Queen were a fusion of different genres, held together with camp pomposity and a quirky sense of humour..

They combined glam with jazz, pop, rock, blues and all manner of musical styles. They were a good band, for a while at least. About once every five years I'll dig out Queen II or Night at the opera, play them and smile. They were talented and innovative, and you have to admit that they were progressive and they were a rock band. Therefore logically they were a progressive rock band. They exhibited some prog cliches, even. The English eccentricty that came out of some of their songs (Lazing on a Sunday afternoon) for example, the occasional world music influences (Prophets song & Mustapha), the fantasy imagery (Ogre battle & Seven Seas of Rhye)

I would have difficulty arguing against them being in the archives. To be honset they are not among my favourite bands. They're a little too camp for me, and I HATE Brian Mays guitar sound, but if the consensus is that they are prog I wouldn't contest the decision.

I just wouldn't admit to my cool friends that Queen belong to my favourite genre. They already suspect and I have to keep trying to pursuade them otherwise..

Blacksword wrote: Queen were a fusion of different genres, held together with camp pomposity and a quirky sense of humour..

Sounds like a good definition of early progressive rock........................ however, as I've said before, I believe it is daft to bring a band in, when the majority of a band's recording catalogue isn't prog. However, Maani & Co must seriously consider a section within the reviews, that allows for the bands with the odd prog album, e.g

Spooky Tooth/Pierre Henry: Ceremony

Wishbone Ash: Argus and Pilgrimage

(and let the list commence  - with justifications for inclusion)

LOL, Blacksword and I agree on many things...but this isn't one of them.

I LOVE Brian May's guitar sound!

And for about the same period that Genesis was releasing their truly prog albums, Queen was also quite arguable prog by nature. I challenge anyone to listen to their first three or four albums and not find prog rock elements in abundance! Queen II, especially, seems to me to be almost stereotypically 70s prog, with the fantasy imagery and extended narrative pieces.

Of course, some of their latter-day releases are laughable...but how many 70s artists (even the ones with much less taste-defying tendencies) aged well? Once the 80s set in, it was either go ridiculously big or go underground, and Queen was not a band that could have flourished as a cult favorite.

But as with any band (I won't name names- that's just asking for trouble), I don't really care if they're in the database or not.

QUEEN PART 2: Brian May Strikes Back

All:

Sorry.  We've been down this road before.  Although some or much of Night at the Opera and Day at the Races might legitimately be classified as "prog," this does not represent enough of the group's output to add them to the site.  And, no, although Sheer Heart Attack arguably had some "prog sensibilities," it is not "prog."  Nor, by any means, are their first two albums, despite attempts to classify them that way.  However, even if all five albums were prog, this is still not the majority, much less the vast majority, of their output.

Feel free to keep making your case.  But this one has been rejected a number of times, and a change in the webmasters' decision is highly unlikely.

Peace.

I love Queen to death and yeah a lot of their stuff is quite prog, I just don't think they have enough to be on this site.

Why is Queen prog according to Garp.

1. Queen never repeated themselves, every album has a different aproach, this makes them difficult to catagorise, though on each album their distinct sound and style would catagorise them as Art-rock in my book

2. Their music has a strong sympho-sound to it (May's guitar, and Freddie's distinctive piano play)

3. The structure of their songs, it has a verse-chorus-verse build -up but the music changes througout the song. evolving and revolving to and from the initial structure.

4. they progressed through their album output, see next list.

Queen I; central musical angle: Led Zepp pastiche, with Gospelmusic influences

              prog, semi-prog: My Fairy King, Greaty King Rat, Liar, Jesus, Seven Seas Of Rhye, Son & Daughter.

Queen II; central musical angle: prog-glitterrock, with numeral progsongs.

                prog, semi-prog: The entire album is progressive, with a bombastic heavy sympho sound.

Sheer Heart-attack; central musical angle: mod/glitter/glamrock

                prog, semi-prog: The entire album has progsensibilities, Brighton Rock, Now I'm Here, Lily Of The Valley, In The Lap Of The God's etc.

A Night At The Opera: central musical angle: rock with operatic tendencies.

                prog, semi-prog: The entire album has progsensibilities. Bohemian Rapsody, The Prophet Song, Seaside rendez-vous, Love Of My Life.

A Day At The Races; central musical angle: rock with classical tendensies.

                prog, semi-prog: The entire album has progsensibilities. You take my breath away, Teo Torriate, White Man, Somebody To Love, Good old Fashioned Loverboy, Drowse

News Of The World; central musical angle: Blues rock

               prog, semi-prog: It's late, we are the champions, spread your wings, sleeping on the sidewalk.

Jazz; central musical angle. rock with remote Jazz influences

              prog, semi-prog: not much, just a little prog in the structure of the songs.

the Game; central musical angle. rock and Roll

             prog, semi-prog: not much, just a little prog in the structure of the songs.

Flash; central musical angle. space rock

           prog, semi-prog: The entire album has progsensibilities. Flash, The Hero, Football Fight

Hot Space; central musical angle. R&B, dance

          prog, semi-prog: The entire album has progsensibilities. Las Palabras De Amor, Back Chat, Staying Power, Life Is Real.

the Works; central musical angle. contemporary rock/rock and roll.

           prog, semi-prog: most songs have progsensibilities, it's A Hard Life. Keep Passing The Open windows, radio GaGa, Machines.

A Kind Of magic; central musical angle: Heavy rock, with classical influences

           prog, semi-prog: most songs have progsensibilities, One Vision, A Kind Of Magic, Who wants to live forever, Princes Of The Universe.

Miracle; central musical angle: Hard rock

           prog, semi-prog: The entire album has progsensibilities. The Miracle, Invisible Man, Rain Must Fall, Was It All Worth It.

Innuendo; central musical angle: Heavy rock, with classical influences

          prog, semi-prog: The entire album has progsensibilities. Innuendo, Bijou, The Show Must Go On, I'm Going Slightly Mad, Delilah.

Made In Heaven;  don't know the album well enough to comment. It's quite good though

James Lee wrote: LOL, Blacksword and I agree on many things...but this isn't one of them. I LOVE Brian May's guitar sound! And for about the same period that Genesis was releasing their truly prog albums, Queen was also quite arguable prog by nature. I challenge anyone to listen to their first three or four albums and not find prog rock elements in abundance! Queen II, especially, seems to me to be almost stereotypically 70s prog, with the fantasy imagery and extended narrative pieces. Of course, some of their latter-day releases are laughable...but how many 70s artists (even the ones with much less taste-defying tendencies) aged well? Once the 80s set in, it was either go ridiculously big or go underground, and Queen was not a band that could have flourished as a cult favorite. But as with any band (I won't name names- that's just asking for trouble), I don't really care if they're in the database or not.

I would agree that Queen II is their most prog album. 'White Queen (as it began)' and 'March of the Black Queen' are two gems of prog IMO. I can take or leave most of their output, but I recognise them as being a very talented and eclectic band.

I dont care who ends up on the archives either, as long as it can be argued that there are progressive elements in their music. I think it important to diffrentiate between prog ROCK and progressive music generally. I regard artists like Aphex Twin as progressive, but would never expect him to appear in the archives, for one simple reason..he doesn't make ROCK music

Blacksword:

On a personal note (not officialy), I could not disagree more.  I have owned Queen's first six albums since day 1, and love them all.  And I have been a prog fanatic since 1968, and was "there" for the release of In the Court, and everything that followed in prog rock.

In this regard, I never, ever considered anything by Queen "prog" until certain elements on Sheer Heart Attack, and even those are spotty.  It was not until Night at the Opera that the band displayed anything that could legitimately be classified as "prog."

Queen I and Queen II are excellent rock albums with nice proto-prog touches.  Brian's guitar is certainly a "unique" touch, and the albums have some interesting not-quite-standard arrangements.  But they are not, by any means, prog.

Peace.

Terrific band indeed, I had the pleasure of seeing them live a couple of times in the early 70's. There's no doubt they "progressed" rapidly with their early albums, explored astonishing new avenues, and gave more complex rock styles mass exposure and thus acceptability.

I agree with Maani though, I don't think they were ever a prog band. I suspect Freddie will be having a litle chuckle to himself right now at the thought.

Well If Queen Isn't Prog, Then Kiss isn't Prog either,

neither can David Bowie, Elton John, 10CC, The Sweet, Mud, AC/DC, Gary Glitter, The Eagles, Chicago, The Golden Earring, and many more be considered prog.

However If Queen Is Prog, Then Kiss still isn't Prog,

But David Bowie, 10CC, and chicago, could be considered prog aswel.

And that's where the trouble begins.

I think the moderators have an (important) task of keeping this site as prog-orrientated as possible, At a certain point when all prog-bands are included there will be included the borderline cases, they then pave the way for bands with progsensibilities, once they are included there will be bands with faint similarities to those bands who will be included aswel, in the end all music will have found it's way to this site.

It seems to me that, as is currently the case, the moderators need to redefine progmusic. so those borderline cases won't get in, and they may find that they've included all bands that can be considered prog. THERE IS NO NEED TO EXPAND just for expanding, there is a point when you've covered it all.

As is suggested in earlier threads there may be room for an additional subgenre (populair-prog or alternative prog) but it isn't necesary. The format of this site is great, but with to many borderline cases I'm afraid we will lose the essence of this site.

Just a thought. Isn't it possible to create a page where all those borderline cases get a mention, without actualy including them in the archive, just a small summary, explanation why they aren't considered prog and a link to the bands homepage.  

tuxon:

Will you marry me?

Actually, your post should be required reading for every member on the site, as it makes a few points that are vital to the continued integrity of the site, and the impossible job that I - and even moreso Max and Rony - have in trying to maintain that integrity.

I'm practically in tears with gratitude...

Peace.

Maani,

Thanks for the approval,

But no I can't marry you, I'm sorry if that brakes your heart

maani wrote: tuxon: Will you marry me?

Maani, you two timer, I'll never trust you again! You promised.... (I've sold the ring you gave me!)

Easy Livin wrote: maani wrote: tuxon: Will you marry me? Maani, you two timer, I'll never trust you again! You promised.... (I've sold the ring you gave me!)

...One ring to find them all, and IN THE DARKNESS BIND THEM!....

Uh oh -- looks like there's dirty work afoot....

I was stretching the definition a little further each album

But still, listen to the mentioned songs'in the same order as i put them down and you'll see what I mean (I think)

Don't add Queen!

Fat Bottomed Girls...

Now even Queen appears here?Nothing against them but prog?

RADIO GA GA RADIO GU GU .....