| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
WatcherOfTheSkies88 
Forum Groupie
Joined: February 22 2010
Location: Hawaii
Status: Offline
Points: 79
|
 Topic: The "Willow Farm" section of "Supper's Ready"
Posted: March 11 2010 at 03:52 |
|
I've heard people say that the "Willow Farm" section of the Genesis epic "Supper's Ready" stops it from being a perfect composition, because it supposedly doesn't fit in with the rest of the song. It's understandable why some would feel this way because originally "Willow Farm" was supposed to be a stand-alone song. Anyway, what are your guys's opinions on this? Is "Supper's Ready" perfect the way it is, or should "Willow Farm" have been left off?
|
 |
Easy Livin
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: February 21 2004
Location: Scotland
Status: Offline
Points: 15585
|
Posted: March 11 2010 at 03:57 |
It certainly wouldn't sound right without it now after all these years. It's an interesting point though about it being a separate song. I've often wondered whether they were all in fact separate songs, and the clever bit was bringing them together as a suite. SR doesn't seem to be written as one piece, there are for example no recurring themes.
I also wonder of say the Beatles had given side two of Abbey Road or Queen had given side two of Queen 2 an overall name, would they too be hailed as prog epics.
|
|
Marty McFly
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: March 23 2009
Location: Czech Republic
Status: Offline
Points: 3968
|
Posted: March 11 2010 at 04:08 |
|
It rather divides the song for me, provides resting place, some kind of change before returning to serious stuff again.
|
There's a point where "avant-garde" and "experimental" becomes "terrible" and "pointless," -Andyman1125 on Lulu  Even my
|
|
The Runaway
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 28 2009
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 3144
|
Posted: March 11 2010 at 07:33 |
|
My favorite part!
|
|
|
|
someone_else
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: May 02 2008
Location: Going Bananas
Status: Offline
Points: 24803
|
Posted: March 11 2010 at 07:50 |
|
Indeed Willow Farm was written as a standalone song originally and afterwards incorporated in Supper's Ready. Nevertheless, it fits in very well here. My favourite part of Supper's Ready may be Apocalypse in 9/8, but Willow Farm is not far away in my ranking.
Edited by someone_else - March 11 2010 at 07:50
|
|
|
|
harmonium.ro
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin
Joined: August 18 2008
Location: Anna Calvi
Status: Offline
Points: 22989
|
Posted: March 11 2010 at 08:08 |
 Easy Livin wrote:
It certainly wouldn't sound right without it now after all these years. It's an interesting point though about it being a separate song. I've often wondered whether they were all in fact separate songs, and the clever bit was bringing them together as a suite. SR doesn't seem to be written as one piece, there are for example no recurring themes.
|
I remember Cert saying in his review that the whole piece has a "theme and variation" structure, I'll have to read it again. We both know we shouldn't contradict him! 
EDIT: This is what he's saying: "Supper's Ready" is not really a
single piece, but 5 pieces and 2 variations, with the main theme from the 1st piece re-
utilised occasionally to give a feeling of continuity, and the music from "The Guaranteed
Eternal Sanctuary Man" re-used for "As Sure As Eggs Is Eggs".
I remembered as being a long review with a very in-depth analysis of Supper's Ready, so now it seems like it was edited and shortened a lot. 
Edited by harmonium.ro - March 11 2010 at 08:14
|
|
DJPuffyLemon
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 18 2008
Location: L
Status: Offline
Points: 520
|
Posted: March 11 2010 at 10:20 |
|
I would venture to say that ALL the epics from the 70's (except for tracks like De Futura and In a Gadda-Da-Vida, which are long jams) are in fact only suites that aren't separated.
Genesis- Supper's Ready (a good parallel would be the Duke Suite)
King Crimson- Lizard
Van Der Graaf Generator - Plauge of Lighthouse Keepers
Yes - ...well Yes had pretty accomplished epics, though Close to the Edge is three parts, and so is Gates of Delirium, they probably have the only "real" epic length songs out of the 70s bands though.
Magma - MDK has 7 parts, WI has 12, TH has about 9
etc
Edited by DJPuffyLemon - March 11 2010 at 10:21
|
|
Negoba
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 24 2008
Location: Big Muddy
Status: Offline
Points: 5210
|
Posted: March 11 2010 at 10:34 |
I personally believe that Supper's Ready has some significant recurring themes lyrically. Musically, it is as others have noted more of a suite than a single piece.
And Willow Farm definitely is integral part of the suite.
Aside from the beginning, CTTE seems pretty coherently a single song to me. Certainly there are sections, but all classical pieces also have A, B, C sections.
|
|
You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.
|
|
Alberto Muņoz
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 26 2006
Location: Mexico
Status: Offline
Points: 3577
|
Posted: March 11 2010 at 12:51 |
Definitely integral part of the suite.
It's like the song Anyway that was composed in 1970, but they recycled and use the definitive version in LLDOB.
|
|
|
|
Zombywoof
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 26 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 1217
|
Posted: March 15 2010 at 19:31 |
It's
always been the part I look forward to the most! I get a laugh out of the surreal lyrics and love the bright music, which offers a contrast to a generally dark-themed song. To a lesser extent, it reminds me almost of Tull's "The Hare Who Lost His Spectacles", which also seems to offer some relief in an otherwise dark prog masterpiece. I couldn't imagine the song without it!
|
|
Continue the prog discussion here: http://zombyprog.proboards.com/index.cgi ...
|
|
TheGazzardian
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 11 2009
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 8844
|
Posted: March 16 2010 at 12:07 |
|
It works well for me, and truthfully is an important part of the charm of both Supper's Ready and Genesis' music in general, in my mind.
|
|
The Truth
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 19 2009
Location: Kansas
Status: Offline
Points: 21795
|
Posted: March 16 2010 at 12:11 |
Easy Livin wrote:
It certainly wouldn't sound right without it now after all these years. It's an interesting point though about it being a separate song. I've often wondered whether they were all in fact separate songs, and the clever bit was bringing them together as a suite. SR doesn't seem to be written as one piece, there are for example no recurring themes.
I also wonder of say the Beatles had given side two of Abbey Road or Queen had given side two of Queen 2 an overall name, would they too be hailed as prog epics. |
That's without including the b-side to Seven Seas of Rhye right? 
|
|
|
|
lazland
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 28 2008
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 13867
|
Posted: March 16 2010 at 14:24 |
|
It's a perfect part of the suite, and was indeed written as a separate piece. All of them were.
|
|
Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
Now also broadcasting on www.progzilla.com Every Saturday, 4.00 p.m. UK time!
|
|
Henry Plainview
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 26 2008
Location: Declined
Status: Offline
Points: 16715
|
Posted: March 16 2010 at 17:30 |
|
I think the Eternal Sanctuary Man theme is the worst part of the song, but everybody else thinks it's the best. Willow Farm is fun, that's good enough.
|
|
if you own a sodastream i hate you
|
|
esky
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 12 2009
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 643
|
Posted: March 18 2010 at 10:33 |
"Willow Farm" in all its whimsy is vital to Supper's Ready and is perhaps one of the best comedy relief elements ever injected into a prog classic, whatever its commentary may have been about.
|
|
Mr. Maestro
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 05 2010
Location: Knowhere, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 918
|
Posted: March 21 2010 at 16:30 |
I love Willow Farm. I know it's been said, but I can't imagine "Supper's Ready" without it. Even more, I can't imagine "Willow Farm" as a stand-alone song. The best place I could think to put it is right in the middle of a sidelong epic.
I've noticed that a lot of recent-ish prog epics (like Spock's Beard's "The Great Nothing" and Dream Theater's "Octavarium") include little wacky interludes right in the middle of an otherwise extremely serious passage. "Willow Farm" inspired, maybe?
|
|
"I am the one who crossed through space...or stayed where I was...or didn't exist in the first place...."
|
|
Tarquin Underspoon
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 12 2009
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1416
|
Posted: March 21 2010 at 17:22 |
|
^ I recall hearing Supper's Ready for the first time, after I was familiar with Octavarium. I remember thinking "oh okay, so Dream Theater is re-making Supper's Ready." I think it's a definite homage. But what do I know
|
|
"WAAAAAAOOOOOUGH! WAAAAAAAUUUUGGHHHH!! WAAAAAOOOO!!!"
-The Great Gig in the Sky
|
|
Zombywoof
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 26 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 1217
|
Posted: March 21 2010 at 18:03 |
Tarquin Underspoon wrote:
^ I recall hearing Supper's Ready for the first time, after I was familiar with Octavarium. I remember thinking "oh okay, so Dream Theater is re-making Supper's Ready." I think it's a definite homage. But what do I know |
Isn't this where we came in?
sailing on the seven seize the day
tripper diem's ready
jack the ripper owens wilson phillips and my
supper's ready
lucy in the sky with diamond dave's not here I come to
save the
day for nightmare cinema show me the way to get back home
again- Dream Theater, Octavarium, pt 3: "Full Circle" two Genesis references in one stanza? Your theory has to be right!
|
|
Continue the prog discussion here: http://zombyprog.proboards.com/index.cgi ...
|
|
The Wrinkler
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 03 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 638
|
Posted: March 22 2010 at 19:51 |
|
I look forward to the willow farm
|
|
classic not old
Forum Newbie
Joined: July 06 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 21
|
Posted: March 22 2010 at 20:19 |
It's perfect the way it is. Don't take anything out or put anything in.
My only wish would be to have the sections separated on CDs so you could go back to a favourite part instead of having to listen through the whole 21 minute saga. But then... nothing wrong with listening through the whole 21 minute saga!
|
|
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.
/PAlogo_v2.gif "Progarchives.com Homepage")
The "Willow Farm" section of "Supper's Ready"
