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Asyte2c00 
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 Topic: Kate Bush: Avant-Garde for Women
Posted: March 23 2007 at 16:45 |
Recently, I have started a Kate Bush binge, listening to her first five albums incessantly. I realized of all the female artists I have listened to, she is clearly the most avant-garde, female pop artists i have ever listedned to. I enjoy her msuic a lot.
I realize Deborah Perry and Dagmar Kraus are considered genuine Avant-Garde rock, however, a few of Kate Bushes' s record ohave rare streaks of avant-garde brilliance and brilliant flashes of music genius.
For the most part, I beelieve most of Kate Bushes' material is more accessible than true avant-garde such as French TV, Hella, OOIOO, and Estradasphere.
Do women listein to Kate Bush becasue she creates the perfect balalnce of avant-garde and pop sensibility?
Discuss
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memowakeman
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 16:55 |
Iīve been listening to Kate Bush so much lately, love her as well.
I share your feelings about how avant -garde was she in the 70s/80s as a pop artist, her music and lyrics are very intelligent, definitely Kateīs music is more accesible than French TV or OOIOO, and since im not a woman, i donīt know the if they listen to Kate because of the balance you pointed out.
Probably Raffaella could tell us something about that.
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Blacksword
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:08 |
Ah good, at last a thread devoted to the brilliant Kate Bush!  To be honest I've not known many women who listen to Kate Bush, but plenty of men seem to respond to her music. She is an indredible artist, who has enjoyed a great deal of commercial success in the UK. She has done this, pure and simple by being a brilliant and truly original songwriter. Very few artists after the 70's enjoyed gold or platinum album sales for something as challenging and progressive as 'The Dreaming' or 'Hounds of Love'
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Blacksword
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:11 |
 memowakeman wrote:
Iīve been listening to Kate Bush so much lately, love her as well.
I share your feelings about how avant -garde was she in the 70s/80s as a pop artist, her music and lyrics are very intelligent, definitely Kateīs music is more accesible than French TV or OOIOO, and since im not a woman, i donīt know the if they listen to Kate because of the balance you pointed out.
Probably Raffaella could tell us something about that. |
In her singles she deals with subject matter that so many other artists either wouldn't dare go near, or for whom it wouldn't even consider tackling. 'Breathing' is a good example; a nuclear war from the POV of an unborn baby! Great intelligence as you say, and such a wonderful imagination.
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Asyte2c00
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:11 |
Yeah, she was somewhat of an ananamoly of her time. Inaccessible avant-garde music with intelligent lyrics managing to thrive in the 80s pop music market.
She is great.
As far as her fanbase grows, I believe men liste to Kate Bush becasue we find brief moments of pruient brilliance within her music. She has an amazing voice, and the 70s, she was really hot.
Edited by Asyte2c00 - March 23 2007 at 17:12
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Asyte2c00
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:16 |
Blacksword wrote:
memowakeman wrote:
Iīve been listening to Kate Bush so much lately, love her as well.
I share your feelings about how avant -garde was she in the 70s/80s as a pop artist, her music and lyrics are very intelligent, definitely Kateīs music is more accesible than French TV or OOIOO, and since im not a woman, i donīt know the if they listen to Kate because of the balance you pointed out.
Probably Raffaella could tell us something about that. |
In her singles she deals with subject matter that so many other artists either wouldn't dare go near, or for whom it wouldn't even consider tackling. 'Breathing' is a good example; a nuclear war from the POV of an unborn baby!
Great intelligence as you say, and such a wonderful imagination. |
The controversial nature of many of her song only adds to her uniqueness as an artist.
"Babooshka" is an interesting take on strugglign relationships. The way its qritten reminds me a lot of "The Letters" by King Crimson on Islands.
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Blacksword
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:25 |
Asyte2c00 wrote:
Blacksword wrote:
memowakeman wrote:
Iīve been listening to Kate Bush so much lately, love her as well.
I share your feelings about how avant -garde was she in the 70s/80s as a pop artist, her music and lyrics are very intelligent, definitely Kateīs music is more accesible than French TV or OOIOO, and since im not a woman, i donīt know the if they listen to Kate because of the balance you pointed out.
Probably Raffaella could tell us something about that. |
In her singles she deals with subject matter that so many other artists either wouldn't dare go near, or for whom it wouldn't even consider tackling. 'Breathing' is a good example; a nuclear war from the POV of an unborn baby! Great intelligence as you say, and such a wonderful imagination. |
The controversial nature of many of her song only adds to her uniqueness as an artist.
"Babooshka" is an interesting take on strugglign relationships. The way its qritten reminds me a lot of "The Letters" by King Crimson on Islands. |
I agree, and I dont think many people realise what her songs are about when they hear them on the radio, or generally out of the album context. Non fans in other words. Babooshka is a good example of a song that can be enjoyed just for it's melodies and feel, but when you pay attention to the lyrics it's like a different book opening. One of my favourite Kate Bush songs is 'Blow Away (for Bill)' from 'Never Forver' a relativly normal lyric, but such beautiful melodies. My all time favourite is probably 'The Ninth Wave' In the 80's this was one of 'headphone favourites' This suite used to take me places that no other music had at the time.
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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memowakeman
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:29 |
Asyte2c00 wrote:
Yeah, she was somewhat of an ananamoly of her time. Inaccessible avant-garde music with intelligent lyrics managing to thrive in the 80s pop music market.
She is great.
As far as her fanbase grows, I believe men liste to Kate Bush becasue we find brief moments of pruient brilliance within her music. She has an amazing voice, and the 70s, she was really hot. |
I really concour with that statement, this week iīve listened to some of their albums and if my love for her was big, believe me that now is bigger... she is a unique artist,and i also find her very hot in her 70īs 
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chopper
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:36 |
Blacksword wrote:
Ah good, at last a thread devoted to the brilliant Kate Bush!
To be honest I've not known many women who listen to Kate Bush, but plenty of men seem to respond to her music. She is an indredible artist, who has enjoyed a great deal of commercial success in the UK. She has done this, pure and simple by being a brilliant and truly original songwriter. Very few artists after the 70's enjoyed gold or platinum album sales for something as challenging and progressive as 'The Dreaming' or 'Hounds of Love'
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My guess is women liked her first 2 albums, probably some of "Never for Ever" but then got a bit lost with "The Dreaming". She has probably regained some female fans with the last CD.
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Trickster F.
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:39 |
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Not sure why Kate Bush is for women. Most people who listen to her and Tori Amos are men, to my experience.
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Blacksword
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:44 |
Trickster F. wrote:
Not sure why Kate Bush is for women. Most people who listen to her and Tori Amos are men, to my experience. |
Thats my experience too. chopper, you may be right about the first two albums, though. KB actually got more prog as tgime went on. Going on how most women tend to react to prog, it's not surprising that most of her fans seem t be men.
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darksideof
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:49 |
Not only that she is a brilliant songwriter Her music suits her voice so well.
Also is mandatory to mentioned her excellent back up band of heirs studios albums. Can you believe that the master Eberhard Weber Played on severals of her masterpieces.  Bravo. |
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Peter
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 17:56 |
Blacksword wrote:
Trickster F. wrote:
Not sure why Kate Bush is for women. Most people who listen to her and Tori Amos are men, to my experience. |
Thats my experience too.
chopper, you may be right about the first two albums, though. KB actually got more prog as tgime went on. Going on how most women tend to react to prog, it's not surprising that most of her fans seem t be men. |
At the risk of sounding sexist (I'm not -- just speaking from my own observations), I find that most really dedicated music fans are male, for whatever reason(s).  Check out the membership here, for example, and look around you next time you're in a major record store. It's not just prog. (I see it at jazz concerts, & I'd find the same at a metal show too, I'd wager.) I've also met female music fans who say they don't like to listen to female singers!
Edited by Peter Rideout - March 23 2007 at 18:02
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"And, has thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!'
He chortled in his joy.
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Blacksword
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Posted: March 23 2007 at 18:06 |
Peter Rideout wrote:
Blacksword wrote:
Trickster F. wrote:
Not sure why Kate Bush is for women. Most people who listen to her and Tori Amos are men, to my experience. |
Thats my experience too.
chopper, you may be right about the first two albums, though. KB actually got more prog as tgime went on. Going on how most women tend to react to prog, it's not surprising that most of her fans seem t be men. |
At the risk of sounding sexist (I'm not -- just speaking from my own observations), I find that most really dedicated music fans are male, for whatever reason.Check out the membership here, for example, and look around you next time you're in a major record store.It's not just prog. (I see it at jazz concerts, & I'd find the same at a metal show too, I'd wager.)I've also met female music fans who say they don't like to listen to female singers! |
My ex girlfriend used to say that men are naturally more obsessional about things. Very few women, for example, take pride in their CD collection, and catalogue them, and arrange them alphabetically etc.. She had a nerve though, for a start she was a Rush fan, and more of a nerd about them than me! She collected tee shirts concert programs, the lot!  ..and hey she liked Kate Bush! But no other female artist.
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memowakeman
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Posted: March 24 2007 at 03:02 |
Blacksword wrote:
Peter Rideout wrote:
Blacksword wrote:
Trickster F. wrote:
Not sure why Kate Bush is for women. Most people who listen to her and Tori Amos are men, to my experience. |
Thats my experience too.
chopper, you may be right about the first two albums, though. KB actually got more prog as tgime went on. Going on how most women tend to react to prog, it's not surprising that most of her fans seem t be men. |
At the risk of sounding sexist (I'm not -- just speaking from my own observations), I find that most really dedicated music fans are male, for whatever reason.Check out the membership here, for example, and look around you next time you're in a major record store.It's not just prog. (I see it at jazz concerts, & I'd find the same at a metal show too, I'd wager.)I've also met female music fans who say they don't like to listen to female singers! |
My ex girlfriend used to say that men are naturally more obsessional about things. Very few women, for example, take pride in their CD collection, and catalogue them, and arrange them alphabetically etc..
She had a nerve though, for a start she was a Rush fan, and more of a nerd about them than me! She collected tee shirts concert programs, the lot! ..and hey she liked Kate Bush! But no other female artist. |
Why did you break up with her?  I know very few girls who likes music in general, as a lifestyle or hobbie i dont know, sadly i dont really know a girl who likes prog besides Floyd (old) or Opeth and Mars Volta  (new), seems that is a general issue as Peter pointed out, definitely men at least in my environment are much more music lovers than women.
I will ask to some female friends, but as far as i remember, no one even knows Kate Bush...
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Blacksword
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Posted: March 24 2007 at 05:28 |
memowakeman wrote:
Blacksword wrote:
Peter Rideout wrote:
Blacksword wrote:
Trickster F. wrote:
Not sure why Kate Bush is for women. Most people who listen to her and Tori Amos are men, to my experience. |
Thats my experience too. chopper, you may be right about the first two albums, though. KB actually got more prog as tgime went on. Going on how most women tend to react to prog, it's not surprising that most of her fans seem t be men. |
At the risk of sounding sexist (I'm not -- just speaking from my own observations), I find that most really dedicated music fans are male, for whatever reason.Check out the membership here, for example, and look around you next time you're in a major record store.It's not just prog. (I see it at jazz concerts, & I'd find the same at a metal show too, I'd wager.)I've also met female music fans who say they don't like to listen to female singers! |
My ex girlfriend used to say that men are naturally more obsessional about things. Very few women, for example, take pride in their CD collection, and catalogue them, and arrange them alphabetically etc.. She had a nerve though, for a start she was a Rush fan, and more of a nerd about them than me! She collected tee shirts concert programs, the lot! ..and hey she liked Kate Bush! But no other female artist. |
Why did you break up with her?
I know very few girls who likes music in general, as a lifestyle or hobbie i dont know, sadly i dont really know a girl who likes prog besides Floyd (old) or Opeth and Mars Volta (new), seems that is a general issue as Peter pointed out, definitely men at least in my environment are much more music lovers than women.
I will ask to some female friends, but as far as i remember, no one even knows Kate Bush... |
Oh, the break up was complicated and painful. Basically she didn't like Peter Gabriel.. She had to go..
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richardh
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Posted: March 24 2007 at 07:30 |
I started listening to Kate Bush because of the semi -orchestral musical arrangements. Wuthering Heights was very orginal for its time (1978) when the charts was full of new wave and dance music. She stood out from the crowd. Of all her albums The Dreaming and Hounds Of Love display her 'progressiveness' the best. Aerial is also excellent ,although there is nothing in her back catologue to be ashamed of!
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Raff
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Posted: March 24 2007 at 07:48 |
chopper wrote:
Blacksword wrote:
Ah good, at last a thread devoted to the brilliant Kate Bush!
To be honest I've not known many women who listen to Kate Bush, but plenty of men seem to respond to her music. She is an indredible artist, who has enjoyed a great deal of commercial success in the UK. She has done this, pure and simple by being a brilliant and truly original songwriter. Very few artists after the 70's enjoyed gold or platinum album sales for something as challenging and progressive as 'The Dreaming' or 'Hounds of Love'
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My guess is women liked her first 2 albums, probably some of "Never for Ever" but then got a bit lost with "The Dreaming". She has probably regained some female fans with the last CD.
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Great thread, at last!  I'm a longtime Kate fan, though - unlike most women - I'm not so keen on her first two albums. Conversely, I love everything from "Never for Ever" onwards, with the sole exception of the somewhat lame "The Red Shoes". Actually, one of my favourite albums by her is actually the rather avant-garde, progressive "The Dreaming", which still rates among my all-time favourites. What she did on that album alone with the use of diverse ethnic instruments, multi-tracked vocals, eerie noises and thought-provoking lyrics would've made her deserving of inclusion in PA. My all-time Kate favourite song is featured on that album - the utterly brilliant, heart-wrenching "Pull Out the Pin", in which the Vietnam war is viewed through the eyes of a vietcong: "Just one thing in it, me or him - And I love life...". Pure genius, if you ask me.
Edited by Ghost Rider - March 24 2007 at 07:50
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richardh
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Posted: March 24 2007 at 17:44 |
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Some of her lyrics seem almost too honest. (but I love them) thinking of Feel It and Infant Kiss especially.
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Asyte2c00
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Posted: March 24 2007 at 19:48 |
richardh wrote:
I started listening to Kate Bush because of the semi -orchestral musical arrangements. Wuthering Heights was very orginal for its time (1978) when the charts was full of new wave and dance music. She stood out from the crowd. Of all her albums The Dreaming and Hounds Of Love display her 'progressiveness' the best. Aerial is also excellent ,although there is nothing in her back catologue to be ashamed of!
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This astonished me as well. 1978, or the late 70s generally was when new wave on the risee. bans like The Police, Ultravox, Talking Heads, and The Pretenders were getting considerable airplay.
For the most part, these bands conformed to the burgeoning new wave, synth sound .
"Wuthering Heights" with its unusual vocal performance, intricate lyrical meaning, and surprisingly memorable melody can be considered an anamoly of the time. I was shocked when I first listened to The Kick Inside and Lionheart how it sounded nothing like the en vogue sound of the time
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Kate Bush: Avant-Garde for Women
