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Topic ClosedKanye West's weird prog obsession
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Tychovski View Drop Down
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Points: 249 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 21 2010 at 19:56
Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974, it's a scientific fact.
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Points: 28057 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 21 2010 at 20:00
Originally posted by Nathaniel607 Nathaniel607 wrote:

To be honest, I'm beginning to doubt he even actually hates modern music. I think he might just be a massive troll. 


Who says he can't do both?
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Points: 3281 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 21 2010 at 20:34
Kanye doesn't have a production team. He assembles the music himself.
 
Rappers sampling prog music is not even slightly new or novel. It has been going on since the 80s and I direct you to this thread:
 
 
which is filled with examples of hip-hop that samples prog. It's not even slightly exhaustive. I had many more lined up but the community seemed to lose interest in the game so it died ;)
 
In terms of producers who go for prog, Madlib is probably the most significant. He samples prog acts a lot and even made an entire disc of mashed up prog samples.
 
What's unusual about Kanye is not that he samples prog, but that he is so commercially popular and samples prog. However let us note that My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy his most proggy (and probably also best) album, had no big hit singles. Very prog.
 
It has sold very well as an album though. Very prog. ;)


Edited by Textbook - December 21 2010 at 20:34
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Points: 15784 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 21 2010 at 20:34
The guy samples a few prog songs and that's a weird obsession?
"One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall. "
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Points: 38 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 21 2010 at 20:51
Originally posted by Textbook Textbook wrote:

Kanye doesn't have a production team. He assembles the music himself.
 
Rappers sampling prog music is not even slightly new or novel. It has been going on since the 80s and I direct you to this thread:
 
 
which is filled with examples of hip-hop that samples prog. It's not even slightly exhaustive. I had many more lined up but the community seemed to lose interest in the game so it died ;)
 
In terms of producers who go for prog, Madlib is probably the most significant. He samples prog acts a lot and even made an entire disc of mashed up prog samples.
 
What's unusual about Kanye is not that he samples prog, but that he is so commercially popular and samples prog. However let us note that My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy his most proggy (and probably also best) album, had no big hit singles. Very prog.
 
It has sold very well as an album though. Very prog. ;)

Link appreciated. And I think you clarified my point well:  "What's unusual about Kanye is not that he samples prog, but that he is so commercially popular and samples prog. " 

That, folks, is my point. I know sampling prog is nothing new, but when Kanye West does it... I mean, come on, how is that not weird? 
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Equality 7-2521 View Drop Down
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Points: 15784 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 21 2010 at 20:54
Plenty of artists have samples prog. I don't see what's strange about the. The things people dislike about prog aren't evident in a 4 second rip of a guitar riff.
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Points: 734 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 03:40
Originally posted by Textbook Textbook wrote:

What's unusual about Kanye is not that he samples prog, but that he is so commercially popular and samples prog. 
You know what I find so unusual? Is how he samples prog and it actually sounds organic. Many artists might sample a huge song like that (well, huge in prog circles) for the sake of sampling it, where Kanye sampled it because it seemed to flow well and work lyrically.
The guy has a massive ego but his music is actually very good (as much as I absolutely hate to admit it)
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Points: 22989 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 05:01
I think "weird obsession" can be easily cast to to many people on this site LOL
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Points: 2720 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 06:32
When I hear of sampling in regard to rappers, the word that springs to my mind is: parasitic.
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Points: 15141 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 06:35
Originally posted by Nathaniel607 Nathaniel607 wrote:

I think he might just be a massive troll. 
No way! Shocked
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Points: 15784 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 11:25
Originally posted by npjnpj npjnpj wrote:

When I hear of sampling in regard to rappers, the word that springs to my mind is: parasitic.


Prog artists can sample classical composers, classical composers can sample each other, rock musicians can sample birds chirping, but rappers are parasitic for sampling prog?

Makes sense.
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Points: 8633 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 11:46
Yes, being derivative and being an outright thief are very different. Playing an instrument and using a passage from a classical composer is far different than pressing a button connected to a digital recording device that plays the exact recording of someone else's composition. 

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Points: 12877 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 13:05
Originally posted by Nathaniel607 Nathaniel607 wrote:

Originally posted by Triceratopsoil Triceratopsoil wrote:

just because he doesn't like new music, doesn't mean he likes all old music.  Ask him about Pink Floyd

The way he says it makes it seem as though he thinks there is much more bad music currently or something.


Ha-ha. There is! Does anyone not think that?
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Points: 15784 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 13:11
Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Yes, being derivative and being an outright thief are very different. Playing an instrument and using a passage from a classical composer is far different than pressing a button connected to a digital recording device that plays the exact recording of someone else's composition. 


What exactly is the difference? One 'theft' occurs with an instrument, the other with a computer. It's just a difference in means. One is right and the other wrong just because people here like prog and dislike rap.



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Points: 38 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 13:15


Same goes with even more genres than mentioned. Throbbing Gristle, This Heat, any other noise/post-punk bands anyone? Are they thieves for using samples electronically?

 And it's weird, I've noticed a LOT of people around here HATE rap. But I love [good] rap. Anything from Stones Throw Records is good for me. 
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Points: 28057 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 13:22
I wonder how many people here have actually heard the album. A rapper uses a 4 second sample of a prog song in one song on an entire album and suddenly he's a parasite thief with no talent. Nice.

I do think it's curious that the best songs on his album are the one's with prominet samples though (Blame Game, Power, Lost in the World). Though All of the Lights is still fantastic.

It sags a lot in the middle though.

Also, I suspect very few prog fans here have put the p***y in a sarcophagus.
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Points: 6451 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 13:24
Anyone who hates sampling should also hate the mellotron...an instrument designed to manipulate pre-recorded sounds.
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Points: 8633 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 13:48
Originally posted by Equality 7-2521 Equality 7-2521 wrote:

Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Yes, being derivative and being an outright thief are very different. Playing an instrument and using a passage from a classical composer is far different than pressing a button connected to a digital recording device that plays the exact recording of someone else's composition. 


What exactly is the difference? One 'theft' occurs with an instrument, the other with a computer. It's just a difference in means. One is right and the other wrong just because people here like prog and dislike rap.







Just because you don't get the difference does not mean there is not one.

A musician playing a classical piece is like a painter painting a portrait of my Christmas and putting the painting in his leaving room. A rapper with a recorded sample in his song is like coming over and taking the tree to put in his living room.


Edited by Tapfret - December 22 2010 at 13:53

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Points: 3281 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 13:50

Yeah I know and what about all the "borrowing" from classical composers that so many prog bands have done?
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Points: 28057 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 22 2010 at 13:53
Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Originally posted by Equality 7-2521 Equality 7-2521 wrote:

Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Yes, being derivative and being an outright thief are very different. Playing an instrument and using a passage from a classical composer is far different than pressing a button connected to a digital recording device that plays the exact recording of someone else's composition. 


What exactly is the difference? One 'theft' occurs with an instrument, the other with a computer. It's just a difference in means. One is right and the other wrong just because people here like prog and dislike rap.







Just because you don't get the difference does not mean there is not one.


Since we're getting really close to just declaring sampling lack talent, I'll just dispel that before it becomes an issue.

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