future of prog

Manuel wrote: I think that there always be artists who want to write good, challenging music, no matter what the genre, so Prog, it seems to me, will always continue to exist, if even in a very obscure, non popular way, just like we see some young composers writting classical music, jazz, blues, etc.

Awesoreno wrote: King Crimson776 wrote: Frets N Worries wrote: With the dawn of people being able to make prog albums literally on their phones, I think it's a safe bet to say it's secure How many of those are going to be any good though? We need young musicians who actually listen to classical music (as the great prog musicians of the 70's did) and understand what makes a coherent composition. Absent that, you get a lot of the technical w**kery and "avant-garde" nonsense that we hear in recent years. The musicians may be very skilled, but they have no compositional sense. This take is nonsense as it assumes that many young musicians who play music in the prog sphere don't listen to classical (many do, and "classical" is a pretty wide umbrella genre), AND that one HAS to listen to it to make good prog (many don't and the music is just as good). So widen your scope, not only of what newer prog you listen to, but of what qualifies as "prog" or "good prog" or even "good" music. If you can't handle a little experimentalism and prefer more structure, or just prefer older recording/production techniques, then just admit that it comes down to your taste rather than lambast musicians of my generation with uninformed opinions.

Edited by King Crimson776 - April 15 2024 at 00:22

MikeEnRegalia wrote: ^ I don't think that kind of snobbery is helpful, but you do you.  Have you looked into the Black Midi musicians and what their musical background is?

I commonly am not that interested in the background other than, perhaps, to find other related projects. I'm not one who likes to read much about bands or music artists, or about music generally. I felt differently with film. I like to listen to music that I think will be or find to be of interest. I like to listen to black midi. I love a lot of music that has post-punk/ punk qualities, much of which I find progressive (if not so much typically Prog genre). I like classical music, and when I want classical I would often prefer to listen to classical music composers than those who emulate it and absorb it into a rock framework. Doesn't mean I don;t love things such as Focus' Hamburger Concerto or William Sheller's Lux Aeterna. I disagree that 95 percent is total trash in those charts and that just says something about your biases, not the music itself. I would doubt you would even know the music well enough to make such a statement fairly even taking your own biases and frameworks for quality assessments into account.

King Crimson776 wrote: ...If you don't have the understanding of Classical that I'm talking about, you get Mars Volta and black midi instead of KC, GG and Yes....

Or you sort of get both. Just as some might be interested, black midi has covered King Crimson (and I find similarities between black midi and KC).



Edited by Logan - April 15 2024 at 09:49

Logan wrote: AFlowerKingCrimson wrote: To answer the OP's question I think prog will survive. Many of the so called "old" listeners have children who are fans and some even have grandchildren who are fans. Then there's probably a lot of younger people who discovered prog on their own who will keep prog going for who knows how long. If you look at the birthdays at the bottom of the forum page you will see that the prog fans on here are of many different ages. Id' say it's pretty spread out. Good time to say it, happy birthday!

Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - April 15 2024 at 11:42

The future belongs to the young. 

King Crimson776 wrote: Awesoreno wrote: King Crimson776 wrote: Frets N Worries wrote: With the dawn of people being able to make prog albums literally on their phones, I think it's a safe bet to say it's secure How many of those are going to be any good though? We need young musicians who actually listen to classical music (as the great prog musicians of the 70's did) and understand what makes a coherent composition. Absent that, you get a lot of the technical w**kery and "avant-garde" nonsense that we hear in recent years. The musicians may be very skilled, but they have no compositional sense. This take is nonsense as it assumes that many young musicians who play music in the prog sphere don't listen to classical (many do, and "classical" is a pretty wide umbrella genre), AND that one HAS to listen to it to make good prog (many don't and the music is just as good). So widen your scope, not only of what newer prog you listen to, but of what qualifies as "prog" or "good prog" or even "good" music. If you can't handle a little experimentalism and prefer more structure, or just prefer older recording/production techniques, then just admit that it comes down to your taste rather than lambast musicians of my generation with uninformed opinions. If you don't have the understanding of Classical that I'm talking about, you get Mars Volta and black midi instead of KC, GG and Yes. Some may be fine with that, but I'm basically saying those newer bands are infected with a kind of "Punk" attitude which compromises their Prog aspects. This attitude is basically "it doesn't matter how much you know about music, just be creative bro". It's a poison that is ubiquitous in modern music. Take a look at any recent yearly chart on RateYourMusic. I think the main reason it's 95% total trash is for the very reason I'm saying. The approach appears to be more "let's throw cool sounds at the wall" than any kind of real attempt at composition or songwriting. So no, it does matter that you know the fundamentals of music and have an acquaintance with the masters of Classical, especially if you're making Prog. Where's the broader view of musical history? If all you do is listen to a bit of KC, Zappa, GG and Mr. Bungle and think you can make prog now (black midi), you're going to be limited in what you're capable of. Experimentalism is fine so long as the fundamental composition is solid. It can't be a replacement for actual musical depth. For the most part, it should be a "spice" rather than the main dish.

Grumpyprogfan wrote: The future of prog is already here. It is much heavier than the prog bands of the 70s. And when us Olds (I'm 63) die, there won't be as many listening to ELP, Camel, Genesis, and similar bands. Some may fare better than others, but I don't see Henry Cow or National Health getting played much.

Henry Cow and National Health have NEVER been played much. I grew up in the 1970s, and other than me there was only ONE person who liked them in our entire school. But Hatfield and the North and National Health especially keep influencing younger new bands, which shows SOME people are still discovering AND loving them. They're always going to be a minority taste, just like (for example) Flann O'Brien's novels or Utagawa Kuniyoshi's woodblock prints, but albums such as OF QUEUES AND CURES sound so fresh and imaginative they'll always find new converts.

Atavachron wrote: miamiscot wrote: Prog will last until the end of time. Just like Bach, Mozart and Beethoven. Mark my words. How will we mark your words if we're all long gone?

But, aren't you Shakespeare? 

cstack3 wrote: The future belongs to the young.  ...