Pallas - The Messenger : out now!
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Printed Date: May 14 2024 at 17:11
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Topic: Pallas - The Messenger : out now!
Posted By: suitkees
Subject: Pallas - The Messenger : out now!
Date Posted: December 15 2023 at 09:31
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So, there it is: the new Pallas album, The Messenger. https://pallasofficial.bandcamp.com/album/the-messenger" rel="nofollow - https://pallasofficial.bandcamp.com/album/the-messenger Good old Pallas! At least, I like it (upon first listen)! On yt it sounds a bit muffled/compressed - the flac download sounds much better! - but it gives an idea... (full album): Edit: <vid not available anymore> ------------- The razamataz is a pain in the bum |
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 15 2023 at 09:48
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Nice! But I can’t listen to it anywhere. Bummer. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to: 
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Posted By: suitkees
Date Posted: December 15 2023 at 13:32
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^ Ah, the yt-vid has been deleted. I guess it was not supposed to be revealed in that way. Patience, thus. After listening to the first three tracks I decided to buy the CD, which allowed me to also download a digital copy. Sounds really good! ------------- The razamataz is a pain in the bum |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 15 2023 at 13:47
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The vast majority of releases on bandcamp are free to listen to, so it just annoys me when some artists lock their music away like that. Fine, I respect that, and will ignore the album.(function(){var js = "window['__CF$cv$params']={r:'83653e7fea274dc4',t:'MTcwMjcxMjA2OS4zOTkwMDA='};_cpo=document.createElement('script');_cpo.nonce='',_cpo.src='/cdn-cgi/challenge-platform/scripts/jsd/main.js',document.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_cpo);";var _0xh = document.createElement('iframe');_0xh.height = 1;_0xh.width = 1;_0xh.style.position = 'absolute';_0xh.style.top = 0;_0xh.style.left = 0;_0xh.style.border = 'none';_0xh.style.visibility = 'hidden';document.body.appendChild(_0xh);function handler() {var _0xi = _0xh.contentDocument || _0xh.contentWindow.document;if (_0xi) {var _0xj = _0xi.createElement('script');_0xj.innerHTML = js;_0xi.getElementsByTagName('head')[0].appendChild(_0xj);}}if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {handler();} else if (window.addEventListener) {document.addEventListener('DOMContentLoaded', handler);} else {var prev = document.onreadystatechange || function () {};document.onreadystatechange = function (e) {prev(e);if (document.readyState !== 'loading') {document.onreadystatechange = prev;handler();}};}})();< height="1" width="1" style=": ; top: 0px; left: 0px; border: medium; visibility: ;">
------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: December 15 2023 at 19:04
| I'd certainly like to hear it and was looking forward to it but there isn't even an option to buy it on I-Tunes. Appears that you have to go through Bandcamp and that's it. I will likely have to pass. |
Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: December 16 2023 at 08:34
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I am hoping that it eventually gets sold in the US versus only as an import. Imports tend to be way more expensive. I've bought a few of them this year, but they always tend to cost twice as must as those sold in the US so I keep those purchases limited. ------------- 
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 16 2023 at 10:35
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From what I’ve seen while linking albums (I’ve done more than 10k this year), only a very tiny minority of artists are so stupid. Probably less than 0.1% … I can run the numbers for 2023 from my database. All other albums are available either on Spotify or Bandcamp to listen to. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: December 16 2023 at 11:27
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My personal opinion is that the bands that put their entire albums out to stream for free are the stupid ones. It is a horrible business model. Given that you get 1 penny for every thousand plays on Spotify or whatever the ridiculously low payout is. I believe that Cuneiform Records does this. You can listen to one or two songs on Bandcamp, but if you want to hear the entire album you have to buy it. That is a much better business model as far as I am concerned.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 16 2023 at 11:52
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^ I just think that just as 2- years ago with services like Napster or Audiogalaxy, those who stream an album for “free” are not going to buy it just because it is not available to stream. Putting out some of the tracks can work, but how should I review the album? I will not buy it just to be able to review it. And I will not buy it unless I’ve heard it first. IMHO bands should just ignore streams or CD sales as an income stream and focus on live shows and merchandise. From that perspective, Spotify becomes an exposure amplifier. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: rushfan4
Date Posted: December 16 2023 at 12:03
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I think for the most part that bands could care less if you or I review their albums. If they do, they will come to sites like PA or other music sites and ask for people to review their albums. It is the mags like Prog or Metal Hammer that will reach the most eyes. I'm sure that people that have online review sites or YouTube pages are probably receiving free copiers for reviewing too. Otherwise, they would prefer us to buy their albums. For the last 100 years, bands would release a single or two on the radio and if people liked the songs that they heard they would go out and buy them. I think that this is the best model for bands. Allow one or two songs to be listened to on their website or maybe even free downloads or include on sampler or to play on online radio sites. I think that sites like Napster that were stealing the music should have been sued into oblivion...aka as I think that Metallica did the right thing. -------------
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: December 16 2023 at 20:59
| Yeah but I don't understand why you have to pay £10 for a download copy that is difficult to move onto I Tunes (for instance). I thought about the CD but then you are paying £12 + shipping which takes it up to over £14. Recently I purchased Glass Hammer's Arise on I-Tunes for £7.99 and happy to do so as they have been consistently putting out quality stuff for over 20 years. Pallas have been very sketchy with their output over the years with quite large gaps. Personally I love Dreams Of Men by them but nevertheless they don't quite have the prog clout as IQ or Arena for instance let alone Marillion. Also they've put this out just before Christmas and are touting it as the second coming. Nice artwork though and way better than the aforementioned Dreams Of Men. |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 04:38
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The reviews on my website are a mix of stuff I have been sent specifically to review from either the artists themselves or from promotion agencies and stuff I buy myself. In the case of Pallas, I purchased the cd yesterday and got access to the digital download instantly on Bandcamp. The band have not contacted me, but I will probably do a review in a couple of weeks. I applaud their decision to make the album available as a paid for content only. Good luck to them. The money these acts get from the streaming services is a disgrace, and when you put your heart and soul into producing a work of art, let alone quite a bit of money, then they deserve to have the “going rate” for their product. I simply cannot understand why people think they are entitled to listen for bugger all. The decision by Pallas to not allow listening on Bandcamp before paying is a relatively rare one, though. Usually, the site gives you three listens then prompts you to pay up with a message to open your wallet. I might get in touch with them for an interview and ask them, but I know what the answer will be and it will be a purely commercial decision. By the way, in response to the comment above re gigs and merch, this is not a commercially viable decision either. Venues are closing down everywhere. Robin Armstrong recently bemoaned the fact that only a 100 punters turned up to a Cosmograf gig, and they are quality. I don’t think he will bother again. Why? I don’t know, but that is a very worrying trend. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: Hrychu
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 06:11
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Whether you wanna share a streamable preview of your album or make it accessible only behind a paywall is up to you. ------------- Bez pierdolenia sygnał zerwie, to w realia wychodź w hełmie! |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 15:13
I do not think I am "entitled to listen to the release for free". I just think there should be a way to listen to a band to sample the music, preferably the whole album on a streaming service. Bands are free to do as they please. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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lazland wrote:Posted By: Frets N Worries
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 15:30
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it seems there is no reliable way to make money as an artist nowadays, which is why i do it as a hobby, and while of course, it'd be nice to do it full time, a hobby with little to no income is fine with me, though a little bit would be nice, I can see both sides of the argument. It depends on the band I suppose. I have no qualms about releasing music for free or making people pay for it. Giving them the option to pay, but not making them have to is what I've done. ------------- The Wheel of Time Turns, and Ages come and pass. What was, what will be, and what is, may yet fall under the shadow. Let the Dragon ride again on the winds of time... |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 15:47
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^ I think the problem is that some artists expect to record an album and then be able to live on the income generated by people listening to that recording (either directly by listening via streaming or indirectly by purchasing a copy). That does not work except for a handful of extremely popular artists, simply because there is not enough money and/or listening going on in the world compared to the number of releases we listen to. I have listened to 250+ releases of 2023 in full. Had I purchased all of them, that would have cost me about $2000. Hypothetically, in a world without streaming services or illegal downloads, The alternative would have been that I purchase a fraction of these releases (say, about 20) and then listen more to those. That's the thing: In the old days (say 1980s/90s) we were buying fewer records and listened more to them (a model which Pallas seems to cater to), whereas today we are used to having access to more albums for the same money (My Spotify fees amount to about 10 albums per year). We still listen to the same amount/volume of music, but by more bands. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: Frets N Worries
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 15:50
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^I agree, 'unrealistic expectations' is a good term for it I suppose. Not to demean artists like Pallas (who I'm sure make fantastic music) but live and learn i guess ------------- The Wheel of Time Turns, and Ages come and pass. What was, what will be, and what is, may yet fall under the shadow. Let the Dragon ride again on the winds of time... |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 15:58
^ No, more power to them! I won't buy their album, but I'm sure some people will  ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: Hrychu
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 16:23
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BTW if that album turns out to be a commercial flop, the reason will be obvious. xD ------------- Bez pierdolenia sygnał zerwie, to w realia wychodź w hełmie! |
Posted By: Frets N Worries
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 16:30
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On RYM and AP, it's not very highly rated..., got a low tier C on AP, and a 3.03 on RYM ------------- The Wheel of Time Turns, and Ages come and pass. What was, what will be, and what is, may yet fall under the shadow. Let the Dragon ride again on the winds of time... |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: December 17 2023 at 17:13
This is very pertinent especially the last paragraph. Also everything was released on vinyl until CD sales really took off (late eighties?). CD then could easily be ripped into computers at which point we got more hooked on the idea of streaming at the click of a mouse and not having to spend 10 minutes rummaging around looking for a bloody CD. I'm not down on what I see as natural evolution but somehow we have a weird situation where tons of bands are getting paid nothing but still somehow keeping putting music out. It's a hobby surely? Even for bands such as IQ which are well established I'm fairly sure they weren't living off their album sales even back in the late 90's and early 00's before streaming took hold. Pallas are at least one league below IQ.
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 18 2023 at 00:26
Currently that is only the combined rating from PA and RYM on AP ... still waiting for the first rating by a user ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 18 2023 at 00:33
I really don't think that living off of your album sales is a good business model for the average artist. Instead of blaming Spotify when that does not work, IMHO they should find models where they get compensated for the continuous work they do, like live shows, or actual stuff they sell (CDs, vinyls, merchandise). The fact that there are many more artists today than there were in the 80s of course means that most of them will never make enough money to live off of their music, no matter what they do. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: December 18 2023 at 18:37
Does seems that way, I guess they can only make enough money to cover costs at best. Touring has never been a great way of making money and generally was seen as a way to promote the album. Don't know on merch but I have purchased the odd band T-shirt here and there but that's about it. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 19 2023 at 02:15
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^ Both touring and CDs only work as a revenue stream for really popular artists. Most prog artists these days are not popular enough to attract the number of people required to make it work. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: December 19 2023 at 10:27
Mike, I agree with you. So, having established that, how do you think things can change in order to make what they do commercially viable, or should they simply do it for the love of art? A serious question, BTW, not a trick or cheap shot, because this is a problem for even established artists. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 19 2023 at 14:38
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^ Yes, absolutely. I do not have an easy solution. For me as a listener the solution is to use all the legal sources available, including Spotify and Bandcamp, which enables me to listen to a lot of albums which I then promote here and on AP. For the artists it remains a difficult challenge. Ultimately there may be too many to make it work for everyone, which means that some will have to do it for free (as a hobby), while others can earn a decent living from their music. It is a market which will regulate itself for the most part, even though that is not fair for all the people involved. ------------- https://awesomeprog.com/users/Mike" rel="nofollow">Recently listened to:
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Posted By: Frets N Worries
Date Posted: December 19 2023 at 14:49
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^As an artist, I agree with Mike. I'm fine with doing it as a hobby. The market isnt very fair, so be it ------------- The Wheel of Time Turns, and Ages come and pass. What was, what will be, and what is, may yet fall under the shadow. Let the Dragon ride again on the winds of time... |
Posted By: Gentle and Giant
Date Posted: December 20 2023 at 10:59
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Apart from Suitkees, has anyone else heard this yet? Opinions if so as I'm tempted to get the CD - is the only place to get it from Bandcamp (or is there anywhere else)? ------------- Oh, for the wings of any bird, other than a battery hen |
Posted By: lazland
Date Posted: December 20 2023 at 11:53
Chris, I’ve listened to it a couple of times now. I think this is a serious grower which demands careful listening, and, as such, any review on my website won’t appear until early 2024. Reed sounds very strong and there are some seriously good passages here, but dissection will take a bit longer. I believe that Bandcamp is the only place to get it, but a disclaimer that I am not altogether certain. ------------- Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org |
Posted By: Gentle and Giant
Date Posted: December 20 2023 at 14:09
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^ Cheers Steve, I may wait until the NY for some more reviews to show up, but your summary sounds promising. ------------- Oh, for the wings of any bird, other than a battery hen |
Posted By: suitkees
Date Posted: December 21 2023 at 10:49
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Interesting to read all the opinions about the alleged marketing strategies of Pallas. Maybe they don't want to make it available for free listening, which is of course a honourable stance. Maybe they will release all or some tracks for listening in the weeks to come; nothing has been communicated about all that and I think we indeed have to respect their choices, whatever they are. I must admit though that I wouldn't have made my bandcamp order if I hadn't been able to listen to it before thanks to that now deleted youtube-link. ------------- The razamataz is a pain in the bum |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 21 2023 at 11:47
| In the past couple of months I've seen thousands of Bandcamp release pages, and only a handful of them did not make the full release available for streaming. I think it's neither honourable nor dishonourable to block the streaming, all I'm saying is that it is really unusual. On the musicbrainz release page they label all bandcamp links as "purchase for download and stream for free" because that is the norm ... https://musicbrainz.org/release/c4da9116-3b72-43be-a178-d5a0fe6b53b5" rel="nofollow - https://musicbrainz.org/release/c4da9116-3b72-43be-a178-d5a0fe6b53b5 |
Posted By: Gentle and Giant
Date Posted: December 21 2023 at 14:38
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Ah well, I relented and ordered the CD from Bandcamp. The Limited Edition Digibook - it won't arrive until the NY, but it came with a 24-48 FLAC download version so I can gives it a play soonest - I hope it's good lol. ------------- Oh, for the wings of any bird, other than a battery hen |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 21 2023 at 15:26
| I don't care about the plastic (the digibook is surely nice, but I have so many already), so I purchased the download only. Listening now ... |
Posted By: Gentle and Giant
Date Posted: December 22 2023 at 08:54
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First listen - meh Second listen - Umm, OK Third listen - better Fourth listen - AWESOME It's a great album imo, possibly Pallas' best. I'm glad I bought it.  ------------- Oh, for the wings of any bird, other than a battery hen |
Posted By: Gentle and Giant
Date Posted: December 23 2023 at 07:52
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The CD turned up today as well - great service. ------------- Oh, for the wings of any bird, other than a battery hen |
Posted By: richardh
Date Posted: December 23 2023 at 22:26
| Still think it's a bit pricey. I purchased some 'physical' the other day (eMolecule vinyl for less than £20 and the Haken Fauna CD for about £8) and have to be more savvy about these things nowadays with limited funds available. I suppose you do get the download as well as the CD for about £14 which would just about justify it as long as I can put the download into I-Tunes. May give it a go as an experiment because I do want to hear the album. |
Posted By: MikeEnRegalia
Date Posted: December 24 2023 at 01:35
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^ iTunes? If you mean Apple music then no, you’ll need to subscribe to iTunes Match to be able to add the Pallas Album to the library and have it synced to all devices. But I guess you can listen to the album through the BC app once you’ve purchased it. I have iTunes Match, so many releases still aren’t available on Spotify …
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