Tool: Penning New Album!!

heyitsthatguy wrote: holy f**k its in drop d whoop it must be the same exact thing

I just like how he declares a band beyond the point of salvation because they released ONE album he did not like. He keeps talking about their slow decline, but they didn't do s**t for 5 years. I mean, it's nice to know that a band has to be genius 100% of the time to earn his approval. "What?! This album doesn't match up to the rest? F**k em, they are beyond hope!"

I will say that some of the songs on 10,000 Days use motifs and even riffs from Lateralus and Aenema, but they are by no means the same songs. Oh, and Maynard has no range anymore? Be honest, you're just trying to start something now. Maynard's vocals on this were some of the best in his career (The Pot, Right in Two, Vicarious, Wings for Marie).

I would like Adam Jones to change it up with maybe a different tuning and key though, 3 albums worth is enough

try C tuning
or get a 9 string

Sorry about that Progtologist.

Anyways, I'm not saying I have no hope for them.  All I'm saying is that they've been pulling the same punches for about 4 albums now and I've grown bored with their lack of growth IMO.  And I'm not saying they're the same songs...I'm saying they're very harmonically similar...and they make hardly any effort to change that; if you like it, continue to, I just gave my opinion/rant on where I stand...I'd love to be proven wrong LP5.

CaincelaOreinim wrote: Sorry about that Progtologist. Anyways, I'm not saying I have no hope for them.  All I'm saying is that they've been pulling the same punches for about 4 albums now and I've grown bored with their lack of growth IMO.  And I'm not saying they're the same songs...I'm saying they're very harmonically similar...and they make hardly any effort to change that; if you like it, continue to, I just gave my opinion/rant on where I stand...I'd love to be proven wrong LP5.

I think he meant me- I've been letting the auto-censor system do the work lately instead of my thought processes

anyway I understand where you're coming from, I just don't think its horrible compared to their others like everyone else says. LP5 should be interesting no doubt

p0mt3 wrote: CaincelaOreinim wrote: 1800iareyay wrote: CaincelaOreinim wrote: Hmmm....these guys have a lot of work to do to redeem themselves I think...which I personally don't see happening. How so? Tool sacrificed nothing, yet their last album was the most commercially appealing. Not that Tool have ever really been underground, despite their successful attempts to avoid the fame lifestyle. 10,000 Days was no weaker than their established classics. Now, if you don't like them, that's fine, but to say they need redemption is silly. Well, you asked for it... Been a fan of their's for years...and still mildly to hardly interested.  However I thought 10,000 Days was for the most part a rehashing of Lateralus...for a band that consistently claims they're continuing to explore/experiment/broaden their horizons they seemed to be doing nothing of the such.  They rested on their laurels; I saw Lateralus as a kind of watershed to their sound - their next a make or break affair.  The title track's lyrics themselves seemed to solidify this notion of 'we're going to continue to push the envelope, be around for awhile, work hard, and explore where no one's gone before' therefore ushering in some pretty interesting bits in the closing track Resolution (what I refer to collectively as Dis-Ref-Trad).   Then they just rehashed past and present. Aside from the 'winners' in my mind from 10,000 (Jambi, 10KD, Rosetta, and Intension) you can't tell me even in those selected 'winning' songs that they don't mime Lateralus' sound; you can't tell me: Vicarious doesn't sound like Schism, that the synth guitar effects in Rosetta and 10K aren't the same tone found in Reflection, that Rosetta doesn't have guitar lines similar to Third Eye, that The Pot isn't their staple 'angry' song a la Ticks & Leeches/Hooker, that Right In Two is just a tabla-centric Push*t makeover and an excuse to play in 11.  How many more metal songs in drop D harmonic/minor + odd time can one take?  Also there's a formula they seem to be following too, you can't tell me every Tool song has a sort of climatic/cathartic release section designed to elevate the listener.  The problem I think is that Jones and Chancellor need to step it up and not rely solely on Carey to float their band, (Maynard's just a singer, with an identifiable/effusive/idiosyncratic voice but hardly any range left these days saturating his voice in compression and this robotic warble; listen to Undertow/Aenima and you'll hear him actually trying to push himself...and don't get me started on how his lyrics have slipped - vampires, zombies, monkeys, thick girls - unrelated Puscifer reference but still! -...); Chancellor IMO needs to stop relying on effect pedals, but who the hell am I really to tell him...his playing is fine, it's just he sounds so laden and watered-down.  I just think Jones and Chancellor really need to expand their horizons whether that's in theory/style/whatever BIG TIME.  But here's the thing, they wont because they have a winning formula/it works, why fix it?   And I could go on and on about how drastically boring their live shows have become since Lateralus' tour...with projections that seem culled from Window 's Media Player, 'improvisations' that seem tacked on under this notion to flat out "rock" and be "balls to the wall" rather than establish an atmosphere and space (see what they did to Schism) or a seamless show, a new fanbase who doesn't listen; intent to scream along like at a DMB concert (which, if you're unfamiliar, is the last place on Earth you want to be), a greatest hits I-could-stay-at-home-and-have-pretty-much-the-same-experience set-list, mechanical/no energy playing with the band looking like they wont want to be there, f**king Alex Grey, who like them so to speak, paints the same thing over and over...can you tell yet that I've REALLY fallen off their bandwagon? And that is why I'm not holding my breath nor am I really big on them much anymore...I'd like to be pleasantly surprised though!    That's a shame . . .   see, Tool has always stayed pretty much in the same key when writing, so it's only natural that things are gonna start to sound similar after awhile, but to say that 10kD is a rehash of Lateralus is in my opinion a complete untruth. Further more, do you realize that many so-called Tool 'fans' who got turned on to them through Lateralus thought that 10kD sounded so different from it that it caused them to jump ship? Most people wanted Tool's next album to be the same exact thing as Lateralus, but were upset that it wasn't, yet you claim that there is hardly a difference between the two albums?   The examples you used are also unfair as far as I am concerned: How does Vicarious' opening sound like any part of Schism? How does Rosetta and 10kD's guitar effects even remotely resemble anything off of 'Reflection'? By the way, the similarities between Third Eye and Rosetta Stoned were intentional; I;ve always looked at the two as parts one and two of something much bigger.   As for repeating themselves, allow me to enlighten you: Justin Chancellor plays with his fingers quite a bit on the 10kD album: something he has never done before. Adam Jones is apparently learning to play with his fingers as well, and is wanting experiment with warr guitar and other such instruments. Maynard's lyrics continue to get deeper and more intelligent with each studio release, and Danny Carey always adds new flavor to each album with his never-ending array of drum techniques.   Now, I know what you must be thinking: I have a Tool-related avatar and signature, so obviousely I like them alot, but I am not simply trying to defend a band I like, I am honestly trying to get you to see that Tool isn't any less original and fresh now as they were back in '96. Just because they go in a direction you don't like for one record doesn't mean you should just drop them and lose all respect. Where is the logic in that?     p.s. I'm sorry that I duplicated this thread today, I didn't realize this was here until moments ago.

I apologize for how atrociously turgid this thread has gotten all; courtesy of my oh so highly controversial opinions...

It's been a while backing up my reported stance on Tool as it were these days...and I forgot to add disclaimers and what not.  I don't think 10KD is an abomination of the Tool sound or a terrible terrible record...I just think for their standard of stand-alone identifiable albums, it's sub-par and kind of wobbles on its feet...I may have gotten a bit carried away in my micturation parade...but people want bands to stay the same/not experiment with their sound? Count me out for not wanting to live in the past!   My purport is for the most part there WASN't a change in direction!

W/r/t the actual songs: can you give me a direct acknowledgment from anyone other than yourself that Third Eye and Rosetta Stoned are linked?; Reflection's tone from (I can't believe you're making me do this by the way, and ahah, I reserve the right for jokes at my expense later ) 7:40, is rather similar to 10K's 6:30 thereabouts, and Rosetta's aha lo behold 7:20;  the bit after Schism's 4:00 stacatto interlude section doesn't sound note-wise even a soupcon like Vicarious' stacatto opening!?   I feel like Raul Julia in the prison scene in that Adam's Family movie: "has the world gone mad!?"

W/r/t the musicians in Tool: as a bassist of 8+ years myself, Justin needs to SIT DOWN to play 10KD live which I think is weak...playing with your fingers is hardly aha an accomplishment...real bassists, ahem, don't use picks (a jest).  Unless Jones is reaching into the classical/jazz-fusion/tapping realm I hardly think playing with his fingers (this is a ridiculous level of auspiciousness by the way if that's what you're trying to get at with 'the fingers' bits towards my 'enlightenment' as you put it) will unveil any new sonics.  Warr guitar is great, and I too know of his alleged lessons with Trey Gunn as well as his album with Fripp, but am not convinced of his technical talents; great song-writer for sure, great guitar player?, iffy.  Carey is consistently the most able-bodied and...what you said.  IMO Maynard's lyrics continue to get lamer, silly, and groping. 

And I am wiped...and letting bygones be bygones, I wont be back for further comment.

Again, here's hoping I ENJOY the new FRIGGN' Tool album of wondrous plentitude!

I am looking forward to the new Tool album be it 5 months from now or 5 years for now.  I think their records are phenomenal enough to hold me until their next one.  I am still listening to Aenema.

CaincelaOreinim wrote: p0mt3 wrote: CaincelaOreinim wrote: 1800iareyay wrote: CaincelaOreinim wrote: Hmmm....these guys have a lot of work to do to redeem themselves I think...which I personally don't see happening. How so? Tool sacrificed nothing, yet their last album was the most commercially appealing. Not that Tool have ever really been underground, despite their successful attempts to avoid the fame lifestyle. 10,000 Days was no weaker than their established classics. Now, if you don't like them, that's fine, but to say they need redemption is silly. Well, you asked for it... Been a fan of their's for years...and still mildly to hardly interested.  However I thought 10,000 Days was for the most part a rehashing of Lateralus...for a band that consistently claims they're continuing to explore/experiment/broaden their horizons they seemed to be doing nothing of the such.  They rested on their laurels; I saw Lateralus as a kind of watershed to their sound - their next a make or break affair.  The title track's lyrics themselves seemed to solidify this notion of 'we're going to continue to push the envelope, be around for awhile, work hard, and explore where no one's gone before' therefore ushering in some pretty interesting bits in the closing track Resolution (what I refer to collectively as Dis-Ref-Trad).   Then they just rehashed past and present. Aside from the 'winners' in my mind from 10,000 (Jambi, 10KD, Rosetta, and Intension) you can't tell me even in those selected 'winning' songs that they don't mime Lateralus' sound; you can't tell me: Vicarious doesn't sound like Schism, that the synth guitar effects in Rosetta and 10K aren't the same tone found in Reflection, that Rosetta doesn't have guitar lines similar to Third Eye, that The Pot isn't their staple 'angry' song a la Ticks & Leeches/Hooker, that Right In Two is just a tabla-centric Push*t makeover and an excuse to play in 11.  How many more metal songs in drop D harmonic/minor + odd time can one take?  Also there's a formula they seem to be following too, you can't tell me every Tool song has a sort of climatic/cathartic release section designed to elevate the listener.  The problem I think is that Jones and Chancellor need to step it up and not rely solely on Carey to float their band, (Maynard's just a singer, with an identifiable/effusive/idiosyncratic voice but hardly any range left these days saturating his voice in compression and this robotic warble; listen to Undertow/Aenima and you'll hear him actually trying to push himself...and don't get me started on how his lyrics have slipped - vampires, zombies, monkeys, thick girls - unrelated Puscifer reference but still! -...); Chancellor IMO needs to stop relying on effect pedals, but who the hell am I really to tell him...his playing is fine, it's just he sounds so laden and watered-down.  I just think Jones and Chancellor really need to expand their horizons whether that's in theory/style/whatever BIG TIME.  But here's the thing, they wont because they have a winning formula/it works, why fix it?   And I could go on and on about how drastically boring their live shows have become since Lateralus' tour...with projections that seem culled from Window 's Media Player, 'improvisations' that seem tacked on under this notion to flat out "rock" and be "balls to the wall" rather than establish an atmosphere and space (see what they did to Schism) or a seamless show, a new fanbase who doesn't listen; intent to scream along like at a DMB concert (which, if you're unfamiliar, is the last place on Earth you want to be), a greatest hits I-could-stay-at-home-and-have-pretty-much-the-same-experience set-list, mechanical/no energy playing with the band looking like they wont want to be there, f**king Alex Grey, who like them so to speak, paints the same thing over and over...can you tell yet that I've REALLY fallen off their bandwagon? And that is why I'm not holding my breath nor am I really big on them much anymore...I'd like to be pleasantly surprised though!    That's a shame . . .   see, Tool has always stayed pretty much in the same key when writing, so it's only natural that things are gonna start to sound similar after awhile, but to say that 10kD is a rehash of Lateralus is in my opinion a complete untruth. Further more, do you realize that many so-called Tool 'fans' who got turned on to them through Lateralus thought that 10kD sounded so different from it that it caused them to jump ship? Most people wanted Tool's next album to be the same exact thing as Lateralus, but were upset that it wasn't, yet you claim that there is hardly a difference between the two albums?   The examples you used are also unfair as far as I am concerned: How does Vicarious' opening sound like any part of Schism? How does Rosetta and 10kD's guitar effects even remotely resemble anything off of 'Reflection'? By the way, the similarities between Third Eye and Rosetta Stoned were intentional; I;ve always looked at the two as parts one and two of something much bigger.   As for repeating themselves, allow me to enlighten you: Justin Chancellor plays with his fingers quite a bit on the 10kD album: something he has never done before. Adam Jones is apparently learning to play with his fingers as well, and is wanting experiment with warr guitar and other such instruments. Maynard's lyrics continue to get deeper and more intelligent with each studio release, and Danny Carey always adds new flavor to each album with his never-ending array of drum techniques.   Now, I know what you must be thinking: I have a Tool-related avatar and signature, so obviousely I like them alot, but I am not simply trying to defend a band I like, I am honestly trying to get you to see that Tool isn't any less original and fresh now as they were back in '96. Just because they go in a direction you don't like for one record doesn't mean you should just drop them and lose all respect. Where is the logic in that?     p.s. I'm sorry that I duplicated this thread today, I didn't realize this was here until moments ago. I apologize for how atrociously turgid this thread has gotten all; courtesy of my oh so highly controversial opinions... It's been a while backing up my reported stance on Tool as it were these days...and I forgot to add disclaimers and what not.  I don't think 10KD is an abomination of the Tool sound or a terrible terrible record...I just think for their standard of stand-alone identifiable albums, it's sub-par and kind of wobbles on its feet...I may have gotten a bit carried away in my micturation parade...but people want bands to stay the same/not experiment with their sound? Count me out for not wanting to live in the past!   My purport is for the most part there WASN't a change in direction! W/r/t the actual songs: can you give me a direct acknowledgment from anyone other than yourself that Third Eye and Rosetta Stoned are linked?; Reflection's tone from (I can't believe you're making me do this by the way, and ahah, I reserve the right for jokes at my expense later ) 7:40, is rather similar to 10K's 6:30 thereabouts, and Rosetta's aha lo behold 7:20;  the bit after Schism's 4:00 stacatto interlude section doesn't sound note-wise even a soupcon like Vicarious' stacatto opening!?   I feel like Raul Julia in the prison scene in that Adam's Family movie: "has the world gone mad!?" W/r/t the musicians in Tool: as a bassist of 8+ years myself, Justin needs to SIT DOWN to play 10KD live which I think is weak...playing with your fingers is hardly aha an accomplishment...real bassists, ahem, don't use picks (a jest).  Unless Jones is reaching into the classical/jazz-fusion/tapping realm I hardly think playing with his fingers (this is a ridiculous level of auspiciousness by the way if that's what you're trying to get at with 'the fingers' bits towards my 'enlightenment' as you put it) will unveil any new sonics.  Warr guitar is great, and I too know of his alleged lessons with Trey Gunn as well as his album with Fripp, but am not convinced of his technical talents; great song-writer for sure, great guitar player?, iffy.  Carey is consistently the most able-bodied and...what you said.  IMO Maynard's lyrics continue to get lamer, silly, and groping.  And I am wiped...and letting bygones be bygones, I wont be back for further comment. Again, here's hoping I ENJOY the new FRIGGN' Tool album of wondrous plentitude!

Sitting down to play guitar is neato. It makes you look more like a musician and less like a rock poser. =P

laplace wrote: Sitting down to play guitar is neato. It makes you look more like a musician and less like a rock poser. =P

or more like Robert Fripp
which is why the other guitarist in my band does it
I wouldn't mind it actually

p0mt3 wrote: stonebeard wrote: Hey, unlike most bands that take 5 years to release another album, Tool doesn't change. So maybe putting out a new one really soon will have the opposite of what we'd normally expect and it will be vastly different!  I was thinking about Tool today, while hearing "Lateralus" on a notoriously nu-metal/Godsmack-esque station, and wondering what exactly they are. I guess they're arty enough to lend faux pomposity and an air of importance to mainstream metal listeners and the Grammy Awards (Tool won Best Metal Song for "The Pot.")   Have you actually listened to a Tool album from beginning to end without pause? As Danny Carey himself said before: ''We are an album band". If they aren't progressive, no one is, my friend.   By the way, I like the quote in your signature. I just recently picked up my blu-ray copy with all the different versions of the film. Great stuff! *drool*

Hmm...I think I have. Maybe not attentively. But would this make a difference? I only have Lateralus and 10,000 Days, and I don't think they're very different, except 10,000 Days has better production and I personally like the songs more. I agree they're an album band, but they can be appreciated and depreciated based on single songs as well. Tool as an overall concept might be progressive, I guess, but I really, honestly don't see very much progression at all from Lateralus to 10,000 Days.

(And yes, Blade Runner owns and I want the huge collection very much. I also wanted to put the entire monologue in my sig, but it wouldn't fit. )