Reforming the PA database in democratic manner

These couple of days are very agitating for me, an infernal Japanese disaster included.

Sigh ... putting myself together.

First of all, thanks to mates who have discussed with me.

I'm much concerned with the past, the present, and the future of Progarchives ... the way of artist evaluation and inclusion, the bulky database currently expanding day after day (including some "problematic" inclusion cases in the distant past PA foundered with confusing), and democratic manner in future.

And one of the most concerning issues is the database - as-it-is-said the holy ground, currently where nobody can reform or improve "drastically", some discussable issues or material existed though.

Well, please let me propose, that we should discuss this massive database together, for absolute & ultimate improvement. That is, to reevaluate, reform, revise, readjust the database ... for shaping more ultimate (the most ultimate,if possible) one.

Each subgenre (including Proto, Prog-Related) may have some unknown, unconvincing, tough cases I guess, and we all Collaborators and members can discuss, reconsider, and in some cases remove the cases or data ... in accordance with our sincere and serious opinion and certain democratic manner.

Thoughts? 

Deleting artists isn't a good idea. I don't find any artists included here to be terribly objectionable, and deleting them will also delete many reviews.

I, for one, would love to expel modern hacks from this progressive site. Keep progress alive by keeping thieves out of PA!

it sounds like what Damo is suggesting is a 'cleanup' ;  a reexamination of certain bands added long ago or without procedure that may not belong either in that particular subgenre, in which case the artist(s) could be moved with the approval of said genre teams, or removed altogether with the approval of M@X et al.   Several teams have accomplished this in the past, but it is easier said than done.   Firstly, policy is that no bands once added will be removed except under unusual circumstances, and only by M@X as far as I know.  Second, though a genreteam may be open to accepting a certain artist, no team will want to be expected to "play ball" and take an act they didn't add or don't really want.  Third, it is a project that would need coordination with all involved, and in theory, is a huge job.

Just my tuppence.

I would strongly resist the removal of any artist from the database. Our collaborators put a lot of work in assessing additions, and our reviewers spend a lot of time preparing reviews. To subsequently remove a band or artist would be disrepectful to those who had previosuly made the efffort for this site.

If we're going to put your ideas to a vote, I'd vote no.  I am strictly against removing things just because a lot of people may not approve.  Even the controversial artists aren't added without evaluation and careful consideration.  I think we draw a pretty good line, but almost no one's going to agree on it's boundaries.

Edited by Slartibartfast - March 21 2011 at 05:32

Slartibartfast wrote: If we're going to put your ideas to a vote, I'd vote no.  I am strictly against removing things just because a lot of people may not approve.  Even the controversial artists aren't added without evaluation and careful consideration.  I think we draw a pretty good line, but almost no one's going to agree on it's boundaries.

Just wanted to add, however, that when this site was in its infancy there were no genre teams and no "eval" procedure as we know it today - I believe one could find some artists added during this time that most might agree don't belong.

That said, there is probably such a small number of these cases it's probably not worth the time and energy rooting them out and removing them.

Please wait all mates, quite a few members posting here may be very nervous about removal of artists I've felt ... mentioned only that we "can" reform etc ... and "in some cases" remove ... yes, I've said let me propose we can remove in some cases in accordance with our sincere and serious opinion and certain democratic manner.

And also let me say that I do believe no Collaborator has an intention to entrap or bug PA or other Collaborators ...only what I've emphasized is to avoid permitting any dictatorship or bulldozing in PA.


Anyway ... Bob (Easy Livin), I'm always appreciating your sincere efforts with your serious and strict attitude for PA, and let me ask you as one of the longest Admins in PA, please;

I've found there are "vacant" seats (artist ID numbers) in PA, and some of them have been obviously deleted already (realized via old threads like this ... ID1851 is a "vacant" seat already vaporized) ... what does this mean?

Padraic wrote: I believe one could find some artists added during this time that most might agree don't belong.

Related to this opinion?

Easy Livin wrote: By all means review the additions process though

Well again please let me propose, we should clarify the process of evaluation for subgenre candidates, including Proto-Prog and Prog-Related.
We subgenre teams maybe have tried to show the process in the artist's thread of "Suggest ... " Forum if possible (sometimes lazy as honestly I say  ), but should we try harder to do so? 

Democracy sucks

Easy Livin wrote: I would strongly resist the removal of any artist from the database. Our collaborators put a lot of work in assessing additions, and our reviewers spend a lot of time preparing reviews. To subsequently remove a band or artist would be disrepectful to those who had previosuly made the efffort for this site.

I understand this, but this is not a defense of anything.  If you peek into the Libertarian thread for a minute, you will see that we criticize the government despite all that effort that goes into maintaining it.

In other words, suppose the Eclectic team added Lady Gaga.  Could we simply dispel the controversy that would be raised on this site by saying, "Yeah, but we worked very hard to add and review this artist!"