"Freedom" thread or something

KoS wrote: Equality 7-2521 wrote: Slartibartfast wrote: The T wrote: Does anybody haw an opinion on this Trayvon killing that is so over the media ? OK, I think you didn't mean to write haw instead of have.  My wife and I have discussed this and it took some interesting turns.  Is Zimmerman "white"?   If he had been "black" would he not have been arrested?  It's really hard not to take "race" out of the equation.  In any event, they guy was apparently not "standing his ground".  He was a mentally disturbed individual and actively went after someone and gunned him down.  I've seen the photos of the guy and if I'm not mistaken he is a hispanic guy with a jewish last name.  Nevertheless an unarmed black kid was gunned down who apparently wasn't doing anything wron. What's the point of bringing race into it? Who cares if he would have been arrested if he were black? Let's just get the guy arrested and get this kid's killer behind bars. I don't see why it has to be a group A against group B thing.  His death is being exploited and that's disturbing to watch.  How far up your asses are your heads? http://www.timwise.org/2012/03/trayvon-martin-white-america-and-the-return-of-dred-scott/ It was about race since the beginning.

 

Edited by stonebeard - March 27 2012 at 22:24

For an online quiz I thought it was pretty accurate and as in depth a simple internet quiz can really get and normal people understand it.
and OMG THERE IT IS!
So Ric is a normal, American liberal democrat

JJLehto wrote: For an online quiz I thought it was pretty accurate and as in depth a simple internet quiz can really get and normal people understand it. and OMG THERE IT IS! So Ric is a normal, American liberal democrat

Nope. I hate unions and coming from California, Democrats are a bunch of money wasting douchebags.

JJLehto wrote: Except I do hate sanctions

Edited by stonebeard - March 27 2012 at 22:48

KoS wrote: JJLehto wrote: For an online quiz I thought it was pretty accurate and as in depth a simple internet quiz can really get and normal people understand it. and OMG THERE IT IS! So Ric is a normal, American liberal democrat Nope. I hate unions and coming from California, Democrats are a bunch of money wasting douchebags. This quiz has the same validity as a moral meter in a Bethesda game.

stonebeard wrote: JJLehto wrote: Except I do hate sanctions Why? I think they can be good as long as the philosophy behind them is sound (as in, not just sanctioning nations that don't play ball with the US or Israel. That is ludicrous policy.) I would hesitate to intervene militarily in a counter experiencing genocide for instance, especially unilaterally, but unless there are other methods for intervention, something must be done. It is incredibly irresponsible to sit idly by while poorer nations tear each other apart. This is also why I said military intervention and pre-emptive strike is sometimes necessary. But this is in an incredibly limited circumstance, and in a neo-con kind of way. And this is from a general perspective as well, for all countries. The US, for instance, would have almost no legitimate reason to use a pre-emptive strike, as there are no nations close enough to us and our defense technology is so good that we should be able to see an attack coming as it unfolds, and repel it, even if another country would be so audacious to attempt it. Our policy is to protect Israel and our economic interests in the gulf. It is incredibly selfish and probably inherently racist and well as generally unethical.

Sanctions just don't work. It hurts the people but those responsible for said wrong doing will not be affected, it also tends to foster anti (insert country) sentiment. IMO it'd cause more harm than good.

As for war, I would never agree to a pre emptive strike or unilateral action. I am OK with a multinational force in a legitimate situation. This is indeed limited.

Nothing to say about the last part. Obviously it's all about protecting Israel and our interests.

My foreign policy belief:
- We need to leave the Middle East (that mean any and all presence)
- We need to scale back our overseas force (do we need troops and bases in Canada, Europe, Australia and NZ?)
- We should capture terrorists or any threats the way we do know..with a multinational information effort and work with a country to capture and try said person. In a case when this is not possible, like Pakistan who tried sooo hard to turn over Bin Laden, then a small splinter cell to get them is acceptable. Sucks for Pakistan but better than invading, toppling your state and staying for 10 years.
- Same for humanitarian issues. If the issue is an actual regime that is a tough one to deal with admittedly

KoS wrote: stonebeard wrote: KoS wrote: The problem is also the lack of follow up by the police, by which they trusted Zimmerman's word and let him go due to a clearly vague self defense law..  I mean that department is now being investigated because of this, and they knew about Zimmerman's paranoia and racism.  True, but learning the police forces around the country are racist is like learning the sun produces light. Should be obvious by now. And fit seems logical it will always be true if the lowest-income, most-crime ridden areas are of a dis-proportionally large population of an ethnicity. It's just the case that it's rarely white people. While this is white privilege in essence, it is not something anyone should feel sorry about or apologize for, as no individual can choose the circumstances of their birth. Race issues are hard to solve, and the solutions brought up during heated issues like this are often reactionary. Yes, but to deny any racism, in part of a department and as a society is something to be debated. To deny that  "they are making it a race issue" is to deny that there are nay problems with race in this country, which is no the case.

Yes, there are a lot of race problems in this country (as in many other countries of the world). No, this particular issue shouldn't be about race but about facts and justice. That some procedures weren't followed (probably taking the guy into custody) is unfortunate but that doesn't mean anything beyond confirming usual racial bias in police forces (of whom, as everybody here knows, I'm quite not the best of friends). The case itself shouldn't be judged outside of the facts of the case, period. If the guy commited homicide, punish him. If he acted out of self-defense, don't. But people are so quick to throw somebody into the fire without any actual reasoning. Yes, it is a race issue it seems. No, it shouldn't be.

Edited by The T - March 27 2012 at 23:29

It was still very flawed Brian, but I agree much better than the other.




Foreign Policy:

On the left side are pacifists and anti-war activists. On the right side are those who want a strong military that intervenes around the world. You scored: -10

Culture:

Where are you in the culture war? On the liberal side, or the conservative side? This scale may apply more to the US than other countries. You scored: -5.09

Edited by Equality 7-2521 - March 28 2012 at 07:25

Not to distract from the quiz results, but this may or may not have made me want to smash my computer screen. Granted, the kid probably should have made his Twitter account private (I don't use Twitter, but I would assume there's a way you could do that), but that doesn't excuse the school's overblown reaction.

As a resident of Fort Wayne, you're welcome.