Swedish progg vs. progressive rock - Progressive Rock Music Forum

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Abstrakt

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Topic: Swedish progg vs. progressive rock
Posted: August 04 2006 at 12:17

There's a difference:

Prog:

Samla Mammas Manna

Kebnekaise

Progg:

Kebnekaise (On Their First Album, "Resa Mot Okänt Mål")

Blå Tåget

Hoola Bandoola Band

Grus i Dojjan

And i really think that Progg should be a subgenre on PA!

Evans

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Posted: August 04 2006 at 09:56

I'm just envious because you explained it a lot better than me. :)

pirkka

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Posted: August 04 2006 at 09:06

Evans wrote:

Well, you're not friends with ME, after you STOLE my post! :)

Hope I simplyfied things a little

Evans

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Posted: August 04 2006 at 07:53

Well, you're not friends with ME, after you STOLE my post! :)

Evans

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Posted: August 04 2006 at 07:45

This is extremely complicated...
An example of a swedish progg-band is Blå tåget ("the blue train"), a political band that was very left wing and had absolutely NOTHING to do with "our" prog, but somehow people here in sweden just love to mix the two genres up and iäve even heard people refer to Änglagård as "progg", putting them in the same pot as Blå Tåget and Nationalteatern, which is just... wrong. Therefore, swedish prog IS the same as italian, spanish, british, etc.. but swedish PROGG is a completely different thing. This might only be relevant to swedes, as others haven't heard of "proGG" and... i envy them. :)
Or i could be completely wrong, but in that case anyone is more than welcome to correct me.

pirkka

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Posted: August 04 2006 at 07:41

Hi,

the confusion between Swedish progg and progressive rock has a simple explanation. Progressive rock is called in sweden Symphonic rock. Progg on the contrary in Sweden is POLITICAL underground songs. Nothing to do with progressive rock what so ever. If some of these political bands did music that might sound like prog that is a coincidance. Usually Swedish progg is socialist or some other way socially critical songs that sound a bit raw and has some folk leanings.

Pirkka from Finland, who has a lot of swedish friends.

Sean Trane View Drop Down

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Posted: August 04 2006 at 05:58

Well I've been re-listening to Kebnekaise recently and I had discovered Algarnas Tradgard last year! Both excellent bands well worth their inclusion in Folk Prog

Are there anymore such groups around?

let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword

BookAboutSalad View Drop Down

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Posted: April 10 2006 at 19:17

Very interesting thread I've been thinking quite much about this.

And there are actually some progg-related bands on prog-archives, Samla Mammas Manna for example, are kind of progg in my view.

And I still can't wait until the day I can find Philemon Arthur on Rio-Avant and why not Mora Träsk?

Heraclea

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Posted: March 15 2006 at 11:48

Woah. 'Twas a while since I last checked in here. Nice to see that the thread is still alive and well. I have, though, thought a bit more over the progg vs. prog question (mainly by listening to music from both genres) and partly changed my stance on this. I'm still in favour of a "progg" sub-genre, but I don't think all the progg bands should be included, since there are some clear examples of "definately not progressive rock" like Knutna Nävar. Why am then still in favour of a "progg"-sub genre? Because I still think that many of the progg bands meet the criterias for being included here, but never saw themselves as anything but progg bands. Nationalteatern and Hoola Bandoola Band may not fit into progressive rock entirely musically, but they sure do lyrically, and also regarding their intentions with the music, which was truly progressive. I would not like to call this kind of progg bands for just "rock", since they aren't just "rock" but have clear progressive elements in their music, even though it might be of another sort than bands like Yes, Kansas, Amon Düül II, Caravan etc. Some bands are already included, and yet more should definately be included in either those respective sub-genres already existing, or into a new "progressive progg" sub-genre, which at least I am in favour of (prog-progg... what a name...).

I think DallasBryan's statement of "different cultures, just as progressive" is a quite fitting one. Anyone else who has opinions?

S Lang

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Posted: March 06 2006 at 14:03

In my youth (in the 70's) I had a sizeable record collection that included dozens of Scandinavian artists. Most of those would easily qualify for Prog, while some of them represented Jazzier elements. Scandinavian music has it's own, unmistakeable flavour - like Krautrock does - and I'd be very pleased to see more exposure of bands, releases.

Harkmark

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Posted: March 05 2006 at 19:09

Check out http://www.silence.se. Albums by Älgarnas Trädgård, Bo Hansson, Kebnekaise, Samma/Zamla, Ragnarök, Träd, Gräs och Stenar, (International) Harvester etc. all streamed. And don't forget to listen to "Dagarnas skum" by Ragnarök. A truly beautiful song.

nobody

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Posted: March 05 2006 at 18:38

The Parson Sound, International Harvester, Harvester and Trad, Gras och Stenar albums are absolutely essential, no prog collection can even hope to be complete without a few of them, especially these 2 masterpieces:

Great, great thread!

"Some of you are going to die... martyrs, of course, to the Freedom I will provide!"

eugene

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Posted: March 05 2006 at 14:29

DallasBryan wrote:

.....
guess what Swedish prog, French prog, Italian prog,
German prog are all just as much PROGRESSIVE
ROCK as English prog. Just different cultures, styles
and influences.

Now Prog Metal and Neo Prog may be something
else, maybe REGRESSIVE PROG!

???

That's exactly what I think!

carefulwiththataxe

DallasBryan View Drop Down

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Posted: March 05 2006 at 12:32

Mnemosyne wrote:
actually i think the "Progg" movement of sweden is
more related to the Krautrock movement in Germany
(which is a prog sub-genre), than to Progressive
Rock as a whole...

guess what Swedish prog, French prog, Italian prog,
German prog are all just as much PROGRESSIVE
ROCK as English prog. Just different cultures, styles
and influences.

Now Prog Metal and Neo Prog may be something
else, maybe REGRESSIVE PROG!

Edited by DallasBryan

Easy Livin View Drop Down

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Posted: March 05 2006 at 06:57

This thread has sufficient references to prog for me to place it in the Prog Music lounge.

It's interesting too!

erik neuteboom View Drop Down

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Posted: March 05 2006 at 06:46

Once I got a promo from the duo Hansson & Karlsson, splendid Hammond driven jazzy progressive rock. They joined the bill with Zappa and Jimi Hendrix in Sweden! I hardly read anything about them. What's your opinion, Heraclea, are they progressive rock and deserve a place on Prog Archives?

By the way, my favorite Swedish bands are Landberk (awesome Mellotron on Lonely land), Anekdoten (from a KC clone turned into a band with a very distinctive progrock sound) and Simon Says (very alternating and dynamic progrock).

Rocktopus

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Posted: March 05 2006 at 05:09

I saw Träd Gräs och Stenar (means Trees, Grass and Stones, great name!) last night. They played in my old Art Shcool Academy's Bar (Spasibar in Oslo). They were great! Most of their songs run over ten minutes, building up slowly. All the performances were suprisingly tight and well played. (Except a cover of 'Quinn the Eskimo', that was totally out of place.) Pshychedelic an spacey.

Their website www.tgs.nu is ok, but you won't find any soundsamples. They have also gone under the names Pärson Sound, International Harvester and Harvester. The one song I've heard ('Sanningens Silverflod',) from a Swedish Progg collection, what my friends tell me, and the concert, makes me think thes should be in the archives.

Probably some Swedes on this site knows more about them than I do?

Over land and under ashes
In the sunlight, see - it flashes
Find a fly and eat his eye
But don't believe in me
Don't believe in me
Don't believe in me

Frasse

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Posted: January 07 2006 at 15:33

Heraclea wrote:

When it comes to Hoola Bandoola Band, what in their sound make them less prog than Trettioåriga Kriget, really? Sure, Trettioåriga Kriget has some long, "pure" prog compositions, but most of what I've heard (all studio albums except one, I think) doesn't sound very much different than Hoola Bandoola or Nationalteatern to me, even though the political message isn't as obvious.

I haven't heard Trettioåriga kriget but I've heard Hoola Bandoola Band and in my ears they are just Rock.

Heraclea

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Posted: January 07 2006 at 02:46

When it comes to Nationalteatern, what about "Rövarkungens Ö"? That certainly sounds proggy in my opinion. Then we have the consideration of their children stories, like "Kåldolmar & Kalsipper". Sure, it has a quite silly theme (but then, there are prog songs by very famous bands with sillier themes and lyrics), but it is, in a way, a concept album, and it includes many other prog elements.

When it comes to Hoola Bandoola Band, what in their sound make them less prog than Trettioåriga Kriget, really? Sure, Trettioåriga Kriget has some long, "pure" prog compositions, but most of what I've heard (all studio albums except one, I think) doesn't sound very much different than Hoola Bandoola or Nationalteatern to me, even though the political message isn't as obvious.

And you state yourself reasons for inclusion/prog elements, even though you don't agree with me. Why I personally am in favour of making progg a sub-genre is mostly because even though you can, in some ways, fit in bands like Philemon Arthur & The Dung, Arbete & Fritid etc. into the existing sub-genres, it goes, in some ways, against the intentions of the music and the musicians themselves.

Frasse

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Posted: January 06 2006 at 19:06

Heraclea wrote:

Since this seemed the right place to post...

So, where to draw the line? Could Hoola Bandoola Band be considered progressive rock? No, but I like "Cheops Pyramid". Nationalteatern? No, the only proggy song with them that I can think of is "Barn av vår tid". Tältprojektet?No, but they were way more ambitious than any of the 70s dinosaurs. Nynningen?No, but the idea of making rock out of Majakovskijs poems. Isn't Philemon Arthur & The Dung really a brilliant example of avant-prog? Hehe, yep!

Opinions, please!

Progg should not be added as a sub-genre to Prog IMHO but there are a more progg-bands that could be added in PA in other sub-genres. For example: Fläsket Brinner.