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el böthy
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 27 2005
Location: Argentina
Status: Offline
Points: 6336
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Posted: May 16 2007 at 23:47 |
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"You want me to play what, Robert?"
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: September 30 2006
Location: Pearland
Status: Offline
Points: 66004
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Posted: May 16 2007 at 23:48 |
ClassicRocker wrote:
Atavachron wrote:
ClassicRocker wrote:
Nowadays many bands still tour, yet the prices can be outrageous (I don't have $200 to see Tull!) | where are you having to pay that amount to see Tull? They're one of the most frequently touring classic prog bands, and tickets don't usually run higher than 40 or 50 dollars in the U.S... even scalpers wouldn't try charging $200 for Tull. |
Heh, well sorry to inform you, but recently Tull tickets went on sale in my area, and the prices ranged from $100 (for the worst seats) all the way to $250+! |
I'm shocked, sorry to hear that.. sad.
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darksideof
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 22 2007
Location: Newark N.J.
Status: Offline
Points: 2318
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 01:41 |
Ghandi 2 wrote:
Hatters wrote:
Stop your complaining darksideof. I'm only 17 and would kill to go back in time to see Pick Floyd, Yes Zappa etc. Just be happy that you got to see good bands no matter what they played. |
That's not a very positive attitude. And I'm almost positive he's talking about classic prog groups touring today.
People want to hear those. I don't know why: I've heard DSOTM enough times that nothing would induce me to pay money to go see/hear it live unless I were traveling back in time. Just like I can't imagine anyone in the whole world paying a lot of money to go hear the Rolling Stones play Satisfaction on their 2005 tour. But obviously it works, or they wouldn't do it. |
exactly.!!!! Zappa is dead and Floyd I doubt they will tour again. Yes is still tour but i refuse to see them live unless the do the whole Topographic or some songs from relayer which i doubt it. I guess I was blessed to these bands live but I am not complaing about their whole intire concert I am talking about songs like in my examples and their dvds when does have the same bring stuff over and over.
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http://darksideofcollages.blogspot.com/
http://www.metalmusicarchives.com/
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Darksideof-Collages/
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darksideof
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 22 2007
Location: Newark N.J.
Status: Offline
Points: 2318
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 01:45 |
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http://darksideofcollages.blogspot.com/
http://www.metalmusicarchives.com/
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Darksideof-Collages/
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darksideof
Forum Senior Member
Joined: February 22 2007
Location: Newark N.J.
Status: Offline
Points: 2318
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 02:01 |
I also want to say that if a band feel the presure to play the hits because the fans won't come if they don't. If that's true, then where is true genuine loving true fans that apreciate their art form. Musicians should have the freedom and greatful desire to please themselves because by doing that his fans will also respect , admire even more their talent. I am a grafic designer /Ilustrator and even thougth I do have to please my clients to a limit I also have the choice and freedom to express my design and drawing in my own unique way. regasdless if they like or not. if they don't them tuff. however If they like my style they wouldn't hire in the first place. I am the one who make the chioces and musicians should allow to do the same.
That's sucks if that is true.!!!!!!
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http://darksideofcollages.blogspot.com/
http://www.metalmusicarchives.com/
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Darksideof-Collages/
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pero
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 11 2005
Location: Croatia
Status: Offline
Points: 1242
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 06:02 |
darksideof wrote:
I also want to say that if a band feel the presure to play the hits because the fans won't come if they don't. If that's true, then where is true genuine loving true fans that apreciate their art form. Musicians should have the freedom and greatful desire to please themselves because by doing that his fans will also respect , admire even more their talent. I am a grafic designer /Ilustrator and even thougth I do have to please my clients to a limit I also have the choice and freedom to express my design and drawing in my own unique way. regasdless if they like or not. if they don't them tuff. however If they like my style they wouldn't hire in the first place. I am the one who make the chioces and musicians should allow to do the same. That's sucks if that is true.!!!!!! |
Well said.
But on the other hand some bands stick to Zappa's "We are here only for the money".
They maybe have bigger audience but in the end leave band and carrier dissapointed.
Fripp and Zappa are unique, and you could never be bored on their concerts.
Reading Hendrix biography on the other hand, he was very dissapointed because his audience (and manager) always asked him to play Hey Joe, Purple haze, Vodoo chile,... and he wanted to finish with this period and go further, but didn't manage.
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valravennz
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Joined: March 20 2005
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 2546
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 06:28 |
I would give several parts of my body to be able to see groups like Yes and King Crimson live, though I doubt we will ever see them here in NZ. I don't mind what they play, however it is always exciting when new material or material that is not well known is put into the play set. Most bands these days play their well known material and if they are on the verge of releasing a new album, will include one or two "teasers" from the new album to keep the fans happy and ready to rush out and buy the new release. A good example of this was Porcupine Tree's latest tour when they included material from FOABP.I have also been to a Jethro Tull concert where tracks from their then upcoming album, "War Child" were included in the set and U2 including tracks from "The Unforgetable Fire" which was also at that stage not released.
It is generally agreed that when fans go to concerts the expectation is to hear the hits or well known pieces. Not everyone is going to like hearing the well played hits, however a well planned concert set usually satisfies the concert goer one way or another.
Edited by valravennz - May 17 2007 at 06:30
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"Music is the Wine that fills the cup of Silence"
- Robert Fripp
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heavyhery
Forum Groupie
Joined: April 05 2006
Location: Puerto Rico
Status: Offline
Points: 71
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 06:30 |
hell not thats the songs i want to hear live.What i hate is when they play the songs on their newer cds
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heavyhery
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valravennz
Forum Senior Member
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Joined: March 20 2005
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 2546
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 06:32 |
^ I guess you can't satisfy everyone. As the saying goes "horses for courses"...
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"Music is the Wine that fills the cup of Silence"
- Robert Fripp
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 07:05 |
This problem will always arise once a band's back-catalogue is longer than their set list, so it will always be impossible to please all the people all the time. The reception of new material live seems to be inversely proportional to the size of the audience/fan-base, but having said that, I think most bands get the balance right.
Any reticence on behalf of the band to air new material is probably because they don't know how their "new baby" will be received, and they really don't climb up on stage to deliberately dissapoint people.
Personally I want to hear new stuff, but I want to hear some of my all time favorite songs aswell. Any band who only plays from their greatest hits is in danger of becoming their own tribute band.
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What?
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seamus
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 01 2007
Location: Italy
Status: Offline
Points: 300
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 07:44 |
Talkin' about PINK FLOYD i want say that LEARNING TO FLY is a very good song specially in the live performance; on the live album PULSE i think that song was awesome (and the light show too).
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A B Negative
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 02 2006
Location: Methil Republic
Status: Offline
Points: 1594
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 09:22 |
When I see an established band play live, I want a good balance of old and new material. Unfortunately, many people only want the "greatest hits".
Anyway, how often do you get to see the great prog bands play live? I'd be happy to see (for example) Yes playing Roundabout as part of their live show once every year or two.
They usually put the track list on live CDs and DVDs, so I know before I buy if they are similar to ones I already have.
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"The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar.... Now, that's my idea of a good time."
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Prog.Sylvie
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 12 2006
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 449
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 09:45 |
Jethro Tull will come in November at La Place Des Arts in Montreal ( something like 3 thousands people), and the tickets are from 50.00$ to 70.00 $ CDN. This is quite good, and this venue is excellent for this kind of show.
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C'est la vie
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Prog.Sylvie
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 12 2006
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 449
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 09:48 |
Everytime that I saw my favorites bands or singers, I always expect that they will play some of their greatest hits. I am never tired of Roundabout, DSOTM, or Aqualung. Those are classics. Beside those, it's quite ok for the band to play different things and their new songs too.
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C'est la vie
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mystic fred
Special Collaborator
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Joined: March 13 2006
Location: Londinium
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Points: 4252
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 12:11 |
Live Gigs have certainly changed over the years, i remember when everybody loved those extended guitar solos and drum breaks, designed within a 2 1/2 hour set to give members the chance to grab a cup of tea, a Jack Daniels, or maybe a puff!
Many concertgoers these days are new fans and may have never seen a particular "old" band performing before, and may be disappointed not to hear their "famous hits" as it were - have a look at my "Beginner's guide to Deep Purple " review which illustrates this point rather well if i may say so.. 
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 Prog Archives Tour Van
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Garion81
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: May 22 2004
Location: So Cal, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 4338
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 13:10 |
Atavachron wrote:
ClassicRocker wrote:
Nowadays many bands still tour, yet the prices can be outrageous (I don't have $200 to see Tull!) |
where are you having to pay that amount to see Tull? They're one of the most frequently touring classic prog bands, and tickets don't usually run higher than 40 or 50 dollars in the U.S... even scalpers wouldn't try charging $200 for Tull.
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I paid $65 a piece for Tull in October in Thousand Oaks, Ca. After Ticketmaster applied a $24 venue fee and $3 handling Fee and $2.50 delivery fee I almost paid $100 per ticket. 
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"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?"
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1800iareyay
Prog Reviewer
Joined: November 18 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2492
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 13:20 |
sometimes a band needs to stick to the hits, but I for one love it when the new material is brought out. On Rush in Rio, all of the Vapor Trails material breaks free from the studio "production" (if you could even call it that) and can be much better appreciated. It's so boring when my parents go to some old 70s band that hasn't released an album of new material in 15 years on the nostalgia circuit just to hear three or four songs.
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Garion81
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: May 22 2004
Location: So Cal, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 4338
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 13:20 |
darksideof wrote:
I also want to say that if a band feel the presure to play the hits because the fans won't come if they don't. If that's true, then where is true genuine loving true fans that apreciate their art form. Musicians should have the freedom and greatful desire to please themselves because by doing that his fans will also respect , admire even more their talent. I am a grafic designer /Ilustrator and even thougth I do have to please my clients to a limit I also have the choice and freedom to express my design and drawing in my own unique way. regasdless if they like or not. if they don't them tuff. however If they like my style they wouldn't hire in the first place. I am the one who make the chioces and musicians should allow to do the same. That's sucks if that is true.!!!!!! |
In your analogy you forgot one important point. While you have the right to create what you want your client has the right not buy it and if enough people stop buying you have to find something else to do to make money. The same for these bands. Sure they pick what they choose to play but if people don't like it they won't come back.
Do you assume the majority of crowds who see 70's prog bands are like us or post on sites like this? Far from it! We are in such a small minority it isn't even funny. The only places you will find such crowds is Festivals or concerts of bands such as The Flower Kings, Spock's Beard and Porcupine Tree. (That is the only place where new music isn't only accepted it is expected!)
Many people when hearing a band is going to play a new song of a 70-'s legend (and this is not just limited to prog) choose that time to go the snack bar or take a piss break. I have seen it time and time again. They only know the band by their hits and they endure the rest to hear the hits. I blame it on classic rock radio conditioning. So while you are maybe well versed in Yes's catalog there are people who only know Roundabout, All Good People and Owner of a Lonely Heart and I would guess that a large majority of the audience is made up of them.
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"What are you going to do when that damn thing rusts?"
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NutterAlert
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 07 2005
Location: In transition
Status: Offline
Points: 2808
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 13:27 |
Depends who it is really.
I saw all 3 ELP shows at Royal Albert Hall in 92, and each show was identical, same set list, each song played identically each night, same between song banter. I understand their music is complex to play, but these shows were identical down to the minutest detail. Although I was pleased to have finally seen ELP live by the 3rd gig I felt a bit cheated.
I went to see VdGG 5 times this year on tour. Each setlist was different; they had a core set of tracks, but they varied what was played and how they played it. With VdGG it is a fine line between a tune being a disasterous car crash or a tear-jerking epic, they play right on the edge, and audiences sense this and react to it. Each show was different and unique. Quite unforgettable.
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Proud to be an un-banned member since 2005
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Prog.Sylvie
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 12 2006
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 449
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Posted: May 17 2007 at 14:59 |
Three weeks ago, I saw Al Stewart in a small venue. Very nice show. Al told us, that every night, it's a different show, because he has something like 175 songs that he can play for us. Of course, he does not forget "Year of The Cat" or " Road to Moscow", but he likes to change from show to another.
About ELP: why seeing them three nights in a row ? I saw them in january 1993 in a small venue. It was a good show, but I did not feel to see them again the next day, even if I was a fan. ( and I am still a fan...).
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C'est la vie
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