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Archspire for Tech/Extreme Metal (Rejected) |
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bardberic 
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Joined: November 02 2021 Location: PA, USA/Israel Status: Offline Points: 792 |
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 Topic: Archspire for Tech/Extreme Metal (Rejected)Posted: June 18 2022 at 03:01 |
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Controversial suggestion, but I'm going for it anyway. Surely most tech fans have heard of Archspire by now, no?
Bio: Archspire is a technical death metal band from Vancouver, Canada, formed in 2007 as Defenestrated, but changed their name in 2009. Archspire is known for playing at extremely fast tempos, pushing the boundaries of what is humanly possible. Despite the brutal nature of their music, Archspire is able to utilize melody enough to create an engaging musical experience. While it is debatable whether or not Archspire is progressive - they do get from point A to point B in unusual and eclectic ways, despite playing at 4/4 (albeit averaging something like 160 bpm or so) - they are unapologetically technical, and a prime example of tech/extreme metal who are at least prog-related. I think special emphasis should be placed on Relentless Mutation and Bleed the Future, especially the former, due to the less straightforward nature of the albums. Archspire has released four studio albums, thus far: All Shall Align, 2011 The Lucid Collective, 2014 Relentless Mutation, 2017 Bleed the Future, 2021  Edited by bardberic - July 15 2022 at 17:47 |
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siLLy puPPy
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 14721 |
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Posted: June 18 2022 at 07:34 |
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Love that newest album. Def tech death but the prog claims are minimal. Mighta passed in the early days of the site but tech metal has gotten crazy weird. Still worth investigating though. I've only heard the last two albums.
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 https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
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bardberic
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Joined: November 02 2021 Location: PA, USA/Israel Status: Offline Points: 792 |
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Posted: June 18 2022 at 09:36 |
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In mean I do think Archspire does some wild things, even relative to other tech/extreme bands here. Similar to Unexpect (in Experimental/Post-Metal), upon first listen to Archspire, I never am able to figure out where they're going, and what their going to do next. In that regard, they're quite unpredictable, due to the eclectic nature of their compositions. I do feel as though they are quite "crazy weird," and especially because of how iconic the band is and how important they are to the Tech Death genre, I believe they deserve a spot on this site.
Edited by bardberic - June 18 2022 at 09:37 |
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Cristi
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Crossover / Prog Metal Teams Joined: July 27 2006 Location: wonderland Status: Offline Points: 41339 |
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Posted: June 18 2022 at 09:47 |
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ok, noted, we'll look into them.
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Cristi
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Crossover / Prog Metal Teams Joined: July 27 2006 Location: wonderland Status: Offline Points: 41339 |
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 04:22 |
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rejected unanimously
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bardberic
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 11:24 |
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Meh. I figured. Well at least they were looked at.
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siLLy puPPy
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 14721 |
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 11:50 |
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^ keep in mind technical and experimental isn't the same as progressive. I considered suggesting them after their latest album but didn't find the prog elements to be enough for inclusion here. Let's see what they do next. The next album could be exactly prog enough
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https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
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bardberic
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 12:22 |
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I actually think the one before the new one is their progressive opus. I think they became more melodic on BtF, but lost progressiveness.
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nick_h_nz
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Prog Metal / Heavy Prog Team Joined: March 01 2013 Location: Suffolk, UK Status: Offline Points: 6737 |
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 12:42 |
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The only album that had prog metal elects heard by the team was the latest. As stated above, just because something is crazy, technical, experimental, weird 💩, does not mean it is prog.
Just as there are plenty of avant artists who have been submitted to PA for inclusion under RIO/Avant, who make crazy, avant, experimental, weird 💩, and have been rejected because they are not prog. To be fair, you didn’t exactly make a great case for them to be added by calling it “controversial”, and “debatable” if the band is progressive. Stating that a band is “at least prog related” is not really selling them to us either, unless you were wanting to suggest them for that category, and going through the necessary step of having them first heard by an appropriate team. As it happened, what you wrote was not taken into consideration when we listened. And none of us heard enough prog to feel comfortable about adding the band now. That “now” is important, because the last album did potentially show the band taking a more progressive route, and it may well be worth resubmitting the band at a later date, after further releases, should they show that the prog is continuing to make an increasing presence in their music. A word of caution for you, before you make any other such “controversial” and/or “debatable” suggestions. Once a band has been rejected, it becomes very difficult (though not impossible) for them to later be accepted. Where a band needs only a majority vote to be accepted for inclusion in PA initially, if they are rejected and resubmitted they need to receive a unanimous yes vote, rather than just a majority. So by suggesting any band or artist before there is more than just a hint of prog is actually making it harder for them to be included in the PA database. Personally, I don’t agree with the necessity for a unanimous vote for resubmissions, as I think it is an unnecessary and unfair barrier. But that is how the rules are, and unless they are changed, that is how they will remain. If Archspire ever comes back to us as a resubmission, it will now require every team member to agree they should be included. |
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siLLy puPPy
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 14721 |
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 13:58 |
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^ nick, if they put out a new album that resets their eligibility and you can vote according to the new release only.
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https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
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nick_h_nz
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 15:57 |
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We have been doing it wrongly in the PM team, then. I’m glad that is the case, as it seemed crazy to me, and I had questioned it. |
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siLLy puPPy
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PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 14721 |
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 15:59 |
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I do agree that any artist should be reevaluated at any time for any reason. Teams make mistakes.
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https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
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Cristi
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 16:04 |
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I don't think we're doing things wrong, yes, new music is reason enough for a new evaluation, even adding the artist, which has happened. But also the re-evaluation may lead to a new rejection, it happened as well.
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nick_h_nz
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 16:18 |
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That’s not the issue. It is whether or not a majority or unanimous vote is required for a resubmission. Both you and Mike as team leaders have said there must be a unanimous yes vote in order for a resubmitted band to be accepted into the PA database, I made a comment on just this recently, where I pointed out that a band that had been rejected previously but had now released a further album and ep, so was being resubmitted had the potential to be rejected with more yes votes than no votes, even including the historical no votes. As it happened, they had a unanimous yes vote, so that wasn’t a problem. But it seems that we didn’t need that unanimous vote at all. |
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Cristi
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Posted: June 20 2022 at 16:21 |
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Let's continue this conversation in our team thread, this is not the place TBH.
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nick_h_nz
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Posted: June 21 2022 at 00:20 |
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There is nothing to continue. I’ve said all there is to say. I also have no problem having said it here (obviously).
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Davesax1965
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Posted: June 21 2022 at 09:01 |
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"Archspire is a technical death metal band from Vancouver, Canada"....................
What next ? "Is Ice Cream Van music prog ? "
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Cristi
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Posted: June 21 2022 at 09:34 |
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That's unnecessary mockery. The technical/extreme progressive metal subgenre has been around on PA for a long while. Some technical death metal bands can be progressive, especially when they go beyond verse-chorus pattern, are a little bit adventurous, alternate soft and heavy passages, soft and loud, experiment a little bit, etc.
Edited by Cristi - June 21 2022 at 09:34 |
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Cristi
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Crossover / Prog Metal Teams Joined: July 27 2006 Location: wonderland Status: Offline Points: 41339 |
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Posted: June 21 2022 at 09:37 |
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I wish an admin closed this thread, the band has been rejected, nothing much else to say TBH.
Maybe we should do the same as MMA, where once added or rejected, suggestion threads are closed. Edited by Cristi - June 21 2022 at 09:37 |
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siLLy puPPy wrote: