Are Non-Christians Able To Enjoy Neal Morse Music?
Printed From: Progarchives.com
Category: Progressive Music Lounges
Forum Name: Prog Bands, Artists and Genres Appreciation
Forum Description: Discuss specific prog bands and their members or a specific sub-genre
URL: http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=109789
Printed Date: April 29 2024 at 00:17
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Are Non-Christians Able To Enjoy Neal Morse Music?
Posted By: Bragi Taliesin
Subject: Are Non-Christians Able To Enjoy Neal Morse Music?
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 17:00
|
After many years of lurking around here, I decided to finally register today in order to ask this very question. For the past several years, around this time of year, I check to see what new releases have been rated the highest on PA and to listen to any with which I'm not yet familiar. This has led me to quite a number of excellent musical discoveries. Currently the top release of 2016 (based on members' ratings & PA algorithm) is 'The Similitude Of A Dream' by The Neal Morse Band. While I have tried to listen to this album on numerous occasions, I just can't seem to get past the Christian-themed lyrics (based upon the Christian allegorical novel 'The Pilgrim's Progress' by English baptist preacher, John Bunyan) to enjoy the obviously well-composed music. Although I greatly enjoyed Neal's writing during his tenure with Spock's Beard, his post-Beard output has just been too full of overt Christian lyrical themes for me to be able to enjoy any of it, as a non-Christian. Now, I certainly respect Mr. Morse's right as an artist to express his personal faith in his music, and I don't mean to offend any Christians on this forum by asking this question. However, as a Pagan in the US (albeit in the liberal stronghold of California), I am a little terrified of Christian propaganda, particularly in today's political climate. Thus, I find myself completely unable to appreciate any of the recent output of Mr. Morse and his band mates, however well-composed the music may be. Anyone else have this problem? I'm particularly interested in hearing from non-Christian Americans who were big fans of the Neal-Era Beard. |
Replies:
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 21:25
| I'm not really fond of religion and all, however it doesn't really bother me if the music has some religious themed lyrics... at least not so much. From Neal Morse, it bothers me more that the few things I have heard from him can become rather predictable and not particularly exciting. That said, I do love some Transatlantic, specially "The Whirlwind", which is one of my favourite albums, and I believe it does has it's religious themes and all, though I don't really make so much sense out of it (nor have I tried, really). I would say satanic themes on music bother me much more than christian ones, though. |
Posted By: Polymorphia
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 21:26
|
I'm a Christian and I don't enjoy Neal Morse's music.
------------- https://dreamwindow.bandcamp.com/releases" rel="nofollow - My Music 
|
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 21:53
|
I was raised Catholic, but more follow Christian teachings these days, so I’m not simply giving Neal a `pass’ because I share many of his beliefs. I think if you’re a prog fan, you’re going to at least be able to enjoy the `proggy’ arrangements, soloing, etc, if you like that obvious kind of symphonic prog. His music is always melodic and energetic, the guy has a killer ear for great melodies and slick vocals, so there’s plenty to admire on the surface with his solo music. As for the lyrics, I will say that there’s one thing people constantly get wrong and accuse him of, and that is `Neal is pushing his agenda on us, forcing his beliefs on us’ etc etc, which is completely wrong. All Neal is doing is offering something that HE personally believes in, and he’s never pointed the finger and condemned anyone who doesn’t think the way he does. I find that completely honest, and I greatly admire someone who writes about something he so passionately believes in. I also think he made the right choice leaving Spock’s Beard, knowing that he wanted to offer those kind of lyrics/themes without forcing them on the band’s general audience (although to be fair, `Snow’ is RIFE with Christian lyrics and themes, hardly subtle at all!  )Another example could be, do you believe the `hippy/dippy’ words that Jon Anderson writes on the classic Yes albums, or the sci-fi tales of Rush and Eloy, etc, or the Pothead Pixies beliefs of the classic Gong period? If you’re a non-believer, then I don’t think there’s much really difference between the nonsense fantasy cosmic words of those groups and the `fantasy fairy-tales’ that many Atheist’s dismiss Christian and religious teachings and stories as being! So if you can accept those, it’s pretty much `more of the same’! 
|
Posted By: Finnforest
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 22:04
|
I'm into the music, not the lyrics. I don't care about the political views or the religious views of musicians. Since my own views differ from most rockers, I wouldn't have much to listen to if I had that litmus test. Most of the prog I listen to is non English prog, mostly Italian, so I can't understand the lyrics anyway. The voice is just another instrument in the band to me, I don't treat music like audio book CDs. So Neal's lyrics would not bother me at this point. But I don't really like his music much. |
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 22:23
I worship toilet brushes and still find artists like Neal Morse and Deathspell Omega truly captivating. I was also fed substandard dogfood at a very young age  -------------  https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 22:27
Puppy, your pro-toilet brush, pro-Buckethead agenda has been quite clear for some time! 
|
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 22:32
|
^ Hey! How did you know about the toilet brushes? I thought i was so secretive ------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 22:36
|
It's filtered through all the Buckethead reviews, the clues have to be pieced together slowly but surely, but each reveal only brings more questions and hints!
|
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 22:37
^ Whew! At least my fetishes for spatulas are still safely underground  ------------- https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy |
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 22:52
|
You're not a well man, Puppy, but we on the Archives are happy to embrace the freaks! No judgement, buddy! Actually, I have an baffling obsession with the drippiest, lamest Hallmark Christmas TV movies, so I probably need help more than anyone! |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: December 28 2016 at 23:27
I am an atheist (since my teens) but I enjoyed the Question Mark and Sola Scriptura albums quite a lot a few years ago. Generally I find the same problem with Neal Morse (and Spocks Beard too) that I find with many modern prog bands, that he seems to be relying on the (nostalgic?) influence of older prog rock (I guess direct parallels with Yes, Gentle Giant and Genesis' styles). Ultimately I find much of his work to be a bore  But in general I find modern christian music to be......  (I love a lot of religious music in the classical tradition though, especially renaissance and baroque works) ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Tapfret
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 00:22
|
Are pessimists able to enjoy Yes? ------------- https://www.last.fm/user/Tapfret" rel="nofollow">  https://bandcamp.com/tapfret" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 01:41
no. ------------- What? |
Tapfret wrote:Posted By: npjnpj
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 01:50
|
Firstly and just to clarify: I'm an agnostic. I find Neal Morse's music impressive and luckily I'm able to listen past most lyrics in general. But when I actually focus on his lyrics, I find them pretty revolting. It doesn't spoil my enjoyment, as long as I can continue to blend them out. In general thoough, this constant god fawning is pretty awful, so in general I could enjoy his music more if he would sing about just about anything else. |
Posted By: Kingsnake
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 02:27
|
Many metalfans loathed Stryper, because of their christian lyrics, although they are one of the best hardrockbands around. Did you know that Pendragon also has christian lyrics. And almost all blues- and Southern rockbands, when I come to think of it. Why bother? Faith is about spirituality. And music is also about spirituality. |
Posted By: Dean
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 03:18
|
I'd say that Pendragon has some somewhat broad-based spiritual lyrics but I'd not call them christian as such. ------------- What? |
Posted By: Kingsnake
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 03:24
No, agreed. Pete Gee is the christian in the band, but he made an christian solo-album, wich features Pendragon members. This is an excerpt from an interview with Nick. Interesting point of view:
|
Posted By: npjnpj
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 04:24
|
That last sentence is a bit fascistic too, isn't it? Sort of a catch 22 thing. |
Posted By: Blacksword
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 04:27
|
I've no interest in religion, but good music is just good music. Ignore the 'message' and listen to the notes and how the music is composed. Simples. ------------- Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy! |
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 04:29
------------- 
|
Posted By: SteveG
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 04:34
|
For me, it depends on how good the music is and artist's performance. However, overtly preachy lyrics are a turnoff for me. I not a particular fan of Morse's music, but the same held true for me when he was in Spock's Beard. But as just examples, I could listen to Benedicts and Lay Down by the Strawbs anytime, any day.
------------- This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State. |
Posted By: Kingsnake
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 04:46
|
I remember satanists having a problem with Black Sabbath, because Ozzy cried "oh God, please help me"....
|
Posted By: Jeffro
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 05:04
|
I am generally not a fan when anyone feels the need to project their beliefs at me, whether it be through music or otherwise, whether it be politics, religion, or what have you. If that's how you feel, so be it, great! I just don't need to hear about it. I try very hard to live my life not projecting my beliefs on anyone else. However, it generally doesn't affect me through music because I'm far more interested in the music than the lyrics. The reason I don't care of Spock's Beard's Snow is not because of Morse's religious beliefs, it's because that album just doesn't click with me musically. I find it an extreme let down after V. I haven't listened to much of his solo stuff, or Transatlantic. For years, Kings X was characterized as a Christian rock band. I never really agreed with that label but it didn't stop me from loving their music.
|
Posted By: Jeffro
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 05:07
Good god, my wife watches all of those movies. What amazes me is how many of these movies can be made that have basically the exact same plot. It's always boy meets girl, girl meets boy, Christmas is wonderful, and we all live happily ever after. Sometimes with a slight plot twist but in the end, that's how it works out
|
Posted By: Kingsnake
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 05:40
| And what about Kansas, and Kerry Livrgen? |
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 06:30
Scott, Jeff - I CANNOT get enough of them! That predictability is kind of part of the...`charm' of them, I guess! I like the safe, cheerful, good-hearted innocence of them, everything (often literally!) wrapped up with a nice big happy bow at the end! I won't lie...I kind of went on a bit of a bender at a local store and bought about a dozen of them for a few bucks each to prepare myself for the holiday season!  I'm enjoying this (ahem!) `gem' at the moment 
|
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 06:42
|
My girlfriend and I watch the weekly Hallmark movies just about every Saturday night. I watch them for her benefit...but ahem....I find that I actually do enjoy them. An old softy buried somewhere within my tough exterior. (or so I want to believe anyways) -------------
|
Posted By: Jeffro
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 06:47
|
Well, I will say this, we definitely need more feel good entertainment these days. An added benefit to these movies is that they always seem to feature really hot women.
|
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 06:48
|
As regards to the original post, let me direct the OP to this thread. http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=103212&KW=neal+morse&PID=5197808#5197808" rel="nofollow - http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=103212&KW=neal+morse&PID=5197808#5197808 -------------
|
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 07:00
I split from my long-term partner a couple years ago, and a more recent potential catch turned out to be a dead end, so sadly this and last year I've had to watch them by myself. I turned 40 this year, so I'm not quite old enough to be a bitter old man yet I'm definitely a little burned and cynical, but man, when it comes to those Christmas flicks, I'm a bit of a romantic wimp with a gleam of hope in my eye!
Usually APPROACHABLE hot, too, which makes them even HOTTER, plus their characters are usually so nice and adorable that you just want to cuddle them....or, you know, cue me sending out lovestruck Facebook messages to them asking for their hand in marriage! I'm straight as an arrow, but I also laugh at how absurdly handsome the male leads are too, they'll come on the screen and I'll be like `Ah, for f*ck's sake!!! What chance do us `norms' have?!' Cheers for a great laugh, fellas, and sorry to everyone for temporarily derailing the thread! 
|
Posted By: siLLy puPPy
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 07:03
I like Neal Morse's music a lot but it's his vocals (not lyrics) that i dislike the most. He doesn't have a very good range and i think he tackles music out of his league vocally speaking so his music is knocked down a step for me personally. As far as lyrics, i find most artist's lyrics ridiculous when you sit and read them without musical accompaniment whether it be Satanic black metal, Christian rock or just plain philosphical prog. Once in a rare while i find lyrics that actually sound profound and condusive to the sounds that surround them. I think i'm like many who are musically oriented first and lyrically secondarily. I know others are the opposite but if i only got into music for the lyrics i would find very few albums that resonate with me 
|
Posted By: Nogbad_The_Bad
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 07:55
|
I would probably dislike his lyrics if I could get past the music, pass. ------------- Ian Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 08:08
|
It seems like a lot of prog fans here are not into Morse's music....so who's buying his albums? I like Spocks Beard and Morse's work with them...indeed V is my favorite with him. But for some reason his solo albums have not made much of an impact with me. I don't think it's the lyrics because they seem innocuous enough to me so it must be the songs themselves. Apparently his post Spocks music just isn't reaching me. ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: Terrapin Station
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 13:36
|
I don't have that problem. For one, I pay very, very little attention to lyrics when I listen to music. I really couldn't care less what anyone is singing about. But even if I do pay attention to lyrics and I disagree with a point of view expressed in lyrics, it doesn't matter to me. I don't see listening to music as something like voting for a point of view, and anyway, part of the gist of art in the first place is that you can't know that the artist is straightforwardly, transparently expressing personal beliefs or not. Art isn't the same thing as a confessional. They might be presenting something fictional, something from the perspective of a character, something that they're commenting on indirectly or abstractly, etc. I'm a "staunch atheist"--I've never had any religious beliefs whatsoever. Religious beliefs seem completely friggin bonkers to me. Yet I'm a huge gospel music fan. So definitely lyrics from a point of view I disagree with do not affect my enjoyment of music. |
Posted By: Man With Hat
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 13:48
|
Yes. ------------- Dig me...But don't...Bury me I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
Posted By: Terrapin Station
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 13:48
I'm not into him, but just because I'm not really familiar with him. I certainly know his name, and I know I've heard some Spock's Beard and enjoyed it okay, but I've never really listened to them much--I guess they didn't impress me that much, but I remember liking them well enough that I should give them a fairer shake. I may have even heard something from solo Neal Morse (or the Neal Morse Band or whatever it is), but I don't recall anything about it. I've not heard any Transatlantic. And I'm also not a Dream Theater fan re some of the other people he's worked with. I don't hate Dream Theater or anything. They've just never clicked with me. And in general, although I like a lot of the "big names"--Rush, Kansas, ELO, later Genesis, etc. (I like earlier Genesis, too, but they don't fit what I'm about to say), in general, I tend to not like the more AORish prog from artists I'm not already a fan of. When I've gone exploring for new-to-me artists in the last few decades, I've tended to be more drawn to avant prog, RIO, etc. type stuff. This probably just amounts to the fact that I grew up listening to Rush, Kansas, etc., but my tastes/interests changed by the mid 80s. Or in other words, would I like Rush et al if I'd only first heard them in the 90s or beyond? I don't know. |
Posted By: Bragi Taliesin
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 19:20
|
So, what I'm mostly hearing is a lot of people here who don't really care for Neal's music outside of its lyrical content, and a lot of people who pay little attention to the lyrical content of music in general. Neither viewpoint really applies to my situation, however. I'm usually a big fan of lyrics in music, particularly outside of the realm of prog, and they often tend to help or hinder my ability to enjoy a song. Outside of prog, I'm especially fond of the singer-songwriter stuff from the Laurel Canyon scene of the late-60's and 70's. In prog, however, I find most lyrics to usually be a neutral factor in my enjoyment of the music, with a few notable exceptions. The lyrics of Peter Hammill/VDGG greatly improve my enjoyment of the music, and the same goes for Fish-era Marillion. Off the top of my head, however, the only time that I recall a lyric making me dislike a song from the prog world (prior to Neal Morse's Christian-themed lyrics) was with 'The Trees' by Rush. Those lyrics struck me as rather trite and callous propaganda for the ideals of Ayn Rand-ian economic Darwinism, and particularly rubbed me the wrong way. On the music side, the sound of Neal Morse-era Spock's Beard holds a special place in my heart. I was living in Los Angeles in the early to mid-90's, unsuccessfully trying my own hand at making it in the music business as a singer/lyricist. Mark & Brian, the morning DJ's on KLOS radio there, introduced me to the music of Kevin Gilbert and Toy Matinee, which I absolutely loved. Then Kevin's later band, Thud, introduced me to the incredible drumming of Nick D'Virgilio. So, when I heard that Nick was in a full-blown symphonic-style prog band (featuring an actual mellotron, no-less!), well I had to check this band out. Sure, the influences of the classic-era were blatantly obvious, and the band certainly didn't seemed to be breaking too much new musical ground, but their sound was (to quote liberally from Aussie-Byrd-Brother) "melodic and energetic" and the vocalist and main songwriter (Neal) had "a killer ear for great melodies and slick vocals." They were a breathe of fresh air in the stale music scene of mid-90's L.A., to me anyway. I became a fan, and was lucky enough to see them live numerous times at clubs in and around L.A., and even to meet the guys in the band on a few occasions. To this day, I consider the "V" album to be one of my favorites from the decade. So, were it not for the Christian-themed lyrics, I really should be able to enjoy Neal's current music, one would think. However, my dislike for the dogma of the bronze-age sky-god religions in general, and Christianity in particular, really seems to get in the way of my ability to appreciate any of the music. Try as I might, I just can't get past the lyrics to see why PA members have rated his current album as the top release of 2016. Again, am I completely alone in this? |
Posted By: Magnum Vaeltaja
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 21:12
Well, you seem to have answered that first part on your own. Now I'm gonna let you in on a little secret... if you don't like certain music, then move on! There's so much excellent music being made nowadays, and so much excellent music that's been put out, recorded, and archived on the internet that there's no excuse for you not to be able to find something that fits whatever niche you're looking for. Why waste your time on something that you'll probably never grow to appreciate? There are so many other albums out there that you might fall in love with instantly. The thing is, if you want to find the quality stuff, you'll probably have to look a lot further than whatever some algorithm decides as being the most popular album of the week, as rated by some ka-nuckleheads here at PA. As many a wise forum user has said, "ratings suck; read the reviews". Take that advice to the grave, my friend. You'll get far better mileage out of finding reviewers with similar tastes as you and reading their thoughts on an album than looking at some faceless numerical agglomeration of whatever the fanboys think.
If Spock's Beard has a special place in your heart, then all the power to you. Blare it out loud n' proud until your neighbours send in noise complaints. Getting tired of those specific albums, though? Melodic and energetic bands with great melodies and slick vocals are a dime a dozen nowadays. Don't like Morse's current take on the sound? Browse around bandcamp for 20 minutes and you'll find all sorts of goodies to feast on. Better yet, you can pick and choose whatever music you most agree with ideologically. No one's stopping you! Why worry about rationalizing why or why not you can or can't enjoy an album or not? Good music should be about getting emotionally involved, and feeling the vibes, not getting in some sort of philosophical quandary.
That isn't to say that good music can't provoke deep thought, of course, but if the sorts of thoughts are along the lines of "how can other people enjoy this?", then it's probably time to move on. If Morse's latest album just isn't your thing, so be it. Not everyone looks for the same things in music and not everyone has the same tastes. Stop worrying about what others think about music and just think what you think. Life's too short, man.  ------------- when i was a kid a doller was worth ten dollers - now a doller couldnt even buy you fifty cents |
Posted By: Dellinger
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 21:22
OK, I may be somewhat blind in this since I don't know how he writes his lyrics, nor exactly the theme he is singing about, but my advice would be to take the lyrics as mythology instead of religion. |
Posted By: uduwudu
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 22:51
|
I suppose it's a bit like Jon Anderson banging his gong about god. I don't have to like or agree with the lyrical intent of any song. One Belew one from Beat I find I'm at odds with (Man With An Open Heart.). Presumably this is about the effect of how someone preaches a religious view and the mindless automatons lap it up and mindlessly practice what someone preaches. Well if you have your own critical thinking in more or less working order you should be fine. Others won't be as their critical thought processes were still born so others can have influence on them. Most religious and political mania works based on this fulcrum. I like a good laugh and Satanism (ooh, scary!) works fine. Look, when I were a lad I had this same problem with Sabbath's After Forever. ery Christ / god/ whatever oriented. Just accept what is in the lyrics and do about them what thou wilt. Which in my case was putting forth the proposition to my gf at the time that this Sabbath song was more her thing than my thing. She put her hands over her ears and said she did not want to know. She was from a very fundamentalist Christian type background. All her friends and family really loved me. They got all in a huff over the Deep Purple Burn cover. I knew one chick once who wouldn't let her BF play Sabbath's Stonehenge and that's an instrumental. People really are strange. Worry? Society has all these problems (weak people with their need to worship and demonize) anyway. Someone espousing these "ideas" will alienate (you) or enforce (someone else). There is a lot of music to hear in this world and if you have to cut the cord on someone go ahead and then listen to Univers Zero and Present instead. |
Posted By: uduwudu
Date Posted: December 29 2016 at 22:53
|
That was the slow answer. The quick one is no. Hallelujah. |
Posted By: omphaloskepsis
Date Posted: December 30 2016 at 18:06
|
I don't know if it's Neal's lyrics or the candied, recycled keyboards...But I have a difficult time listening for more than 15 minutes. I seem to have the same experience every time. Neal's music begins and I love it then the minutes slide by and I'm left thinking...." This is getting old really fast." Don't get me wrong. I dig Spock's Beard. And I like Transatlantic as long as it's DVD live.
|
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: December 30 2016 at 19:08
Well, to clarify my stance further. It's the music not the lyrics/subject that I generally don't like about Morse, despite having enjoyed two of his albums. I wish there was a christian band heavily influenced by Henry Cow or Thinking Plague ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: andreol263
Date Posted: December 30 2016 at 19:57
|
Well if you don't like the lyrical content of the music and don't know how to(or don't want to) give up on the lyrics and just listen to the instruments, give up that band and go after to something else , i did it with the pseudo-intellectual non-sense of CTTE and i'm still alive and well! :D ------------- 
|
Posted By: strangelybrown
Date Posted: January 23 2017 at 05:24
| Have listened to just about everything Neal has ever put out several times and absolutely love it all. I'm an atheist and cannot care less about the content of his lyrics: it gives his music so much focus. It's about the chord progressions and the amazing melodies he writes. It just takes a few listens to fully appreciate much like most prog.. |
Posted By: miamiscot
Date Posted: January 23 2017 at 14:59
| As a Christian I am not offended by Slayer or Venom. So why should a non-Christian be offended by Neal? Lyrics work best when sung by someone with conviction. |
Posted By: micky
Date Posted: January 23 2017 at 15:29
hmmmm ......ahhhhh
I simply think his music sucks.. all of that retro sh*t sucks. So no...has noting to do with the lyrics or whatever he thinks about God, Jesus, Religion, Trump or making America white again. ------------- The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip |
Posted By: biglevel
Date Posted: January 23 2017 at 17:19
| For me, non-Christians are still able to Enjoy Neal's music. Most people today, Christians or not admire songs without considering the lyrics. |
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: January 24 2017 at 03:27
|
Funny I should see this topic, I listened to "The Whirlwind" just a few days ago. Morse produces some of the best symphonic prog that has been done outside the classic years 1970-1975. But, I have found his Christian message more and more difficult to listen to as I have got older. Prog rock has suffered the slings and arrows of many a critic admonishing the "whimsical lyrics" since they obviously just want songs to be about boy meets girl. And, with Yes particularly the very esoteric nature of Andersons lyrics makes the music in my opinion. But Morse's lyrics are just irritating Christian preaching. I tried to ignore it - but when I got to "Dancing with Eternal Glory" - It just irritated me to the point of non-enjoyment. Perhaps he should sing about other stuff, he is a great musician, but his born-again faith delusion is wasting that talent!!! ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: January 24 2017 at 03:34
|
Years ago, I was a Christian person. Now - hell no. Forget it. But I still dig Spock's Beard. Understand where Morse is coming from But, I've chosen my path (to Hell, I really don't care.....) and I enjoy Morse and his musical / lyrical arrangements. Bless him !! What he does in the Prog world means a lot to me. |
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: January 24 2017 at 06:44
|
Well basically, all that nonsense that Morse spouted when his daughter recovered from a hole in her heart. Her recovery was undoubtedly due to modern medicine and the skilled physicians who treated her (though it was claimed that the hole in her heart disappeared after Morse his wife and others prayed to Jesus) For Morse to claim that her recovery was a miracle and all due to his invisible friend Jesus made me feel very sorry for his self delusion. But obviously I was and still am very happy with his daughters long term prognosis (and probably original misdiagnosis) He can personally believe that Jesus cured his daughter, he is free to indulge in his delusional fantasy. Just keep it to yourself and don't tell us such fecking lies!!
------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: January 24 2017 at 06:49
|
Who would I be to speak for non-Christians? Never mind, there is not such a thing like "Christian music" or "non-Christian music". I think that a non-Christian is at least as able to enjoy Neal Morse's music as a Christian, though the lyrics may be another story for some. Speaking for myself, I only listen to music because of the music and not because of the lyrics. Therefore I reserve only two to three hours a week for those songs with good Christian lyrics that I try to sing along with, though the music to which these are put is for the most part whining and bleating: the Sunday mornings between let's say 9:30 and 12 AM. For the rest of the week my ears would rather prefer, for instance, a Gardnerian anthem like Wassail because of the music to which it is set. ------------- 
|
Posted By: geekfreak
Date Posted: January 25 2017 at 11:42
strictly speaking Neal`s lyrics are his own points of view from re-finding his faith, has I haven't truly an faith due to the darker sides of life`s downward sh*t! but if anyone else has fine with me, but his he preaching no more than Cliff Richard did. if it is irritating you easy answer "Don't Listen" if as you say non-enjoyment hmmm don't buy them...please don't take this to heart its just my own point of view. he as produces some huge symphonic PROG!!!! Solo/Spock`s Beard ------------- Friedrich Nietzsche: "Without music, life would be a mistake." Music Is Live Two people are better off than one, for they can help each other succeed. Keep Calm And Listen To The Music… < |
Posted By: omphaloskepsis
Date Posted: January 25 2017 at 22:07
Barney's post mirrors my thoughts on Jon Anderson vs Neal Morse. I feel that Neal is preaching to me. Warning me of the perils of an unchristian life. I'm a fan of John Michael Talbot. He's a Catholic Monk/guitarist/singer-songwriter. To my ears, John Michael sings directly to God. Whereas Neal Morse sing/preaches about the Christian life. Jon Anderson and John Michael are worshipful. Neal not as much, and there's something about Neal's delivery of the Gospel that rubs me the wrong way.
|
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: January 26 2017 at 07:16
Anderson's spiritual esoteric lyrics are fine with Yes - I have no problem. Similarly, Genesis - Supper's Ready is fairly religious based (good v Evil) with quite a lot of biblical references (Apocalypse, dragon , Gog, Magog etc) - but it's mythical and non preachy - Morse's solo stuff is horribly preachy so I don't listen to it at all! I may have been a bit hasty with the Whirlwind - I reckon my irritation was with Morse's complete disregard for Darwin's 100% proven model for how we got here...Yes this is NOT more than time & chance, IT IS TIME & CHANCE get over it Neil....Mind U - SB - V is VERY Good, with no preachy lyrics.... ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: Biff Tannen
Date Posted: January 28 2017 at 22:09
|
I was raised Catholic, and while I am still believe in "something," I am not a practicing christian. For me, when it is all said and done, the music is great enough that he could sing the phone book and it would sound great. Between Transatlantic, Spock's Beard and his solo career (counting NMB in there), he has a staggering amount of great prog music. He is among the all-time great prog artists, without a doubt. ------------- "What are you looking at, butthead?" |
Posted By: Gully Foyle
Date Posted: February 03 2017 at 19:29
|
Nope, not even a little. Instrumental religious music is fine, but as soon as lyrics are involved, I run for them thar hills |
Posted By: thepurplepiper
Date Posted: February 03 2017 at 21:21
| Of course they are. Perhaps something could be gained from listening to the music and also being a Christian; identifying with the themes and lyrics, extrapolating based on that, etc. It could very well add to your listening experience and final evaluation of his work. It certainly does not mean that people who aren't religiously inclined would be incapable of enjoying the melodies, the stories, the instrumentation, songwriting, and yes, lyrics, too. And so on. |
Posted By: Dopeydoc
Date Posted: February 04 2017 at 14:40
Yes I enjoy Yes I'm a positive pessimist: ready for the worst  and enjoying the good things of life  |
Posted By: EGallager
Date Posted: February 06 2017 at 16:01
|
I've been a big fan of Neal Morse for a while, just love his talent for composing prog and prog epics. I'm not really into religion but I try not to let this affect me while listening to his music, it's just too good to toss aside for the overall meaning of some of his music. With that said, I don't like all of his solo stuff, I got Lifeline when it came out and haven't listened to it since. I enjoy the albums where it's more telling of a story than anything else, which includes One, Sola Scriptura, Similitude and even the Testimony albums. The stories are about Christianity but not trying to convert anyone. One of his most well-known albums is Snow with Spock's and that is telling a story, these listed above follow a similar route. I say, if you want Neal Morse but don't want Christian lyrics then just stick to Spock's and Transatlantic. That said I strongly urge anyone to listen to Similitude, great album, better live show.
|
Posted By: CorwinA
Date Posted: July 01 2017 at 11:41
| I *might* be able to get past the lyrics as a non-Christian, but when it comes to Neal Morse, it's really the vocals that kill it for me. Something about his voice, or what he does with it, is physically painful for me to listen to. :/ Respect to the guy for doing his thing, but the way he sings is just not for me. |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: July 01 2017 at 17:49
|
When he's being unconventional with the music itself ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Atavachron
Date Posted: July 01 2017 at 19:39
|
I'd like to know if Neal Morse can enjoy non-Christian music. ------------- "Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -- John F. Kennedy |
Posted By: skog_prog
Date Posted: July 01 2017 at 20:59
| I would say the should be able to enjoy it. I'm a Christian and I like some of Burzum's albums so I don't see why non Christians wouldn't be able to enjoy Neal Morse. Personally I am not a fan of him but that's just my opinion. I think it's all about how you view the message. |
Posted By: infocat
Date Posted: July 02 2017 at 09:56
|
It's hard to say, because like someone else said above, his singing turns me off first. ------------- -- Frank Swarbrick Belief is not Truth. |
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 04:50
|
The Similitude of a dream - great music - but the lyrical theme is the same as his last 10 CD's - see my review for a more succinct synopsis ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 04:59
So do you like self-abuse so much that you subject yourself to such punishment and then foam at the mouth in faux-outrage when you find EXACTLY the lyrical subject matter expected in the first place? Review....that's GOLD! |
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 05:10
I don't "foam at the mouth", you antipodean imbecile. If 'asoad' had come with an instrumental CD - i'd be very happy. Now toddle off and stick pins in your voodoo doll or whatever.... ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 05:13
|
Imbecile, right...Have you read the lunatic who wrote that abusive rant under your name pretending to be discussing music? Oh....right. Ooh, this is embarrassing. Look forward to your time out, mate!
|
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 05:23
|
I'd tread carefully Barney. You are out of supporters and that is saying something on a website with this amount of atheists. ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 05:28
I rattled the cage-of-your-faith and thus subjected me to abuse. I Sl*g off religion so I must be in a lunatic asylum? Don't project your ad-hominem vitriol at me. PAL! ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 05:59
|
Can someone please step in with that animated GIF of Michael Jackson eating the popcorn in the cinema watching the drama unfold? That always cracks me up!
|
Posted By: Meltdowner
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 06:06
|
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 06:09
Yes!!  
|
Posted By: Upbeat Tango Monday
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 10:22
|
I'm an atheist. Can I enjoy Morse's albums? Yes, of course I'm a libertarian. Can I enjoy Waters' albums? Yes, of course Only extremists and fanatics limit their input. If the music's good, that's great. If there are a wide array of voices to be heard, that's good and healthy. ------------- Two random guys agreed to shake hands. Just Because. They felt like it, you know. It was an agreement of sorts...a random agreement. |
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 10:56
I'm not an extremist. I do not "froth at the mouth" like a rabid dog. This site has "trolls" - who hide behind their keyboards like a set of indignant tadpoles.....imagining that they are really large examples of Carcharodon carcharias........ ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 11:01
|
The double-standards in play here are almost too much to comprehend. Godspeed Barney - I hope you find an anti-religious forum to your liking. This place though isn't it. ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 11:17
where are my double standards - I posted a fair and truthful appraisal of the CD I'd just bought - and because a few of you didn't like what I put - you started with personal abuse? And I'm a troll? Which part of my review wasn't truthful? Please tell, I'm all ears! ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 11:22
|
Uh....I'd like to know which Morse album was reviewed here at PA that started all the brouhaha....?
Never mind....I found the review. I thought Barney was right on about the fact that it's getting a bit tedious on the religious level, but not enough about the actual music. ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: someone_else
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 11:49
It was http://www.progarchives.com/Review.asp?id=1742316" rel="nofollow - this review (68 likes and counting
). But The album's name is The Similitude of a Dream, in case you don't want to spend time on this rubble. At least Neal's preaching is fruitful as it causes so much controversy .-------------
|
Posted By: Aussie-Byrd-Brother
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 11:55
I think you'll find the 68 `likes' is mostly people just blindly `liking' the album popping up on the Facebook page, not what's being written about it!
|
Posted By: dr wu23
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 11:58
|
Thanks..I found the review. btw...I'm about ready to strangle the idiot who allows Captcha on PA> ------------- One does nothing yet nothing is left undone. Haquin |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 13:25
|
I can't be bothered to quote in these captcha times but I'll just leave Barney with the following snippet taken directly from the site's guidelines: The basics 1. No Vulgarity profanity, or bigotry 2. No Personal attacks (flaming or trolling) 3. No Pornography or offensive images 4. No Sniping 5. No Illegal activities ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: Guldbamsen
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 13:37
|
I wish I could leave it at that but... Barney, your 'review' was outright abusive. It is not because you aren't allowed to critisise religion or any matter for that sake - it is however the MANNER in which you do so. We are a lot of members on PA who openly critisise religion, and some even take it too far from time to time, but you've been on a yearlong overly abusive crusade that quite frankly doesn't suit a man of your age. It is childish and actually having to spell all of this out to you is bordering on work in the local kindergarden - believe me I know. ------------- “The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.” - Douglas Adams |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: July 13 2017 at 16:30
|
I was brought up as a Christian but I stopped going to Church on my early-teens. I've pretty much become an Atheist over the years - but Neil's rantings don't bother me at all - he sings well, his music is fantastic. Why bother with his lyrical subject matter ?? Ditto Slayer - dodge-ball lyrics ; morbid, hideous, grotesque etc. They are just a bunch of words to go with the music. Anyone can enjoy anything, as long as the participant is willing. |
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 00:28
I thought long and hard - before I put 0's and 1's into a word-pad document. It was deliberate that I mentioned the music with the one line - emphasising that the music/lyrical content ratio is annoying - more - so because the music that back's it up is sublime. If the CD had been released with a instrumental version - I would have been as happy as a kid in a toyshop! I have two - Nightwish CD's - which both come with instrumental CD's (interestingly both CD's have quite rational / humanist non religious lyrics, so maybe they have released the music for those who would be offended by non-religious rationalism  ).I do not think that my review broke the guidelines - Mod's - do you disagree? No profanity - or vulgarity - just a bit of satire and dismantling a faith-based world-view? Perhaps those who disagree would like me to be executed for blasphemy? Just a thought. ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |
Posted By: Mascodagama
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 01:33
------------- Soldato of the Pan Head Mafia. We'll make you an offer you can't listen to. http://bandcamp.com/jpillbox" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp Profile |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 02:02
|
The real question lurking under this thread for the whole time: Are Christians able to enjoy Neal Morse's music? ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 02:04
Apart from prog (obviously via this site), the only inherent thing we have in common (generally speaking) is that we don't believe in that religion. How are we a definable "group" because we don't believe in that?
------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Mascodagama
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 02:53
Any religion surely? I agree that "we" aren't a group in any meaningful sense, and could have expressed myself better. I was actually trying to put across my sense of chagrin when I read stuff like Barney's that some may be lead to believe this kind of polarising rhetoric is representative of those who don't think deities, souls etc are a thing.
------------- Soldato of the Pan Head Mafia. We'll make you an offer you can't listen to. http://bandcamp.com/jpillbox" rel="nofollow - Bandcamp Profile |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 02:59
Yes, I don't believe in any religion whatsoever. It just irked me a little the suggestion of sorts of atheists as a 'group' and I see now you meant the opposite. At the end of it for me though, it feels ridiculous that there is even a word called 'atheism' aka, like religion is just a default you are born with, lol
------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 03:35
|
When one realises that there is no 'God' or 'higher' being, only then shall the World realise we are just mere mortals. Only basic psychology will annihilate the weak....... |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 03:47
No only that but how fragile we are, something I suspect many aren't ready to admit (like, "look at me, I lift weights"?) Ironically, it's a crisis for many but it's not even important, it's ego. Big deep things on a thread about the ex-singer of Spocks Beard? lol ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 03:55
|
When one realises that there is no 'God' or 'higher' being, only then shall the World realise we are just mere mortals. Only basic psychology will annihilate the weak....... |
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 04:02
|
Deja vu ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 04:09
|
^ Great Maiden song
|
Posted By: Thatfabulousalien
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 04:20
Great song, Best album? imo Btw, my extreme metal collection has been catching up to me a little lately. Too much avant garde, not enough thrash! ------------- Classical music isn't dead, it's more alive than it's ever been. It's just not on MTV. https://www.soundcloud.com/user-322914325 |
Posted By: Tom Ozric
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 04:46
^ Cool !! Yeah, Somewhere In Time. Awesome. The X Factor - even MORE awesome 
|
Posted By: M27Barney
Date Posted: July 14 2017 at 05:05
"Hysterical Ranting"? - My review was nothing of the sort. And as I said before (I hate repeating myself) I don't identify with any group particularly the "strident" atheist group (I am homo sapiens and that's as far as the grouping should go (seriously)) - the main thrust of my review was that (lyrically) - Morse was just re-hashing his usual dogma - and who would argue with that? ------------- Play me my song.....Here it comes again....... |