Credibility

Blind Guardian, Radiohead, Tool.

You are correct with those.

There are some bands that shouldn't be here but ultimately, if you check each and every one of those, you'll find some coherent relation to prog, if not incredibly strong, at least, from a musical point of view, important enough as to make that artist or band necessary if you're to create kind of an encyclopedia of prog. I have to say that this site, PA, should actually be 100% prog BUT ALSO 100% OPEN MINDED as to what kind of music deserves to get the name tag or what artists influenced prog musicians or have enough prog elements so that people can actually mistake them for prog bands.... Prog is an impossibel term to define (the "prog music" thing) so actually, not you nor me has an absolute authority in what should be considered prog. When that happens, when there's not a higher authority, you have to let consensus decide, and most decision here are made by consensus of the admin team or of the genre-teams...so it's not that some prog-wacko decided to include his band of choosing... a decision was carefully made.... Also, when such a decision can't be reached, THERE IS a higher authority (not musically maybe but even more powerful than that, as they OWN the website) that will ultimately give the thumbs up/down to the inclusion of a band.... I say it again: Prog music is, first and foremost, OPEN MINDED music.. it tries to transcend genres, tries to go beyond of the boundaries of rock.... the musicians try to achieve other things that being in the cover of Rolling Stone... We as fans have to be as open minded and not try to encapsulate everything into a matter of time signatures and minutes-per-song... that's not prog, or, better, that's not the ONLY measure of prog.... Instead of being a closed community with no world to think of other than the "prog world", we have proven to be very eclectic and heterogenous in our tastes, which range from pop to jazz to clasic to (ghh) rap....and yes, if one of us sees an artist that could have influenced prog rock in areas different than your usual time-signature-oriented ones, we'll suggest it to the team... because we want to be as big a resource as posible... If this is the biggest encyclopedia of prog you can find on the web, it better be a complete encyclopedia, not an excuse for an exclusive club of narow minded fans... we should be as prog as the music we pretend to love, don't we?

Here we go again. If you will take the time to look past the most recognizable names, you will find more prog here than most people can experience in a lifetime.

I also love people who join just to criticize. It's always great to hear this kind of thing in the first post of a brand new member.

P.H.P. wrote: Hello, first post here in ProgArchives, or should I say AnythingArchives?, ...............................................................................................................................................................................................

Go in peace, man... We're happy with what we've got.

Walker wrote: I agree. Obviously the Admins have felt justified in adding what they did and it IS their website, so they can do what they want (of course). In my opinion, the credibility of this site has gone down steadily in the last year because of the additions of many artists I don't consider prog. Yes, I know they are in prog-related or somesuch category, but I don't  think they belong here at all.   off the top of my head: Queen Radiohead Tool Blind Guardian Led Zeppelin Rainbow etc etc

The site also does not consider the artists you listed prog, with two exceptions, so what is actually that you are fighting?

andu wrote: Walker wrote: I agree. Obviously the Admins have felt justified in adding what they did and it IS their website, so they can do what they want (of course). In my opinion, the credibility of this site has gone down steadily in the last year because of the additions of many artists I don't consider prog. Yes, I know they are in prog-related or somesuch category, but I don't  think they belong here at all.   off the top of my head: Queen Radiohead Tool Blind Guardian Led Zeppelin Rainbow etc etc The site also does not consider the artists you listed prog, with two exceptions, so what is actually that you are fighting?

Walker wrote: andu wrote: Walker wrote: I agree. Obviously the Admins have felt justified in adding what they did and it IS their website, so they can do what they want (of course). In my opinion, the credibility of this site has gone down steadily in the last year because of the additions of many artists I don't consider prog. Yes, I know they are in prog-related or somesuch category, but I don't  think they belong here at all.   off the top of my head: Queen Radiohead Tool Blind Guardian Led Zeppelin Rainbow etc etc   The site also does not consider the artists you listed prog, with two exceptions, so what is actually that you are fighting?     Exactly my point, this is PROG Archives, so they shouldn't be here! Anyway, I'm not really fighting anything specific, I was just giving my opinion on the topic brought up by the first post.   EDIT: I don't want the site owners or the admins thinking I don't appreciate what they have put together here, because I really do! I visit nearly every day. Maybe we disagree on a few things, but thats life. Keep up the good work!

I'm sorry, but the point your post was making (unintentionally?) is just that you don't consider some of the recent additions to be prog.

If you also meant that you don't think it's right to have the non-prog categories on the site, well, that's your choice and it only counts as that. I'd say a less valid one than that which is now the current policy. Myself I prefer to have the context around the main matter - just like I couldn't understand the reasons behind a Renaissance museum without Giotto and Durer, or a history of literary realism without Balzac. PA has gone far beyond being just an archive for one certain product, it has long ago become a tool of expanding knowledge over the certain product.

Not that it really matters, perhaps I'm missing something, but half of Walker's choices are in Prog categories (those being P.H.P.'s choices too)... Blind Guardian and Tool are in Prog Metal and Radiohead (formerly of Art Rock) is in Crossover Prog (which is described as a 100% Prog category).

Personally, I have no problem with Prog Related and Proto-Prog, nor do I have a problem with the wide umbrella of Prog categories that a Prog purist may have issues with.

Of course there are a great many worthy bands missing from the archives, but it's a lot of work to prepare the bio and examine the bands (listening to Paga again as I write), so I use other sources as well such as Ground and Sky for information on bands.  Sometimes I wonder if too much time is put into debating and looking for the merits of bands that other reputable sites include (not to mention preparing good bios).  Can take ages for inclusion , but I do appreciate all the effort that volunteers put into this site, and everyone can help.

For me this site has lost no credibility with the more controversial inclusions, but I am more of an inclusionist.  As long as the effort is made to categorise a band well (for convenience sake more than anything), I applaud additions.

I'm also pleased with the new categories, as I'm all for making it easier to find music with similar qualities.  Though I stick most to a handful of categories.  It makes it useful to find music we like, and to avoid music we are less likely to enjoy.

Long live Progressive music.  

Edited by Logan - September 01 2007 at 02:42

Now, the Scorpions DID guest on Roger Waters' Berlin Wall thingy. Very effectively, I might add. Although the accents were a bit thicker than usual...

Which automatically makes the work progressive!