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Nursery Cryme vs Pawn Hearts
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Poll Question: Nursery Cryme vs Pawn Hearts?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
41 [60.29%]
27 [39.71%]
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richardh View Drop Down
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VDGG for sure.
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A Plague of Lighthouse keepers completely knocks out and overcompensates for the track consistency on NC, IMHO.

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Nursery Cryme because one can listen to it without  getting a headache.

Wink
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Pawn Hearts because I can listen to it without getting really drowsy.  I like both, but I adore Pawn Hearts -- and I never got a headache when listening to it, but head conditions vary depending on the cognitive abilities to process information. Wink
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Nursery Cryme. But this is like a contest between beauty and chaos, light vs. dark.

Both groups have their own approaches, so we're best just appreciating them both. Each has it's own space. I'd rather have both, than only one.


Edited by Boojieboy - September 30 2021 at 15:58
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Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Nursery Cryme because one can listen to it without  getting a headache.

Wink

Pawn Hearts, unless it's nap time then the first 3 Genesis records are better than NightQuil Wink.

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Nursery Cryme is a vastly superior album IMO.

Never liked Plague, it just gives me a headache. It like a nervous breakdown at times, and I can live without that. Man Erg is an incredible song, and Lemmings aint too shoddy either, but nthe album is let down by the 'epic'

Nursery Cryme is an eclectic collection of excellent songs, including some early Genesis classics, like TMB, Hogweed and Salmacis. I think some of the live versions of these songs were better, but a classic album nonetheless.

Pawn Hearts would probably sit just outside my VDGG top five, tbh.
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NC is my favourite Genesis album. I keep trying with VDGG but it's still not quite clicking.
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^ Have you tried The Least We Can Do is Wave to Each Other?  Sometimes I find too that it's just about finding the right songs or even moments and being in the right headspace.  "House with No Door" is what turned me onto VdGG as that resonated with my psyche.
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Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Nursery Cryme is a vastly superior album IMO.

Never liked Plague, it just gives me a headache. It like a nervous breakdown at times, and I can live without that. Man Erg is an incredible song, and Lemmings aint too shoddy either, but nthe album is let down by the 'epic'

Nursery Cryme is an eclectic collection of excellent songs, including some early Genesis classics, like TMB, Hogweed and Salmacis. I think some of the live versions of these songs were better, but a classic album nonetheless.

Pawn Hearts would probably sit just outside my VDGG top five, tbh.

More like a you issue than an album issue.  Sure it's your opinion that one is superior to the other, but some opinions are more objective, informed and valid than others. I prefer to phrase things as "I much prefer so-and-so because..."  And I rather think the point of A Plague is that it is evocative of a nervous breakdown.  If that is that intent and it succeeds then it's a success. I find it achingly beautiful in part and love the contrast in the music of this sort of suite.

That doesn't mean one should like it, but hopefully one can factor that into the evaluation of merit.  I find Pawn Hearts to be the far more interesting and engaging album, but then I expect that my tastes commonly are more "out there" and quirky than yours.
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One of my all time fave albums against one of the most boring classic prog albums to my ears?
Well, Pawn Hearts all the way

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Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

^ Have you tried The Least We Can Do is Wave to Each Other?  Sometimes I find too that it's just about finding the right songs or even moments and being in the right headspace.  "House with No Door" is what turned me onto VdGG as that resonated with my psyche.

I feel exactly the same way... "House with No Door" is the first VDGG song I ever heard - about a year ago - and it inspired me to go out and buy their two classic 1970 albums. I'm just glad that Pawn Hearts wasn't the first VDGG album I listened to, or it might have put me off them for life. Smile


Edited by Psychedelic Paul - October 02 2021 at 14:21
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Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

^ Have you tried The Least We Can Do is Wave to Each Other?  Sometimes I find too that it's just about finding the right songs or even moments and being in the right headspace.  "House with No Door" is what turned me onto VdGG as that resonated with my psyche.

I feel exactly the same way... "House with No Door" is the first VDGG song I ever heard - about a year ago - and it inspired to go out and buy their two classic 1970 albums. I'm just glad that Pawn Hearts wasn't the first VDGG album I listened to, or it might have put me off them for life. Smile

Other than Man-Erg, Pawn Hearts didn't really connect with me for quite some time. The two previous albums worked much better as an intro on the whole.   I did first discover VdGG in the bad old Napster days, so I was getting to know songs more than albums.  I was put off by what I would have called histrionics.  It's one of those bands that still carry favour for me after many years, while others I got to know at the time and loved at first listen I lost interest in.  Those growers often last the longest for me in terms of appreciation. That said, I remember well when "A Plague of Lighthouse Keeps" clicked and I became quite obsessed with it.  I had actually never "really" listened to it before in the right space.


Edited by Logan - October 02 2021 at 10:54
Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me.
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I prophesy disaster View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

^ Have you tried The Least We Can Do is Wave to Each Other?  Sometimes I find too that it's just about finding the right songs or even moments and being in the right headspace.  "House with No Door" is what turned me onto VdGG as that resonated with my psyche.

I feel exactly the same way... "House with No Door" is the first VDGG song I ever heard - about a year ago - and it inspired to go out and buy their two classic 1970 albums. I'm just glad that Pawn Hearts wasn't the first VDGG album I listened to, or it might have put me off them for life. Smile

Other than Man-Erg, Pawn Hearts didn't really connect with me for quite some time. The two previous albums worked much better as an intro on the whole.   I did first discover VdGG in the bad old Napster days, so I was getting to know songs more than albums.  I was put off by what I would have called histrionics.  It's one of those bands that still carry favour for me after many years, while others I got to know at the time and loved at first listen I lost interest in.  Those growers often last the longest for me in terms of appreciation. That said, I remember well when "A Plague of Lighthouse Keeps" clicked and I became quite obsessed with it.  I had actually never "really" listened to it before in the right space.
 
Pawn Hearts clicked with me the first time I'd heard it. Indeed, upon hearing the opening passage of "Lemmings" for the first time, I knew I was going to experience something very special. This was quite different to the first time I'd heard any VdGG, which was World Record. In that case, the music was very different to the music I'd normally enjoy, and it took a few listens for me to appreciate the music. The Quiet Zone/The Pleasure Dome cemented my love for VdGG. I liked that it was so different to the other two albums I'd heard, all three albums having a different sound to each other.
 
"House With No Door" was actually the last track on H To He Who Am The Only One that I come to appreciate, and my appreciation of the track was more about the lyrics than the music. Generally speaking, this is not the type of music to which I gravitate. However, H To He Who Am The Only One did become my second favourite album, but this was on the strength of the other tracks.
 
No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man.
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I should remark that I first heard Nursery Cryme not long before the time I first heard Pawn Hearts, which was a long time ago, so this poll is a fair comparison for me.
 
No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man.
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Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

^ Have you tried The Least We Can Do is Wave to Each Other?  Sometimes I find too that it's just about finding the right songs or even moments and being in the right headspace.  "House with No Door" is what turned me onto VdGG as that resonated with my psyche.

I feel exactly the same way... "House with No Door" is the first VDGG song I ever heard - about a year ago - and it inspired to go out and buy their two classic 1970 albums. I'm just glad that Pawn Hearts wasn't the first VDGG album I listened to, or it might have put me off them for life. Smile

Other than Man-Erg, Pawn Hearts didn't really connect with me for quite some time. The two previous albums worked much better as an intro on the whole.   I did first discover VdGG in the bad old Napster days, so I was getting to know songs more than albums.  I was put off by what I would have called histrionics.  It's one of those bands that still carry favour for me after many years, while others I got to know at the time and loved at first listen I lost interest in.  Those growers often last the longest for me in terms of appreciation. That said, I remember well when "A Plague of Lighthouse Keeps" clicked and I became quite obsessed with it.  I had actually never "really" listened to it before in the right space.
 
Pawn Hearts clicked with me the first time I'd heard it. Indeed, upon hearing the opening passage of "Lemmings" for the first time, I knew I was going to experience something very special. This was quite different to the first time I'd heard any VdGG, which was World Record. In that case, the music was very different to the music I'd normally enjoy, and it took a few listens for me to appreciate the music. The Quiet Zone/The Pleasure Dome cemented my love for VdGG. I liked that it was so different to the other two albums I'd heard, all three albums having a different sound to each other.
 
"House With No Door" was actually the last track on H To He Who Am The Only One that I come to appreciate, and my appreciation of the track was more about the lyrics than the music. Generally speaking, this is not the type of music to which I gravitate. However, H To He Who Am The Only One did become my second favourite album, but this was on the strength of the other tracks.
 

Regarding "House With No Door", I tend to really appreciate melancholy rather sentimental ballad type music (Nick Drake's River Man being my no. 1 example) as I'm something of the melancholy sentimental type and the bombast and over-the-topness of much Prog (my Prog credentials really are questionable) can take some adjusting to.  "Lemmings" was the track that I had particular difficulty with on Pawn Hearts when I first heard the full album.  VdGG's Godbluff is an album that I have to be in the right mood for.  At ties I have loved it, and at other times it doesn't connect.  I have similar experience with Henry Cow's Western Culture in that there are times it won't connect as well as various other albums.  That said, my mood and interests du jour have to fit the music, but I never seem to tire of "A Plague of Lighthouse Keepers".

And Silly Puppy expressed  how i feel about Nursery Cryme, but was trying to be more diplomatic.  I tried again to listen to it recently, and it just bored me.  Genesis' pinnacle for me is The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway.
Watching while most appreciating a sunset in the moment need not diminish all the glorious sunsets I have observed before. It can be much like that with music for me.
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^ Before I was into prog, I was into hard rock/heavy metal, especially Black Sabbath. Although prog represented an expansion of my taste in music, the prog that appeals to me the most still has to in some way appeal to the part of my mind that loves hard rock/heavy metal.
 
No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man.
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Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Nursery Cryme is a vastly superior album IMO.

Never liked Plague, it just gives me a headache. It like a nervous breakdown at times, and I can live without that. Man Erg is an incredible song, and Lemmings aint too shoddy either, but nthe album is let down by the 'epic'

Nursery Cryme is an eclectic collection of excellent songs, including some early Genesis classics, like TMB, Hogweed and Salmacis. I think some of the live versions of these songs were better, but a classic album nonetheless.

Pawn Hearts would probably sit just outside my VDGG top five, tbh.


More like a you issue than an album issue.  Sure it's your opinion that one is superior to the other, but some opinions are more objective, informed and valid than others. I prefer to phrase things as "I much prefer so-and-so because..."  And I rather think the point of A Plague is that it is evocative of a nervous breakdown.  If that is that intent and it succeeds then it's a success. I find it achingly beautiful in part and love the contrast in the music of this sort of suite.

That doesn't mean one should like it, but hopefully one can factor that into the evaluation of merit.  I find Pawn Hearts to be the far more interesting and engaging album, but then I expect that my tastes commonly are more "out there" and quirky than yours.


Possibly. I don't regard my tastes as particularly 'out there' but it's all relative. To most people I know, early Genesis is 'out there'

I actually love VDGG, but think they made better albums - for my taste - than Pawn Hearts.
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Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

"Lemmings" was the track that I had particular difficulty with on Pawn Hearts when I first heard the full album.
 
"Lemmings" sets the mood for the entire album. This is a bleak album. If Pawn Hearts was a movie, it would be in black & white. And I love it. It is unlike anything I'd heard before... or since.
 
No, I know how to behave in the restaurant now, I don't tear at the meat with my hands. If I've become a man of the world somehow, that's not necessarily to say I'm a worldly man.
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Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:

Originally posted by Logan Logan wrote:

"Lemmings" was the track that I had particular difficulty with on Pawn Hearts when I first heard the full album.
 
"Lemmings" sets the mood for the entire album. This is a bleak album. If Pawn Hearts was a movie, it would be in black & white. And I love it. It is unlike anything I'd heard before... or since.
 


Lemmings was/is a breath of fresh air, IMO! Man-Erg rules as well. Then, it's time for the main event (APoLK)!

"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021
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