Bulgaires?) or Bill Bruford's (World Drummers Ensemble) or Babatunde Olatunji's all-drum albums or California Guitar Trio or Anekdtoen's three mellotron pieces or Farmer's Market's klezmer or Shamanic (or Tuuvan) throat singing all coming to mind. 

Drew Fisher
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BrufordFreak View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrufordFreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2018 at 16:57
Originally posted by ReactioninG ReactioninG wrote:

Can there be prog without musicians? That's a good question.

Eno. (Not a musician.) The sex pistols. (I know: they weren't prog, but they sure helped "progress" music into the dumps), The Fairlight CMI. Sequencing, Looping, sampling, etc.   
Drew Fisher
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siLLy puPPy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote siLLy puPPy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2018 at 17:44
Klaus Schulze and most progressive electronic. The question is about prog NOT about prog rock, so of course prog can exist without drums.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote deafmoon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 31 2018 at 01:45
No drums doesn't necessarily mean you can't have great music. Get up at 4:30am and go outside and listen to the birds begin  their day. I don't hear drums, but it sure is beautiful.
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