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leonalvarado ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 03 2009 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 177 |
![]() Posted: May 16 2011 at 11:18 |
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In the world of covers, there are some good ones and some bad ones. Wait, that's also true in the regular world! Phil Collins just came out with an album of Motown covers and despite some bashing from people over the internet, the album has sold very very well and made it to #1 in the UK charts. I think many people are secretly buying it but that's only speculation on my part. Peter Gabriel also put out an album of just covers and many people seem fine with it. It wasn't until the third album when YES had a full album of their own material.
As long as there are great songs, people will cover them. I did an album a couple of years ago that covered many Genesis songs (http://www.leonplaysmusic.com/Site/..html). Despite having some body like Steve Hackett commenting on how much he liked the album. Sales of the songs have slowed down to a crawl. I figure some of that it's just expected but along the way I have found that most people either like the idea of covers or hate it (unless they are done by somebody already famous). It seems to me that is a matter of perception more than anything else. The divisions come from various angles. Some people actually think that covering a song is a way to make a "quick buck" on the part of the performer. This could not be farthest from the truth. Any of you who have made records before know how much time and money it takes to professionally record a song. On top of that, add the costs of licensing and the acknowledge that it is someone else's composition. Covers are often compared to the original disregarding the artist intentions altogether. It would be silly for some unknown musician to try to "cash in" any big money through the recording of covers. So why doing them to begin with? Well, because people like me (and apparently Peter Gabriel, Phil Collins, YES, etc), just happen to love those songs enough to make alternate versions of them. Covers give musicians an opportunity to study whilst at the same time pay homage to the music that for one reason or another, carries lots of personal feelings. Music is a form of art that touches all of us in many ways. As listeners as well as musicians. In that respect we all have the same thing in common and that's why I don't understand the sometimes reluctance to accept a cover song for what it is. Without covering existing materials there would not be much of a classical music market. Jazz musicians do reinterpretations of famous pieces and many recording artists do great covers of songs (like Joe Coker's version of "With a little help from my friends"). For my part, I wish that people would listen to some of my covers and take them for what they are. Not replacements for the originals but alternate versions of great existing songs. |
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Nathaniel607 ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: June 28 2010 Status: Offline Points: 374 |
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I think it's just because it's not original material. Simple as that.
I like a good cover if it's done well, but I have to admit, some times I hear a cover and think, "what's the point?". Also, I posted this on JMA, but this is easily the greatest cover ever; Oh, and your link doesn't work. Probably cause you've got two "http"'s.
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RoyFairbank ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: January 07 2008 Location: Somewhere Status: Offline Points: 1072 |
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Covers usually lack the genuine first-time arrangement or vocal that goes into a song. The song has been "laid down" in the style of the first singer, the original band and the composition of the song belongs "spiritually" to that band, (unless it was written for them [which makes it sort of a cover]."
Some good covers??? Some early rock songs were massively improved by the technology advances and pure drive of later decades. I think there are a lot of fine covers of 50s rock and roll standards. These are almost "open source." On the other hand, I think that the majority of good music is quite uncoverable. I disagree strongly with anyone who says Dylan is better through covers. It is an ignorant myth from people who've never heard Dylan. Even the best cover, All Along The Watchtower, can not win against the original. The others are not even close. Hendrix picked up on the rule of covering songs: make it completely different, you can't win the imitation game. That's all I got to say right now, sorry if its a bit rushed.... Keep in mind that anyone who covers Genesis is a hero to me in any case! |
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Slartibartfast ![]() Collaborator ![]() ![]() Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29630 |
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I am neither a fan or an opposer of covers. I only want an original interpretation.
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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The T ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 16 2006 Location: FL, USA Status: Offline Points: 17493 |
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I hate covers. I prefer discs to be shipped in an empty jewel case.
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akamaisondufromage ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: May 16 2009 Location: Blighty Status: Offline Points: 6797 |
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People generally do covers of records they like and then make the mistake of trying to keep to the original. So, I think why bother? I certainly wouldn't buy a cover of a record I liked that sounded like the original. I would (Quel Suprise) buy the original. Sometimes, artists do something original with a song I like and so I might buy it,but rarely. I often think they might be better off doing a song that didn't really work the first time round rather than the usual cover of classic songs. |
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Help me I'm falling!
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KingCrimson250 ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() Joined: October 29 2008 Status: Offline Points: 573 |
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It's a fine line between making the cover too similar, and thus redundant, or making the cover too different, and thus losing the original purpose or "soul" of the song, and most artists tend to err too heavily to one side or another.
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richardh ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: February 18 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 30650 |
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Always room for a good cover
and |
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Henry Plainview ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: May 26 2008 Location: Declined Status: Offline Points: 16715 |
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I generally don't like covers because I want to hear new material when I buy something. There are a few exceptions where the cover a well-known song is better than the original, but generally I'm not interested in hearing someone's interpretation of a famous song because I've already heard the famous song. It's better if a famous person is taking a relatively unknown song and making their own, but I will always generally think it's lame not to be playing your own material.
UGH I honestly flinched. Hey everyone, let's take an album known for its subtlety and do it in a format where subtlety is not possible! |
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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harmonium.ro ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: August 18 2008 Location: Anna Calvi Status: Offline Points: 22989 |
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Many people here seem to have a festish on originality.
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WalterDigsTunes ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() Joined: September 11 2007 Location: SanDiegoTijuana Status: Offline Points: 4373 |
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And others fetishize a dull re-tread of old ideas. That certainly seems to be the norm today. |
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Henry Plainview ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: May 26 2008 Location: Declined Status: Offline Points: 16715 |
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It's about repetition as much as it is about originality for me. But other people seem to have a very different perspective on music than I do. I remember talking to Atavachron about the Phil Collins motown album, and clearly I just don't get it. :S |
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if you own a sodastream i hate you
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akamaisondufromage ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() VIP Member Joined: May 16 2009 Location: Blighty Status: Offline Points: 6797 |
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Somewnere there's a place for covers?
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Help me I'm falling!
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krishl ![]() Forum Groupie ![]() ![]() Joined: May 05 2009 Location: Land of Enchant Status: Offline Points: 84 |
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Just imagine a world in which Jimi Hendrix never covered All Along the Watchtower.
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Nathaniel607 ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: June 28 2010 Status: Offline Points: 374 |
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I don't know, I quite liked it! I think they still managed to retain a bunch of the subtlety, but just give an interesting spin on things. I don't seriously think it's the greatest cover ever though - I do like it a bit, but it does have some humorous value as well!
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The Pessimist ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: June 13 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 3834 |
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Who is opposed to covers? Function bands only do covers and they tend to get tonnes of work if they're of quality
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"Market value is irrelevant to intrinsic value."
Arnold Schoenberg |
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Man With Hat ![]() Collaborator ![]() ![]() Jazz-Rock/Fusion/Canterbury Team Joined: March 12 2005 Location: Neurotica Status: Offline Points: 166183 |
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^ Hi, nice to meet you TP. I don't really care for covers because if I wanted to hear the song that particular group was covering I would see/listen to the original artist. Especially if I am paying for something I want it to be that artists own work. Sure, you can heavily rework the song, but still...why not just make a new song in that style that you're covering then? As a musician I can see why it would be fun to "jam out" to an established song in a basement or studio somewhere, but it doesn't really appeal to me. TP does raise a good point about classical music...a lot of covering going on there. But even in the jazz world, I rather hear the orinigal 1920's version, but more often than not they probably don't exist or sound like sh*t, so I must settle for covered versions. Maybe it's just rock is too young.
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Dig me...But don't...Bury me
I'm running still, I shall until, one day, I hope that I'll arrive Warning: Listening to jazz excessively can cause a laxative effect. |
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wilmon91 ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() Joined: August 15 2009 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 698 |
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The music I despise the most is rock cover bands, doing classic songs like "living on a prayer" and "hotel california". It makes me feel sick.
When big artists do an album only with covers, it doesn't make me excited. I just get the feeling that they have run out of creativity, and if they choose popular songs there will be an automatic interest in the album, so they don't have to worry about sales. Toto's cover album was horrific. They chose classic rock songs. The second cd of Simple Minds Graffiti Soul (deluxe edition) was a cover album which had some interesting diverse song choices. But still, it's not that exciting to me. But it was a bonus cd, so it's great as a bonus. But throwing in one cover song on an album is allright. I think when playing in a band , it's so easy to just decide to do a cover, the whole song is already written and you can just have fun. It can be a priviledge. But I think bands should restrain themselves from doing covers. There should be a really good reason, for instance an idea of a different arrangement, or an ambition to emphasize stuff of the original and make it even better. There are songs that could be made better with a cover version. Tony Banks "Strictly Inc" is an album which has a very mechanical and stiff production. "Piece of You" could definitely be made better with a richer sound (with real drums and brass .... that synth brass solo sounds like a joke). But there are a lot of variation in the harmonies, so maybe it could really come alive in a cover version.
The movie "The Wicker man" had a nice song in it. The audio from the movie though isn't of the best quality. Thats a good example of when a cover version is really called for. I heard a good cover by Faith & Disease, but Nature & Organizations version is probably the best, with Rose McDowall on vocals. Better than the original, definitely!
Edited by wilmon91 - May 16 2011 at 17:36 |
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Slartibartfast ![]() Collaborator ![]() ![]() Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29630 |
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Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
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leonalvarado ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 03 2009 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 177 |
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I really don't understand the hate. I think covers should be judged by the level of interpretation just like any other songs. I understand that they do not involve the same level of creativity that it took for the original composers to come up with the song in the first place. At the same time, most people who have done some covers also have many original compositions of their own.
Doing a cover song doesn't necessarily mean that a musician doesn't have creativity. For the most part it means that they have strong enough feelings for a particular piece of music to recorded in their own way. The argument about only listening to the original is like never seeing a movie remake, a theatrical revival or anything that gets reinterpreted. despite what most people say, they do go watch remakes and sometimes listen to a cover song. If anything, they would like to put their curiosity to rest. Because after all, you never know and you may like what you hear. I think many people don't like covers because they feel there is some sacred connection between the music and its originator. There is some truth in that statement however, music is written to be performed and many of the bands that created that music will cease to exist making covers even more relevant. If it weren't for covers, nobody within our lifetime would have ever heard of names like Beethoven, Mozart, Litz, Chopin, Ravel, Tchaikovsky, etc. That, by itself, is a pretty good argument for the existence of covers. I don't see it as much as comparing covers with original material because they are two different things. If you want to give an artist merit for his creativity, then you must go for his original work. If you want to hear a different take on one of your favourite songs, then a cover might just do the trick. Remember that music is a very subjective issue. I just find it peculiar that some people can trash something with such convictions without as much as trying to understand the artist intentions. Some people love my covers, some people love my originals, some hate them both. As for me, I love Joe Coker's "With a Little Help From My friends" a lot more than the Beatles original, and I'm not bashing the Beatles who up until one point in my life were my favourite band. To me there are good covers and bad covers but I'm not going to dismiss the concept just because. If I would have done so, then I would have never enjoyed versions like Mr. Cocker's or YES' version of Simon & Garfunkle's America (which I also happen to love). People should be a little more open-minded, it only leads to better things. One more thing, the corrected link:
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