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Tim Burton or Guillermo del Toro or Terry Gilliam

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Poll Question: which of these movie makers do you prefare
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2 [16.67%]
2 [16.67%]
8 [66.67%]
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Icarium View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Icarium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Tim Burton or Guillermo del Toro or Terry Gilliam
    Posted: March 17 2019 at 07:16
Three directors whom creates works inside the fields of the fantastical, surrealistic, science-fiction, horror, gothic, wierd and strange. All three have a style but have also ventured into various paths to try out new and out of experience fields. All have masterpieces. Brazil, Edward Scissordhand and Trollhunters.

So it is fully allowed to respect them all but i dare you to pick one favoured actor.

Edited by Icarium - March 17 2019 at 07:17
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vompatti Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 17 2019 at 07:34
Tim Burton.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 20 2019 at 06:52
Hi,

Terry Gilliam .... specially as he was such an important part of the visual nature of MONTY PYTHON, that got us so very involved and laughed at so many silly gags, a huge ... absolutely HUGE throwback to a lot of American vaudeville stuff in the early days of the 20th century.

Tim Burton, by comparison, had has been a lot more popular in America, because his kind of humor was making fun in someways, at a lot of American film in the 30's, 40's and 50's, and a lot of this is kinda lost in the whole process ... by comparison, I would say that Terry Gilliam is considerably more literary and artistic, although I would not wish to suggest that Tim is not as good as Terry ... they are both excellent.

The only knock I have on Tim is that he is not as original as he thinks ... I have not enjoyed a lot of his films as they do not seem to me to be "serious", and sometimes it is as if they are being done ... just for fun. I, very much doubt that Terry does films, just for fun, they all have a very deep and personal direction and attention, that is often times very scary ... his psychic visual moments are very fast and scary, but because they are in a thing that we think is not serious, the detail on it is left behind.

My feelings are ... that Tim is trying to be cool and please an American TV audience, rather than create a work that is original and capable of sustaining its ideas and concepts.

BUT, in the process, you get some things that are just outstanding ... BEETLEJUICE would probably not be as much fun were it not for the actor going crazy and nuts about everything he did ... and the funniest thing, just to give you an idea how intelligent and attentive the actor is, he ended up in a production of a Shakespeare play ... and what does he do? The reverse of what Tim Burton does ... he pulls up a Monty Python, something only an American could probably devise and have fun with ... and if you don't see him delivering his lines while "horsing" around, you have not seen the best moment in that whole film!

Kudos go to Tim, for allowing the actor to go free and crazy in his film, something that Terry Gilliam has been famous for, from the first day ... probably something he learned from Monty Python, that you must let the actor "live" his character as long as possible, because it gets zanier and zanier as time goes by ... and you see all the time in Jonathan Pryce, in Robin Williams, and quite a few others, although I am of the opinion that many of the American actors were not as well versed, or comfortable in the art of the ad-lib and improvisation ... which is very evident in a lot of the American arts ... Broadway will do yet another musical revival instead of something original!

All in all, a tough vote and sell. Tim Burton, does deserve some credit for his work ... although I do not think that he has continued to create such insane and amazing films, like Terry has ... but perhaps that is my taste for the work, and not necessarily a knock on the director at all ... visually and film wise, Terry is much more in touch of the cinematography of it all, than Tim is ... and Terry's visuals have always left us ... just wow'd to not end.

Nice poll, though ... it really brings out the nuts and bolts on their work.


Edited by moshkito - March 21 2019 at 09:57
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vompatti Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 20 2019 at 07:03
^ Pulp Fiction is Tarantino.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Icarium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 20 2019 at 07:33
when Michael Keaton gets time and freedom to delve deep into character development, he showes why hes one of th most high regarded actors. Hes a very fairly rated character actor whom excells in many portraits of eccentric characters, being it Bruce Wayne /Batman, Beetlejuice or in the upcomming Dumbo.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 20 2019 at 08:52
Originally posted by Icarium Icarium wrote:

Three directors whom creates works inside the fields of the fantastical, surrealistic, science-fiction, horror, gothic, wierd and strange. All three have a style but have also ventured into various paths to try out new and out of experience fields. All have masterpieces. Brazil, Edward Scissordhand and Trollhunters.

So it is fully allowed to respect them all but i dare you to pick one favoured actor.


Netflix's Trollhunters as best Guillermo del Toro's masterpiece?   I enjoyed it, but I doubt mnay would consider it to be his masterpiece. I'd nominate Pan's Labyrinth for that honour (one of the very greatest films of this millennium so far for me).

Three directors with stylistic similarities, but since Gilliam influenced del Toro and Burton (and because Gilliam is one of my very favourite directors, I feel I should vote for him, but I am tempted to vote for del Toro today).

My favourite film by each director:

Gilliam - Brazil
del Toro - Pan's Labyrinth
Burton - Big Fish

As del Toro said of Gilliam:

"Gilliam gave birth to an aesthetic- now supplanted and enhanced with gloss collagen by others but lacking his verve, bite and romanticism."

Fans of these should check out Jeunet et Caro films such as Delicatessen, City of Lost Children, and Amelie, as well as the Norwegian film The Bothersome Man, as well as Michel Gondry (eternal Sunhine of the Spotless Mind), Paul Thomas Anderson, Wes Anderson, Lynch, Jonze, Jarmusch, Kubrick, Coen Brothers, Lindsay Anderson, Fellini's 8 and a Half, and others.

And I think such people would enjoy this short film, West of the Moon: https://www.shortoftheweek.com/2013/05/06/west-of-the-moon/

And I guess Trollhunters fans might want to check out another Norwegian film, Trollhunter, I know you know it, Icarium.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Icarium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 20 2019 at 13:49
I thought of addimg Wes Anderson to the poll as well, he uses some of the comparable quirk and vast knowledge of movie wisdome in hes production.

what makes Burton, Gilliam and del Toro so remarkable is their ability to combine their enthusiasme for film, their encyclopedic knowledge of various film trends, stylistical elememts in wide range of genres ( im both fiction and realisme), yet a certain ratinoale sense. They all know of the past eposes and knows how to wove it into their interpretation. Yet a healthy ballance of comedy and tragedy. They all seem to know the bases of Nitezhean Apollonian and Dionysian conflict/symbiosis.

Edited by Icarium - March 20 2019 at 13:49
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 21 2019 at 09:57
Originally posted by Vompatti Vompatti wrote:

^ Pulp Fiction is Tarantino.

My error and I corrected it ... thx for the help on that!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BaldFriede Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 21 2019 at 10:06
I would have thrown Alejandro Jodorowsky into the bunch.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Logan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 21 2019 at 13:22
^ I thought of mentioning Alejandro Jodorowsky soon after making my list, good call.

I like Burton films, but none of his films have had the impact on me as my favourite Gilliam or del Toro. I'm rather surprised to see del Toro with not only no votes, but no specific mentions in posts other than by me and in the OP, even if just on the strength of Pan's Labyrinth (that said, not many have participated in the poll or discussion yet). But I also liked The Devil's Backbone, Cronos, The Shape of Water, Crimson Peak and Hellboy very much.

Edited by Logan - March 21 2019 at 13:53
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 21 2019 at 14:50
Originally posted by BaldFriede BaldFriede wrote:

I would have thrown Alejandro Jodorowsky into the bunch.

Hard to say ... his films, in America, are not always well received ... for example, SANTA SANGRE almost went directly to video, and I only caught it because the video store I frequented for many years had a nice selection of foreign films. They did not have THE HOLY MOUNTAIN, and later they came up with a used copy of EL TOPO, that I was told no one had selected, except me ... I had not seen the film yet, but it had been a darling in many film festival, as weird, off kilter stuff, usually is.

And this is the hardest part ... I was going through a couple of film places online, and none of his films were listed that I could find, and doing a search? ... even worse.

Europe has a better relationship with artistic works, from visionaries and it is likely that it comes via their usual respect for a lot of film (except one group of folks, that always thinks someone put salt in their coffee! Ahhhh, the drink of the devil 500 years ago!) and these things are better respected, even for their strangeness factor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jamesbaldwin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 21 2019 at 15:54
Gilliam.

I have seen only the Shape of the water by Del Toro. Beautiful.

Tim Burton doesnt excite me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Morningrise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 21 2019 at 18:26
Gilliam by a large margin.

I do enjoy Del Toro's films though.

Burton is ok I guess. But I feel he has been repeating himself a lot throughout the last 20 years of his career and the quality of his works has diminished vastly, with a couple of exceptions in the middle (Big Fish)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote verslibre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 22 2019 at 01:12
Del Toro, by far.

Cronos
The Devil's Backbone
Pan's Labyrinth
Pacific Rim (one of my favorite films)
Crimson Peak
The Shape of Water (amazing)

Del Toro's only misfire is Blade 2. It's a waste of his talent and the studio's resources. Hard to believe he made that film. 

The Hellboy movies are fun, but I've never had a great interest in the character or the comics.

That said, I was disappointed when he stepped away from the Justice League Dark project for WB.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Odvin Draoi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 15 2019 at 05:33
One of the extremely rare situations that I cannot really choose.

Guillermo Del Toro, maybe. Yet all the 3 are amazing in their style.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Icarium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 15 2019 at 08:58
i just saw Dumbo by Burton, and honestly its a 5/10 star movie. I was a little dissapointed. Knowing how imaginative Tim B can be. Here he sort of felt confused with what message and focus to give the film. It was slightly lackluster - i had hopes, some of the magoc was there, some interesting twists were added " oohh thats kinda elegant". To be fair though it is a very difficult movie to do, what should you aim for. How much fantasy and how much realisme shall you depict. Ironlicly Tim went for the more realistic and down to earth style, which is wierd knowing the premise for Dumbo. it Could be sader snd could be more spectscular, thougj the flyinh scenes were done really good. The largest Oops for this film was its lack of Dumbo in the movie. The plot in the film overshadowed slightly the Elephant. Its observational role was lost in translation.

+
Danny DeVito
Some good scenes.
good action


To litle Dumbo
to much realisme
Pore "pink elephant" section
Michael Keaton :'(

Edited by Icarium - April 15 2019 at 08:59
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HackettFan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 16 2019 at 18:30
Terry Gilliam directed the second best film ever, The Fisher King, which just edges out the third best film ever, The Adventures of Baron Munchausen. But neither of these are quite as good as the best film ever; Twelve Monkeys, whoever did that one.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Man With Hat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2019 at 12:40
option 2 
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