Moody Blues(#1 Prog)

I agree with Atkingani, I always believed and said that if The Moody Blues were ever Progressive as when Patrick Moraz joined them instead of Pinder and relased the incredible "Long  Distance Voyager".

This album is an oasis of quality in the middle of infamous  Disco, mediocre Punk, boring New Age, ans tedious New Wave.

IMO the one of the best if not the best album of the 80's

Iván

I forgot to list that I heard the first King Crimson album before ELP or Yes

akin wrote: I disagree with the definition of proto-prog. The Nice, Procol Harum and The Moody Blues made the progressive rock from 67 and 68 (along with the Beatles, for example, the White Album, Deep Purple first two albuns and so on). Their progressive rock isn't like King Crimson, Yes, but it is progressive rock, because they used new recording techniques, new instruments unusual to rock, folk, jazz and classical influences, signature changes, experimentation, some of them conceptual albums and so on. Ok, Nights in white satin is a beautiful ballad, but it is a long song, with loads of mellotron, an instrumental section with flute, the orchestra and it is progressive, mainly looking at the concept of the whole album.  In the Court of Crimson King has two Jazz avantgarde experimentations (21th century schizoid man and Moonchild) and three "ballads à la Moody Blues" (I talk to the Wind, Epitaph and In the Court of Crimson King). There is any doubt these songs are progressive? Not at all.

It's nice to hear you say this.  The Moody Blues give prog one of its meta-narratives, the quest for the holy grail, the lost chord.  Genesis, Gentle Giant and Yes all pick up on this. The Court would not have been the same without the Moodies. Although like you stated there is 21st SCM, which is jazz and the improv of Moonchild, the majority of the album is romantic schmaltz a la the Moodies. I am passionate about this, like yourself, becasue I often read authors who say things like the moodies were important but nobody listens to them any more.  I went to see them a couple of years back at Radio City, a pretty big hall.  People are listening. I actually started a thread like this two weeks ago and gave my defense of Days as the first truly prog album.

cheers

Before I started visiting this site I never remotely thought that the Moody Blues were a prog band.  I like Nights In White Satin, but if it's considered prog, then what is A Day In The Life or Strawberry Fields Forever or Within You Without You?  All those songs, in my opinion, are much more progressive.

ivan_2068 wrote: micky wrote: hahhah... not to give you a flippant answer to your inquiry but.... some people see what is and what is not prog differently from you.  I've seen Yes described...accurately?... as nothing more than an trumped up  pop group.  You obviously see anything with pop tendancies as not prog.  I respect that, but I don't agree.  I suscribe to the train of thought that prog was a movement rather than something that is black and white musically.  How else to rationalize such diverse musical groups such as Magma, Faust, Gryphon, Frank Zappa, and Hawkwind being all considered prog. Yes Micky, and that's why we're here, each one of us has a different perspective, and we can freely discuss it, sometimes we'll reach an agreement, some others not. I believe Days of Future Passed is a good album, but the orcheestra sounds too artificial, as overplaced at the beginning and the end of each track. The Orchestra never blends with the central song, and please, you can't argue that Nights in White Satin and Tuesday Afternoon without that pompous and artificial orchestra are nothuing else than sweet ballads. Have you checked the later example I give of Forever Autumn, it's the exact case: The summer sun is fading as the year grows old And darker days are drawing near. The winter winds will be much colder Now you're not here. I watch the birds fly south across the autumn sky And one by one they disappear. I wish that I was flying with them Now you're not here. Like the sun through the trees you came to love me. Like a leaf on a breeze you blew away. Through autumn's golden gown we used to kick our way, You always loved this time of year. Those fallen leaves lie undisturbed now 'Cause you're not here. 'Cause you're not here. 'Cause you're not here. Like the sun through the trees you came to love me, Like a leaf on a breeze you blew away. A gentle rain falls softly on my weary eyes As if to hide a lonely tear, My life will be forever autumn 'Cause you're not here. 'Cause you're not here. 'Cause you're not here. the lyrics of forever Autumn are so ambiguous and vague that make sense to the concept of a husband looking for his wife in a war against martians and as a love song for Valentines Day. Justin took it out of the War of the Worlds context, erased the narration and orchestra and vouila a top 40 single, the same case as in Tuesday's Afternoon and Nights in White Satin. NetsNJFan wrote: Quote: I feel that the orchestra on DOFP was integrated incredibly well for such an early effort, the Moodies admirably share the stage with them. Nets, please listen this album if you have it: Especially the highligted tracks 2. Tuesday Afternoon (Forever Afternoon) (4:14) 3. Nights In White Satin (4:27) 12. Forever Autumn (4:33) You'll notice that this are tracks from Days of Future Passed and the last one from The War of the Worlds out of their conceptual environment, and all of them are nothing but sweet ballads without the pompous orchestration. Iván

The orchestra is not integrated.  It comes in and out of the songs, which stand alone. I love the orchestra because it is tacky.  As you said, it sounds like an artificial presense, much like a movie soundtrack. The Brits were never famous for their orchestrations.  But it also has an impressionistic quality that often adds to the romantic quality of the songs.

As much as one can say the Beatles influenced them, the Beatles never took the use of timbre to the level that the Moodies did. Martin used the string quartet on Eleanor Rigby to give it an aristocratic air, and Harrison the sitar to make a religious statement.  They might have been successful in creating a sense of mood but that was not intended.

The Moodies exceled in the use of timbre to create mood. On Days, every song on the album is unique and highlights a style as representative of a time of day.  This gives the band the opportunity to play with timbres: guitar sounds, the flute, sitar and mellotron. The later instruments are are used to create a sense of romantic alienation, which is really the essense of early prog, (as much as Gabriel's lyrics try to grant it a socio-political stance and thankfully save it from oblivion.)  They transport you and take you out of the pop song structure. Early prog is a quest for the grail, something transcendent and holy.  The Moodies portrayed that better than The Beatles ever did and made it the essense of who they were as a band.

Crimson used these instruments in the same way on those first two albums. People think of that first album and they think of Schizoid Man but really, that song is so much different than the romantic, moodiness and sense of alienation that the rest of the album grants.

micky wrote: hahhah... not to give you a flippant answer to your inquiry but.... some people see what is and what is not prog differently from you.  I've seen Yes described...accurately?... as nothing more than an trumped up  pop group.  You obviously see anything with pop tendancies as not prog.  I respect that, but I don't agree.  I suscribe to the train of thought that prog was a movement rather than something that is black and white musically.  How else to rationalize such diverse musical groups such as Magma, Faust, Gryphon, Frank Zappa, and Hawkwind being all considered prog.

Yes Micky, and that's why we're here, each one of us has a different perspective, and we can freely discuss it, sometimes we'll reach an agreement, some others not.

I believe Days of Future Passed is a good album, but the orcheestra sounds too artificial, as overplaced at the beginning and the end of each track.

The Orchestra never blends with the central song, and please, you can't argue that Nights in White Satin and Tuesday Afternoon without that pompous and artificial orchestra are nothuing else than sweet ballads.

Have you checked the later example I give of Forever Autumn, it's the exact case:

The summer sun is fading as the year grows old
And darker days are drawing near.
The winter winds will be much colder
Now you're not here.

I watch the birds fly south across the autumn sky
And one by one they disappear.
I wish that I was flying with them
Now you're not here.

Like the sun through the trees you came to love me.
Like a leaf on a breeze you blew away.

Through autumn's golden gown we used to kick our way,
You always loved this time of year.
Those fallen leaves lie undisturbed now
'Cause you're not here.
'Cause you're not here.
'Cause you're not here.

Like the sun through the trees you came to love me,
Like a leaf on a breeze you blew away.

A gentle rain falls softly on my weary eyes
As if to hide a lonely tear,
My life will be forever autumn
'Cause you're not here.
'Cause you're not here.
'Cause you're not here.

the lyrics of forever Autumn are so ambiguous and vague that make sense to the concept of a husband looking for his wife in a war against martians and as a love song for Valentines Day.

Justin took it out of the War of the Worlds context, erased the narration and orchestra and vouila a top 40 single, the same case as in Tuesday's Afternoon and Nights in White Satin.

NetsNJFan wrote:

Nets, please listen this album if you have it:

Especially the highligted tracks

2. Tuesday Afternoon (Forever Afternoon) (4:14)
3. Nights In White Satin (4:27)
12. Forever Autumn (4:33)

You'll notice that this are tracks from Days of Future Passed and the last one from The War of the Worlds out of their conceptual environment, and all of them are nothing but sweet ballads without the pompous orchestration.

Iván