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AOR_Crazy 
Forum Newbie 
Joined: April 10 2007 Location: Croatia Status: Offline Points: 10 |
 Posted: April 21 2007 at 14:01 |
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Yeah, i understand you. I'm talking about The Tubes cause i think that Stranglers have absolutely nothing with prog or art rock, but that's me. Concerning Tubes, yes, they tend to surprise you in their songs but those surprises are a bit to simple for me to put them into prog, well maybe into Art Rock. Being the one who grew up listening to Kansas,Yes, Genesis, Vandergraaf Generator, Gong'n'stuff like that it's hard for me to put some bands into progressive music although i'm open for discussion.
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erik neuteboom
Prog Reviewer 
Joined: July 27 2005 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 7659 |
Posted: April 21 2007 at 14:58 |
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Well, I am from 1960 and I grew up with the symphonic rock dinosaurs in the Seventies and with the neo-prog in The Eighties and nonethless, I have the idea that The Stranglers and The Tubes have some very nice progressive ideas to offer.
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Moogtron III
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 26 2005 Location: Belgium Status: Offline Points: 10616 |
Posted: April 21 2007 at 16:24 |
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Well, if the Tubes come in, Split Enz has to come in. No, just joking, but I remember both bands had this theatrical side. Both bands had pictures in my school agenda (RIJAM) when I was at high school and I thought both looked very strange. I never would have imagined that years later I would be listening to albums by both The Tubes and Split Enz.
I like the Don't Touch Me There single the best, I think. It was some sort of parody, I suppose, but it worked out very well. Very good band.
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clarke2001
Special Collaborator 
Honorary Collaborator Joined: June 14 2006 Location: Croatia Status: Offline Points: 4160 |
Posted: April 21 2007 at 20:31 |
The Stranglers are definitely some sort of art-rock, but I don't see any relation with Queen  ...Stranglers' artism is based mostly on their theatrics and keyboard wizardry, and that type of art rock is closer to the XTC, even Television than Queen, IMHO. |
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erik neuteboom
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 27 2005 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 7659 |
Posted: April 22 2007 at 04:10 |
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OK Clarke2001, it's a bit confusing what I meant, this sounds better: "After their punk/new wave sound in the early years, to me The Stranglers sound as Art-Rock in the same category as Queen (inventive and progressive ideas with rock as the craddle)."
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AOR_Crazy
Forum Newbie
Joined: April 10 2007 Location: Croatia Status: Offline Points: 10 |
Posted: April 26 2007 at 22:29 |
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Oh gawd!? Come on, Television? XTC?? Split Enze???? I love all of those bands, but you're all confusing progressive music with early post punk/alternative music, hey!? think before typing damn it!!
"Television were one of the most creative bands to emerge from New York's punk scene of the mid-'70s, creating an influential new guitar vocabulary. While guitarists Tom Verlaine and Richard Lloyd liked to jam, they didn't follow the accepted rock structures for improvisation -- they removed the blues while retaining the raw energy of garage rock, adding complex, lyrical solo lines that recalled both jazz and rock. With its angular rhythms and fluid leads, Television's music always went in unconventional directions, laying the groundwork for many of the guitar-based post-punk pop groups of the late '70s and...." XTC: "XTC was one of the smartest -- and catchiest -- British pop bands to emerge from the punk and new wave explosion of the late '70s. From the tense, jerky riffs of their early singles to the lushly arranged, meticulous pop of their later albums, XTC's music has always been driven by the hook-laden songwriting of guitarist Andy Partridge and bassist Colin Moulding. While popular success has eluded them in both Britain and America, the group has developed a devoted cult following in both countries that remains loyal over two decades after their first records..." www.allmusic.com So where is Art Rock or Progressive here, Ok????? |
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erik neuteboom
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 27 2005 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 7659 |
Posted: April 27 2007 at 05:35 |
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AOR Crazy, would you mind to post a little less agressive than "think before you type, damm it", that will contribute to a more pleasant way of discussing, otherwise just another thread has to be closed because of "out of control reactions", OK? Thanks in advance!
Edited by erik neuteboom - April 27 2007 at 05:58 |
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AOR_Crazy
Forum Newbie
Joined: April 10 2007 Location: Croatia Status: Offline Points: 10 |
Posted: April 27 2007 at 06:26 |
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Hm, well, i didn't offend anybody, did i? You being so touchy, i'll just pull myself outta here...
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clarke2001
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: June 14 2006 Location: Croatia Status: Offline Points: 4160 |
Posted: April 27 2007 at 10:38 |
AorCrazy, I am not confusing progressive rock with post punk/new wave, and I was not implying anything regarding these bands - just making a line of comparison of a certain artism similar to The Stranglers's artistic approach - everything was clearly explained couple of posts before. |
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richardh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 26228 |
Posted: April 27 2007 at 12:02 |
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I would be happy for both to be added.Both had strong progressive ideas IMO..
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 23 2005 Location: Caerdydd Status: Offline Points: 32995 |
Posted: April 27 2007 at 12:17 |
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I can hear some Prog influence in The Stranglers, but feel uncomfortable with their addition. It just doesn't sit right with me.
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Dick Heath
Special Collaborator
Jazz-Rock Specialist Joined: April 19 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 12801 |
Posted: April 27 2007 at 12:29 |
Totally agree.
Any respecting band ought move on (literally 'progress') unless they have subjected themselves to Simon Cowell's or Pete Waterman's level of musical castration. But developing the music, taking on different influences, occasionally demonstrating a smattering of originally, doesn't make them progressive rock. Too often the latest wunderkind to grace the dubious charts, sounds to be closely related to 60's musicians who did really originate the new, often through hybridisation of their music. I strongly suggest there should be (but I thought there was from the very start) a clear definition of what a progressive rock is and close the door to any band that doesn't meet well argued critieria for the genre. We may be one of the biggest prog sites on the web, but also in danger of being the biggest laughing stock for the OVER liberal inclusion of bands.
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The best eclectic music on the Web,8-11pm BST/GMT THURS.
CLICK ON: http://www.lborosu.org.uk/media/lcr/live.php Host by PA's Dick Heath. |
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erik neuteboom
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 27 2005 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 7659 |
Posted: April 27 2007 at 18:43 |
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Well fellow progheads, since M@X his 'The Beatles addition move' this site is no longer about progressive rock but about music with progressive tendencies, it would be better to change the name into Prog Music Archives. And in my opinion The Tubes and The Stranglers match with Art-rock with their music in the late Seventies and in The Eighties. Or ... ? Edited by erik neuteboom - April 27 2007 at 18:46 |
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Floydoid
Forum Senior Member 
Joined: April 02 2007 Location: Planet Prog Status: Offline Points: 952 |
Posted: May 03 2007 at 12:10 |
I think the inclusion of the Beatles is justified as you can find some of the seeds of prog on albums such as Revolver, Sgt Pepper & the White Album. The Tubes & Stranglers may have been influenced by prog, and their music may contain prog elements, but I don't see that alone as justification for their inclusion. On a side note, punk purists also argue as to whether the Stranglers were really a punk band or not. |
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'We're going to need a bigger swear jar.'
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erik neuteboom
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 27 2005 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 7659 |
Posted: May 03 2007 at 13:34 |
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At least The Tubes are an interesting band to add, yesterday I listened to their 2-CD compilation Going Down, it contains so many great songs with progressive ideas and it often blends several styles.
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Joolz
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 24 2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1377 |
Posted: May 03 2007 at 19:50 |
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^^^^
"progressive ideas" .... yeah, they were a pretty inventive bunch in those days ... their big hit "White Punks On Dope" easily fits the Prog bill .... my favourite album is the live "What Do You Want From Live" ... not a bad song on it and I love their rendition of "I Saw Her Standing There" amongst others... my only regret was not seeing them perform on that tour of UK ... they were banned in my area ... sadly, many authorities thought the band's theatrical stage show was unsuitable for us delicate flowers 
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erik neuteboom
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 27 2005 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 7659 |
Posted: May 04 2007 at 05:55 |
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Well Joolz, I witnessed that tour in 1979 and for me it was the start to become a The Tubes fan because I only went to their show because of the visuals and daring stage antics but in the end I was delighted about their music and impressed by the amount of vintage keyboards (including a fat Moog sound) that was used
 Edited by erik neuteboom - May 04 2007 at 05:56 |
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Cheesecakemouse
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 05 2006 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 1751 |
Posted: May 04 2007 at 06:00 |
Split Enz is in, the discography just has to be completed.  |
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Certif1ed
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: April 08 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 7559 |
Posted: May 08 2007 at 08:08 |
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Stranglers in Prog-Related, definitely.
"Golden Brown" is in 13/4...
Seriously, though, their music was "Intelligent Art Punk" to start off with, and got more and more artful in terms of composition - especially around the mid-1980s.
I don't know about the Tubes though - everything I've ever heard of theirs has been somewhat simple - ingeneously put together songs, but not with the devil-may-care approach that the Stranglers have, or the sheer slickness in composition.
Even "No More Heroes" (from "Rattus Norwegicus", their first album) has a complex arrangement - all the parts move contrapuntally on the whole - and the bass playing is amazing.
The repetitive nature of the riffs keeps their music out of fuill-blown prog - but that's only my criteria: There are plenty of bands considered Prog who utilise repetitive riffs.
Anyway - listen to "Aural Sculpture" - the name alone tells you it's art music.  Edited by Certif1ed - May 08 2007 at 08:09 |
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The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 23 2005 Location: Caerdydd Status: Offline Points: 32995 |
Posted: May 08 2007 at 08:11 |
*cough* Actually its from the album of the same title "No More Heroes"...
 ..The second album....*cough*....thanks. |
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The Tubes and The Stranglers
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erik neuteboom wrote: