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Topic ClosedPlease seperate Post Rock and Math Rock
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Dean View Drop Down
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2011 at 12:39
Originally posted by Easy Livin Easy Livin wrote:

Speaking personally, not as an admin, I cannot see the need for a split. The two genres are closely related, I have noticed quite a bit of debate on the net and in the music press about whether a band is post rock or math rock. The latest Classic Rock-Prog magazine ponders over one band (can't recall which) on that basis.
 
We have a number of wider ranging sub-genres, some of which are to me far more diverse than PR/MR. By way of background, the sub-genre was originally just Post Rock, but we were asked to allow Math rock to be included in the title which we agreed to.
 
Personally, I have some misgivings about the progressiveness of Post rock, and even more Math rock anyway. When we have split genres in the past (Metal and Art Rock), such splits have in my opinion widened the net each time. My concern here would be that bands get added because they are Math Rock, not because they are prog.
 
I don't was to open old wounds when it comes to previous splitting and renaming of sub-genres, so i will not say more on those. We are where we are. I think though we have diversified our definition of prog far enough, and should work within those we now have.
 
I would emphasis though that this is just one man's opinion. The thoughts of our members, and in particular our collaborators, genre specialists etc. will prevail.
Also speaking personally and not as an Admin, I agree with Bob. The further splitting of any subgenre (Math/Post Rock, RIO/Avant, Tech/Extreme Metal, Exp/Post Metal, Psyche/Space Rock, Jazz/Rock Fusion, Raga/Indo) is unnecessary.
 
If the bands being considered have diverged from the original concept of the subgenre then a re-think at a far more fundamental level is needed than simply splitting the subgenre - to the point of perhaps dropping one half of the subgenre completely.
What?
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Points: 83 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2011 at 12:34
Originally posted by irrelevant irrelevant wrote:


Originally posted by seb2112 seb2112 wrote:

Anyone have any suggestions?

Get Don Caballero 2 as well if you have those others. 


I have them all, I just enjoy 2 a bit less than the other albums I mentioned. I utterly dislike Punkgasm though.
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Points: 13382 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2011 at 12:22
Originally posted by seb2112 seb2112 wrote:

Anyone have any suggestions?

Get Don Caballero 2 as well if you have those others. 
New album!
http://www.progarchives.com/artist.asp?id=7385
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Points: 10189 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2011 at 12:13
Originally posted by seb2112 seb2112 wrote:

Anyone have any suggestions?

ENTER

Russian Circles

 • 

Post Rock/Math rock


Russian Circles Enter album cover
4.24 | 50 ratings | 12 reviews | 38% 5 stars

Excellent addition to any
prog rock music collection
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seb2112 View Drop Down
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Points: 83 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2011 at 10:46
Ok, so seperating the genres would be too complicated. Not going to get into any of the arguments about post rock and math rock being related/unrelated, part os the same sub genre or not. I'd just like to get a list of math rock bands worth checking out to expand my limited knowledge of the genre. So far I really enjoy Sleeping People, especially the self titled album, Don Caballero (What Burns, American Don & World Class..) and The Shy Trafficker. Besides BATTLES, I pretty much only enjoy instrumental math rock. Anyone have any suggestions?
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Points: 15585 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2011 at 09:52
Speaking personally, not as an admin, I cannot see the need for a split. The two genres are closely related, I have noticed quite a bit of debate on the net and in the music press about whether a band is post rock or math rock. The latest Classic Rock-Prog magazine ponders over one band (can't recall which) on that basis.
 
We have a number of wider ranging sub-genres, some of which are to me far more diverse than PR/MR. By way of background, the sub-genre was originally just Post Rock, but we were asked to allow Math rock to be included in the title which we agreed to.
 
Personally, I have some misgivings about the progressiveness of Post rock, and even more Math rock anyway. When we have split genres in the past (Metal and Art Rock), such splits have in my opinion widened the net each time. My concern here would be that bands get added because they are Math Rock, not because they are prog.
 
I don't was to open old wounds when it comes to previous splitting and renaming of sub-genres, so i will not say more on those. We are where we are. I think though we have diversified our definition of prog far enough, and should work within those we now have.
 
I would emphasis though that this is just one man's opinion. The thoughts of our members, and in particular our collaborators, genre specialists etc. will prevail.
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Points: 16715 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2011 at 04:38
It's not too small, Zeuhl has less than 40 bands. 

But I agree it's not going to happen. People just don't really want even more subgenres on PA and it would be unnecessary work. I'd rather the Post/Math people spent their time fixing the dreadful cut-paste from Wikipedia they've had for so many years. 
if you own a sodastream i hate you
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Points: 6457 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2011 at 02:18
You could also say that the genre is small enough to split now before it expands more, and thus creates much more work if one were to split it later. Now would be a good time.
It's on PA!
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Points: 65855 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2011 at 23:14
I like Acrux but they're a bit out there for Math (at least what I've heard)

the genre is not too small to split, it's more a matter of political will
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Points: 8844 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2011 at 21:38
Which is too bad because I have the same feeling as the OP. I like Math Rock based on what little I've heard, and would like to seek out more. I don't mind Post but am not specifically looking for it.

That being said, I've also heard at least one band in RIO/Avant that sounds pretty math-y to me (Upsilon Acrux). 
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Points: 13298 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2011 at 21:24
The genre is to small to split at this stage. Perhaps as math rock's popularity grows the genre will split, as Art Rock did a few years back (into Heavy, Xover, and Eclectic).

As of now, the math rock population is pretty tiny and couldn't support it's own genre.
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Points: 65855 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2011 at 20:44
they are undoubtedly separate genres and are getting more different by the day--  however, they are not unrelated, and are often lumped together in the Music Press/Industry

Initially when PA first instituted a Mathrock subgenre, they were autonomous, but at this point it would be quite a project to separate them (though entirely possible)
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Points: 901 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2011 at 16:53
They are definitely two separate genres. That being said, I also do not consider them to be sub-genres of progressive rock. If separating them is impossible, I think moving them to the "yellow" genres with proto-prog and prog related should be considered.
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Points: 22989 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2011 at 15:41
Post Rock and Math Rock unrelated? Not really, they're twin genres, who overlapped in all the stages of their career (still do). I understand your problem, though.
A split ain't gonna happen unfortunately. The general consensus is "no new genres", and we're too small and unimportant on PA to achieve this drastic improvement (but I confess I did think of it, and I'd support it).
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Points: 10189 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2011 at 14:54
A category for math rock/metal/pop wouldn't be too bad; problem is there aren't enough progressive post-rock (or math) bands to maintain a separate subgenre for them after splitting Post/Math. 


And you'd have to separate the Post/Math team, and it's gonna be a lot of work for the collabs to do.


Edited by Polo - April 09 2011 at 14:56
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Points: 83 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2011 at 14:40
Hi, I just registered so I can post this so I am new to the forum, but have been visiting the website daily for oer a year. First of all, thank you for bringing so much new music into my life. I am a picky b*****d when it comes to music of all genre, so its hard for me to find new stuff I really enjoy, so this website was perfect for me to sift through.

My one complaint is the following. I really enjoy math rock, although once again I am picky about which bands I like, but for reasons I won't bother to get into here, I despise 99% of post-rock. I don't understand why these 2 styles were merged into one on this website as they are completely seperate and distinct, unrelated styles. I'd love to be able to look through all the math rock bands on this site and give them all a fair listen, but it is impossible for me to do so without having to filter out all the post rock bands. If seperated both genres is too difficult/time consuming, is their anyway to post a list of the bands that fall under the actual math rock category?
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