Forum Home Forum Home > Progressive Music Lounges > Prog Polls
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Styx Grand Illusion
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Styx Grand Illusion
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
Poll Question: Is this Prog Rock or AOR?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
13 [52.00%]
12 [48.00%]
You can not vote in this poll

Author
Message
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
bardberic View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: November 02 2021
Location: PA, USA/Israel
Status: Offline
Points: 799 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bardberic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Styx Grand Illusion
    Posted: August 06 2022 at 20:43
I'm struggling to make this determination myself, as I reclassify some albums on my computer. This was right at the crossroads of the two genres. To my surprise, I'm finding myself leaning more towards proper prog rock for this one - it wasn't until their next album that they really deeply delved into AOR.

Come Sail Away is really the only AOR track on this one imo. The reset is prog.

What do you think?

Edit 1: I've made up my mind... it's prog rock. Not quite AOR, yet, imo. Still want to hear your opinions.
Edit 2: Even Come Sail Away is proper prog, imo...


Edited by bardberic - August 06 2022 at 20:51
Back to Top
Manuel View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: March 09 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 12418 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Manuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2022 at 21:05
Grand Illusion is certainly prog.
Back to Top
The Dark Elf View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar
VIP Member

Joined: February 01 2011
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline
Points: 12730 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Dark Elf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2022 at 21:09
I've never considered them to be a prog band. There wasn't really anything "progressive" about their sound, particularly when this album came out in 1977. It had all been done previously.
...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
Back to Top
bardberic View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: November 02 2021
Location: PA, USA/Israel
Status: Offline
Points: 799 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bardberic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2022 at 21:20
Originally posted by Manuel Manuel wrote:

Grand Illusion is certainly prog.

Thank you! I thought I'm going crazy or something. Everyone, even on RYM, is telling me I'm wrong lol


Edited by bardberic - August 06 2022 at 21:20
Back to Top
bardberic View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: November 02 2021
Location: PA, USA/Israel
Status: Offline
Points: 799 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bardberic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2022 at 21:39
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

I've never considered them to be a prog band. There wasn't really anything "progressive" about their sound, particularly when this album came out in 1977. It had all been done previously.


Well then what about bands like Spock's Beard? They haven't done anything that hadn't yet been done. Or Wilderun?

Prog doesn't necessarily mean inventive... if that were the case, then Korn would be prog, which they certainly were not...


Edited by bardberic - August 06 2022 at 21:41
Back to Top
AFlowerKingCrimson View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: October 02 2016
Location: Philly burbs
Status: Offline
Points: 16334 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2022 at 22:42
I would say this particular album is probably half and half. Styx are one of those not quite prog bands imo though.
Back to Top
bardberic View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: November 02 2021
Location: PA, USA/Israel
Status: Offline
Points: 799 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bardberic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2022 at 23:10
Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

I would say this particular album is probably half and half. Styx are one of those not quite prog bands imo though.


That's exactly what I'm feeling, and why it is so hard for me to choose on my computer.

I suppose I'm going with progressive rock for all tracks except COme Sail Away and The Grand Finale, and I'm still deciding for Superstars

Edit 1: I decdided to keep the whole album as progressive rock, but I labeled the version of Come Sail Away sung by Eric Cartman from the South Park Chef Aid album as AOR just because this song really does cross the boundaries of both genres

Edit 2: Actually I even kept the Eric Cartman version as Prog Rock as it did NOT sound right when comparing it to other AOR tracks.


Edited by bardberic - August 06 2022 at 23:35
Back to Top
Progosopher View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May 12 2009
Location: Coolwood
Status: Offline
Points: 6395 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Progosopher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2022 at 23:52
Accessible, but Prog nonetheless.
The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty"
Back to Top
Jared View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May 06 2005
Location: Hereford, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 17581 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jared Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 00:44
Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

I would say this particular album is probably half and half. Styx are one of those not quite prog bands imo though.

Grand Illusion is probably their best album in my opinion, but I think this is where I stand, too. 
Music has always been a matter of energy to me. On some nights I believe that a car with the needle on empty can run 50 more miles if you have the right music very loud on the radio. Hunter S Thompson
Back to Top
Hercules View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: June 14 2007
Location: Near York UK
Status: Offline
Points: 7024 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hercules Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 04:35
The Grand Illusion is prog, but neither very innovative nor particularly good (or bad) prog.
Prog does not actually have to be innovative to be prog.
That said, I've owned the album since the 1970s and I cannot remember playing it the last 30 years.
A TVR is not a car. It's a way of life.
Back to Top
bardberic View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: November 02 2021
Location: PA, USA/Israel
Status: Offline
Points: 799 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bardberic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 05:04
Originally posted by Hercules Hercules wrote:

The Grand Illusion is prog, but neither very innovative nor particularly good (or bad) prog.
Prog does not actually have to be innovative to be prog.
That said, I've owned the album since the 1970s and I cannot remember playing it the last 30 years.


Yes I agree. I have it rated on RYM as a whopping 2.5 stars lol. It's listenable, but I'd almost always rather put on Kansas or Yes if I wanted traditional synth-heavy prog. This might have been the first time I listened to it in five years, since I purchased the album. I just think because of how synth heavy and generic it sounds people just jump on the AOR bandwagon, tbh. The funny thing is, Styx may be the only classic rock-era prog band for whom I actually prefer their AOR stuff to their prog stuff... Kansas I can tolerate, but the others from the era kinda suck. Probably because they were a pioneer of AOR.
Back to Top
mathman0806 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 06 2014
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 6002 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mathman0806 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 05:50
On an aside, I think of AOR = "album oriented rock" as a format for radio stations I listened to in late 70s/early 80s, not a type of music. There were characteristics that different rock songs had bands played that fit that format but it wouldn't necessarily be a style. So, Styx had AOR songs, as did Floyd, Tull, Zeppelin, the Who, Boston, Aerosmith, ... now I somtimes conflate AOR with arena rock, which Styx would fit. I think if someone asked me kind of music Styx plays, I would just give it the broad "rock" label.
Back to Top
Psychedelic Paul View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: September 16 2019
Location: Nottingham, U.K
Status: Offline
Points: 35012 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 06:04
I've always classed Styx as an Arena Rock (or AOR) band in my Artists & Albums database, but that doesn't mean they can't be a Prog-Rock band too, although if the name is anything to go by, Styx should be classed as an Underground band. Tongue
Back to Top
suitkees View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: July 19 2020
Location: France
Status: Offline
Points: 8773 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote suitkees Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 07:46
I like the album and I don't care what genre label one wants to stick on it. You could call it pomp rock, rock grotesque, over-the-top rock... the music remains the same. But I personally prefer the Pieces of Eight album.

The razamataz is a pain in the bum
Back to Top
Cristi View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Crossover / Prog Metal Teams

Joined: July 27 2006
Location: wonderland
Status: Online
Points: 41408 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 07:51
Originally posted by suitkees suitkees wrote:

I like the album and I don't care what genre label one wants to stick on it. 

true Thumbs Up
Back to Top
earlyprog View Drop Down
Collaborator
Collaborator
Avatar
Neo / PSIKE / Heavy Teams

Joined: March 05 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 2098 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote earlyprog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 08:15
Originally posted by bardberic bardberic wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

I would say this particular album is probably half and half. Styx are one of those not quite prog bands imo though.


That's exactly what I'm feeling, and why it is so hard for me to choose on my computer.

I suppose I'm going with progressive rock for all tracks except COme Sail Away and The Grand Finale, and I'm still deciding for Superstars

Your indecision is not surprising. This is exactly why they are labelled prog related on PA which by the way is not a prog genre.
Back to Top
Rednight View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 18 2014
Location: Mar Vista, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 4807 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rednight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 09:25
A couple of its tracks are proggy, but that's not saying much.
"It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon [?] it." - Eno
Back to Top
geekfreak View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 21 2013
Location: Musical Garden
Status: Offline
Points: 9872 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote geekfreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 09:39
Originally posted by bardberic bardberic wrote:

Originally posted by Manuel Manuel wrote:

Grand Illusion is certainly prog.

Thank you! I thought I'm going crazy or something. Everyone, even on RYM, is telling me I'm wrong lol


Absolutely Progressive Rock
Friedrich Nietzsche: "Without music, life would be a mistake."



Music Is Live

Two people are better off than one, for they can help each other succeed.



Keep Calm And Listen To The Music…
<
Back to Top
The Dark Elf View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar
VIP Member

Joined: February 01 2011
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline
Points: 12730 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Dark Elf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 12:02
Originally posted by bardberic bardberic wrote:

Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

I've never considered them to be a prog band. There wasn't really anything "progressive" about their sound, particularly when this album came out in 1977. It had all been done previously.


Well then what about bands like Spock's Beard? They haven't done anything that hadn't yet been done. Or Wilderun?

Prog doesn't necessarily mean inventive... if that were the case, then Korn would be prog, which they certainly were not...

Rehashing old sh*t is not progressive. You've put a bow on some old dung. 
...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
Back to Top
Jeffro View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: March 29 2014
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 2057 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeffro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 07 2022 at 13:25
I hate the term AOR. "AOR" was created as a radio format, not a type of music. Why can't it simply be rock, or classic rock? Besides, it's a stupid term. Any rock that's on an album is be definition album oriented. 

That being said, Grand Illusion is prog rock enough, at least in places, for me. It's not King Crimson, It's not PFM, it's not even Genesis but "prog" has, and should have, a broader meaning.  
We all live in an amber subdomain, amber subdomain, amber subdomain.

My face IS a maserati
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.469 seconds.
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.