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Joined: February 09 2010
Location: Australia
Status: Offline
Points: 3236
Posted: August 16 2011 at 19:41
richardh wrote:
giselle wrote:
The concept of The Nice - a Rock organ trio - came from 1-2-3 (later Clouds). O'List was sacrificied for this concept.
O'List was actually kicked out the group for similar reasons that Pink Floyd left Syd Barrett behind. I spoke to Davy about 6 years ago and he didn't have a bad word to say for Keith and I think was glad that he was given his 'wake up call'. Keith Emerson did toy with the idea of bringing Steve Howe into the band and they spent a day hanging out but in the end Howe decided he wanted to stay with the band he was in at the time (this was a good few years before Yes).
Didn't O'List play with Pink Floyd on a few early gigs before Gilmour stepped in? I really enjoyed his guitar work on Thoughts of Emerlist Davjack.
I actually like The Nice more than ELP and listen to them more often. Their raw approach is effective and enjoyable when the listener considers them primarily a psychedelic band with some progressiveness.
The Nice were perhaps a jazzier, more organic and less refined sounding beast than ELP and I agree that the former's earlier material is 3 parts psychedelia, one part RnB with a garnish of proggyness to taste (I love em both BTW)
Joined: November 17 2008
Location: Indiana, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 1584
Posted: August 16 2011 at 18:32
I actually like The Nice more than ELP and listen to them more often. Their raw approach is effective and enjoyable when the listener considers them primarily a psychedelic band with some progressiveness.
The Nice did a nifty cover version of the Mort Garson Aries track on the BBC sessions album. Although I think it's Jackson singing/shouting? he sounds (gulp) demonic on this number.
Joined: March 18 2011
Location: Hertford
Status: Offline
Points: 466
Posted: August 16 2011 at 02:48
I think it's more likely to be the Len Barry hit of the same name; 1-2-3 was the early name of Clouds, whose history you can see here on Prog Archives. The irony in this post is that 1-2-3 specialised in re-arranging other people's songs (in the style later adopted by Yes - listen to 1-2-3's version of 'America' live at the Marquee some years before the Yes version).
Another
album titled Undiscovered Treasures of never before released tracks from 1977
featuring Simon Phillips on drums on three tracks and others recorded later will
also be released. One of those tracks is an interpretation and re-arrangement of
1-2-3 that Uncut magazine think sounds like a hit.
Yep, valid stuff in there, but the idea was to emulate 1-2-3 OK. Maybe it solved two problems at once.
Not sure about that but admittedly I can't refute it.I know one of Emerson's (and The Nice) big influences was this
I love Mort Garson! I wasn't fond of the Zodiac series or the Wozard of Iz, but I've owned just about everything from Mort Garson at one time or another. His electronic mass.....Lucifer/Black Mass is the most exciting and breathtaking electronic album in history for me. I was lucky to meet a sound tech in Philadelphia who transfered a clean LP copy on to disc for me. It's the music itself that I go for and not so much the subject matter in which the record revolves around. I love this guy! He had some truly orignal ideas on Black Mass. So exciting to read a post connected to his name. One of the main themes of the album was used to open a weekend radio program on WXPN in Philadelphia in the 70's. People who have yet to hear Black Mass would surely have a different impression of electronic music.
Joined: January 24 2010
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 8085
Posted: August 15 2011 at 10:38
TODDLER wrote:
presdoug wrote:
with painful honesty, i must say that i have tried The NIce, and can't seem to appreciate them, no matter what period, live or studio I much prefer early ELP and it wasn't that i expected or needed them to sound like ELP, but i heard, and developed an affinity for ELP before, so i guess i was musically spoiled by ELPs greatness
i have heard Refugee, but i can't get it either, and much prefer Moraz's previous , very overlooked band Mainhorse
Interesting to hear. I first heard them in the early 70's. I recall being very impressed with Keith Emerson's keyboard playing and "Five Bridges" is decent. However I could not handle Lee Jackson's vocal style. It was that reaction I had to Dave Lawson from Greenslade or even John Wetton in K.C. at times. It's a shame for me because Greenslade have some outstanding prog material, but as soon as his voice enters the picture I become a nut case wanting to pull my hair out. How I am longing to hear something sweet and pure like Wayne Shorter's sax soloing.....or I'm running for the door. The only singer I thought highly of was Greg Lake simply because he could sing about the most pretentious subjects, yet put soul into it. He had a deepness to his voice that was the actual melodic characteristic of King Crimson. The Nice ....although not tasteful to me were innovators ...or....rather Emerson was....and then you have that historical moment with prog in the early 70's where bands like Beggar's Opera, Rare Bird ...and the list goes on.....sounded a bit like the Nice.
with the Greenslade i have heard, i find the vocal aspect long winded, and wish they would have concentrated more on their instrumental prowess. Glad you mentioned Beggar's Opera, TODDLER. I am a big fan of their first three albums, and the keyboard player Alan Park is awesome! Greg Lake is also very special to me, just in the way you have described
with painful honesty, i must say that i have tried The NIce, and can't seem to appreciate them, no matter what period, live or studio I much prefer early ELP and it wasn't that i expected or needed them to sound like ELP, but i heard, and developed an affinity for ELP before, so i guess i was musically spoiled by ELPs greatness
i have heard Refugee, but i can't get it either, and much prefer Moraz's previous , very overlooked band Mainhorse
Interesting to hear. I first heard them in the early 70's. I recall being very impressed with Keith Emerson's keyboard playing and "Five Bridges" is decent. However I could not handle Lee Jackson's vocal style. It was that reaction I had to Dave Lawson from Greenslade or even John Wetton in K.C. at times. It's a shame for me because Greenslade have some outstanding prog material, but as soon as his voice enters the picture I become a nut case wanting to pull my hair out. How I am longing to hear something sweet and pure like Wayne Shorter's sax soloing.....or I'm running for the door. The only singer I thought highly of was Greg Lake simply because he could sing about the most pretentious subjects, yet put soul into it. He had a deepness to his voice that was the actual melodic characteristic of King Crimson. The Nice ....although not tasteful to me were innovators ...or....rather Emerson was....and then you have that historical moment with prog in the early 70's where bands like Beggar's Opera, Rare Bird ...and the list goes on.....sounded a bit like the Nice.
Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 26171
Posted: August 15 2011 at 01:18
giselle wrote:
The concept of The Nice - a Rock organ trio - came from 1-2-3 (later Clouds). O'List was sacrificied for this concept.
O'List was actually kicked out the group for similar reasons that Pink Floyd left Syd Barrett behind. I spoke to Davy about 6 years ago and he didn't have a bad word to say for Keith and I think was glad that he was given his 'wake up call'. Keith Emerson did toy with the idea of bringing Steve Howe into the band and they spent a day hanging out but in the end Howe decided he wanted to stay with the band he was in at the time (this was a good few years before Yes).
Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 26171
Posted: July 26 2011 at 01:29
ExittheLemming wrote:
I think what I meant was that there might be some folks who approach the Nice expecting to hear something very similar to ELP (which they ain't in my book) As you state the production on the 1st two albums is very poor and lots of great music suffers as a result. However, the 3rd album simply called The Nice or in the US as Nice as Mother Makes It is an album that warrants getting excited over, and for me represents one of the most prescient and erm...credibly 'progressive' records of that period. I agree that the Nice were never able to replicate the magic they cast on stage from within the studio (as is borne out by half of The Nice being live cuts I guess) Five Bridges is also excellent and although somewhat flawed by Emerson's fleeting lapses into amateurish 'cartoon classical' simply blows similar efforts like Purple's Concerto and their own Ars Longa Vita Brevis clean out of the water.
Yep, the Refugee album is a 5 star belter from start to finish and unjustly neglected when people talk about the 'great and the good' in Symphonic Prog discussions.
The posthumous release Elegy from 1971 is well worth tracking down and I can never understand why it receives such a kicking from within PA. It contains perhaps the 'mother' of all live versions of America and Keith's extended piano improvisation on Hang On To A Dream is worth the admission price alone.
The Swedish Radio Sessions released in 2002 is a fascinating glimpse of the original lineup featuring O'List on guitar and the sound quality is remarkably good.
Elegy is probably their best especially the reissue with the bonus tracks that were originally on Autumn 67 Spring 68.
The 3rd album The Nice does have one brilliant track called For Example which showed the Nice being very clever and inventive. There aren't enough tracks like that mainly because I think they spent too much time adapting other people's music like for instance Bob Dylans 'She Belongs To Me'.
Some small mention should be made of Davy O'List ,the guitarist who played on the debut album.The Nice were a much heavier and better balanced unit when he was there. Rondo for me is their best moment and had a big influence on Mike Rutherford and Tony Banks in coming up with the first Genesis classic track The Knife.
Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Offline
Points: 64353
Posted: July 25 2011 at 18:06
to really dig the Nice you have to be fascinated by prog in its very earliest stage, otherwise they're a screechy joke who couldn't produce a record to save their life
Joined: April 29 2006
Location: Atlantais
Status: Offline
Points: 29625
Posted: July 25 2011 at 17:19
kingcrimsonfan wrote:
i really dont get it the nice on most of their albums are getting bad reviews i dont get why their sound is innovative yet people depreciate them here in progarchives o just dont get it
That's not very nice.
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
^ Hey ho, different strokes etc I really liked the Mainhorse album but found it a tad erm...cheesey in places (but we would agree that on the evidence, Moraz was a keyboard giant just waiting to happen).
Joined: January 24 2010
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 8085
Posted: July 25 2011 at 15:33
with painful honesty, i must say that i have tried The NIce, and can't seem to appreciate them, no matter what period, live or studio I much prefer early ELP and it wasn't that i expected or needed them to sound like ELP, but i heard, and developed an affinity for ELP before, so i guess i was musically spoiled by ELPs greatness
i have heard Refugee, but i can't get it either, and much prefer Moraz's previous , very overlooked band Mainhorse
I think what I meant was that there might be some folks who approach the Nice expecting to hear something very similar to ELP (which they ain't in my book) As you state the production on the 1st two albums is very poor and lots of great music suffers as a result. However, the 3rd album simply called The Nice or in the US as Nice as Mother Makes It is an album that warrants getting excited over, and for me represents one of the most prescient and erm...credibly 'progressive' records of that period. I agree that the Nice were never able to replicate the magic they cast on stage from within the studio (as is borne out by half of The Nice being live cuts I guess) Five Bridges is also excellent and although somewhat flawed by Emerson's fleeting lapses into amateurish 'cartoon classical' simply blows similar efforts like Purple's Concerto and their own Ars Longa Vita Brevis clean out of the water.
Yep, the Refugee album is a 5 star belter from start to finish and unjustly neglected when people talk about the 'great and the good' in Symphonic Prog discussions.
The posthumous release Elegy from 1971 is well worth tracking down and I can never understand why it receives such a kicking from within PA. It contains perhaps the 'mother' of all live versions of America and Keith's extended piano improvisation on Hang On To A Dream is worth the admission price alone.
The Swedish Radio Sessions released in 2002 is a fascinating glimpse of the original lineup featuring O'List on guitar and the sound quality is remarkably good.
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