Marco Minnemann vs Gavin Harrison

Guldbamsen wrote: I am missing a ‘both’ option. I like them just about equally. They do both play that ‘technique-over-sheer-feel’ which is a common trait found in prague-land, and I much prefer it the other way around these days. I prefer ex Porcupine Tree drummer Chris Maitland to both actually although he probably is a tad or two beneath them in technical prowess. Tastes differ

I do love the drumming on Coma Divine more than any drumming I have heard from the Harrison era albums of PT.

Oh yeah lots of distinctive sounding drummers in prog...though we tend to talk about the same 6, which is a little disheartening, when you’ve got folks such as:

Jerzy Piotrowski (SBB)
Giulio Capiozzo (Area)
Mani Neumeier (Guru Guru)
Jaki Liebezeit (Can)
Christian Burchard (Embryo)
Christian Vander (Magma)
Peter Leopold (Amon Düül ll)

..the list literally goes on but this will have to suffice.
The above mentioned drummers are DRUMMERS to this somewhat crazy Dane whereas most of the typical prog heroes are timekeepers. They’re too “trained” and technical to go outside of what they know...and you get the same old fireworks in small portions...and then a timekeeper.
Granted, I’ve heard snippets of what can only be described as ‘going outside the beat’ by the big heroes ie Bruford on Fractured (something he learned from Muir btw), Gavin on PTs Nil Recurring - What Happens Now?, Marco (almost) on Regret 9..and so forth...but compared to the ones I mentioned above, it feels forced and like a thing that sort of happened and if they’d had their way, they’d most likely go back and erase the ‘mistakes’.
Again this is very much my own opinion and I gather most prog fans feel the exact opposite.

Edited by Guldbamsen - August 16 2019 at 10:47

Guldbamsen wrote: Oh yeah lots of distinctive sounding drummers in prog...though we tend to talk about the same 6, which is a little disheartening, when you’ve got folks such as: Jerzy Piotrowski (SBB) Giulio Capiozzo (Area) Mani Neumeier (Guru Guru) Jaki Liebezeit (Can) Christian Burchard (Embryo) Christian Vander (Magma) Peter Leopold (Amon Düül ll) ..the list literally goes on but this will have to suffice. The above mentioned drummers and DRUMMERS to this somewhat crazy Dane whereas most of the typical prog heroes are timekeepers. They’re too “trained” and technical to go outside of what they know...and you get the same old fireworks in small portions...and then a timekeeper. Granted, I’ve heard snippets of what can only be described as ‘going outside the beat’ by the big heroes ie Bruford on Fractured (something he learned from Muir btw), Gavin on PTs Nil Recurring - What Happens Now?, Marco (almost) on Regret 9..and so forth...but compared to the ones I mentioned above, it feels forced and like a thing that sort of happened and if they’d had their way, they’d most likely go back and erase the ‘mistakes’. Again this is very much my own opinion and I gather most prog fans feel the exact opposite.

 

Guldbamsen wrote: I’ve seen Marco live some 5 times now with Steven Wilson, The Aristocrats as well as having heard a good number of his solo output (5 albums I believe). That is why I wrote what I wrote. Also why I mention that this is my own opinion and very much a question of taste I am (or used to be) a drummer and I know what I like in my wardrobe Marco and Gavin are not that talked about tbh and I’m thrilled to see a poll about them. I just tend to prefer other drummers

richardh wrote: It probably doesn't add much to he discussion on the technical aspects of rock drumming but I've never heard anyone play better than Keith Moon in general. In the seventies Carl Palmer dominated the prog polls and really around 1973-74 was untouchable. I would also stick Jon Hiseman into the discussion as well and certainly the best British jazz rock drummer in my estimation. Bruford (like Collins and Hiseman) were less from a rock background so lacked the sheer physical aggression in their playing that Palmer, Bonham and Moon had. Talking very different schools of drumming though. Peart has always been my personal favourite because he seems to straddle these worlds very well. BTW its funny that Mosh goes on ad nauseum about respecting artist choices and then suggests that Wilson should have used Steve Gadd as his drummer. I think he did just fine with Marco thank you!

Icarium wrote: What about a Steven Wilson vs Paul Gilbert poll, that would be interesting. As Paul has played with Marco on some ocations

Eh,wouldn't go very far either way. As a songwriter, Wilson is way better than Gilbert and a guitarist Gilbert is another league altogether compared to Wilson.

Howard the Duck wrote: richardh wrote: It probably doesn't add much to he discussion on the technical aspects of rock drumming but I've never heard anyone play better than Keith Moon in general. In the seventies Carl Palmer dominated the prog polls and really around 1973-74 was untouchable. I would also stick Jon Hiseman into the discussion as well and certainly the best British jazz rock drummer in my estimation. Bruford (like Collins and Hiseman) were less from a rock background so lacked the sheer physical aggression in their playing that Palmer, Bonham and Moon had. Talking very different schools of drumming though. Peart has always been my personal favourite because he seems to straddle these worlds very well. BTW its funny that Mosh goes on ad nauseum about respecting artist choices and then suggests that Wilson should have used Steve Gadd as his drummer. I think he did just fine with Marco thank you! Moon was great at really feeling the music and throwing in some dank fills, but he was all over the place in terms of staying in time - to Entwistle's great frustration. He also had a Ringo moment when he couldn't get one of the fills in Quadrophenia (the title instrumental, i believe) and in the live shows Townsend would have to guide him with outsize hand gestures lol. But luckily I don't care too much about strict time, so I like Moon well enough. Even B says the obsession with perfect time got ridiculous in the 80s, because they started measuring it for BPM, while also drastically decreasing acceptable rock beats to begin with. But having heard B's live stuff, I'd say he's easily one of the best rock drummers I've ever heard at keeping accurate time. That being said, he'd be the first to say if you want to hear real drumming you need to listen to jazz, because according to him virtually anything novel in rock drumming is owed to that genre or another.