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Horizons
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: January 20 2011
Location: Somewhere Else
Status: Offline
Points: 16952
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Posted: July 30 2014 at 22:42 |
King Crimson776 wrote:
Horizons wrote:
Crossover is pop+prog
Neo is 70's prog
I don't see your argument. |
You evidently don't see much of anything.
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When i look at Neo-prog, you bet.
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Crushed like a rose in the riverflow.
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Mirror Image
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 13 2011
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2111
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Posted: July 30 2014 at 22:46 |
Horizons wrote:
King Crimson776 wrote:
Horizons wrote:
Crossover is pop+prog
Neo is 70's prog
I don't see your argument. |
You evidently don't see much of anything.
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When i look at Neo-prog, you bet. |
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“Music is enough for a lifetime but a lifetime is not enough for music.” - Sergei Rachmaninov
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King Crimson776
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 12 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2779
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Posted: July 30 2014 at 23:03 |
Horizons wrote:
When i look at Neo-prog, you bet. |
Are
you using neo-prog to mean post-70's symphonic, or specifically
(correctly) the cleaner, more pop-oriented sound of Marillion, Pendragon
etc.? It's not the most staggeringly original style around, of course,
but the distinction is totally obvious. Also, here, I'll make it clear what I mean about crossover. In your "prog + pop", both the prog and pop are vague. Genres (especially subgenres) need to have a generally unified sound.
Edited by King Crimson776 - July 30 2014 at 23:13
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Wanorak
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 09 2006
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 4574
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Posted: July 30 2014 at 23:04 |
Forgotten Sons; probably my fave early Marillion track.
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A GREAT YEAR FOR PROG!!!
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Luna
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 28 2010
Location: Funky Town
Status: Offline
Points: 12794
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Posted: July 30 2014 at 23:46 |
King Crimson776 wrote:
Horizons wrote:
When i look at Neo-prog, you bet. |
Are
you using neo-prog to mean post-70's symphonic, or specifically
(correctly) the cleaner, more pop-oriented sound of Marillion, Pendragon
etc.? It's not the most staggeringly original style around, of course,
but the distinction is totally obvious.
Also, here, I'll make it clear what I mean about crossover. In your "prog + pop", both the prog and pop are vague. Genres (especially subgenres) need to have a generally unified sound.
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King Crimson776
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 12 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2779
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 00:06 |
^ Vague, like I said.
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Luna
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 28 2010
Location: Funky Town
Status: Offline
Points: 12794
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 00:07 |
Say anything you want, facts are facts
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King Crimson776
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 12 2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2779
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 00:10 |
I'm all about facts, such as "prog + pop is a vague description".
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Tom Ozric
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
Status: Offline
Points: 15916
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 01:21 |
Forgotten Sons = excellent
The Sky Moves Sideways = Brilliant (even if it's a bit derivative)
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Formentera Lady
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 20 2010
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 1795
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 02:37 |
Forgotten Sons (also because of the lyrcs, and how the lyrics and the music fit together)
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LSDisease
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 29 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 494
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 03:49 |
King Crimson776 wrote:
LSDisease wrote:
Still 8 deranged jackasses voted for PT. This place is becoming too weird.
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I'd get it if we were talking about Kayo Dot or some sh*t, but PT is totally prog, and has been one the most popular bands in the style for years now. I like Marillion but they are too pop to be a first tier band (lyrically one of the best though).
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It's not that level man. It's like choosing Citroen over Ferrari. I really don't get it. Porcupine Tree is some C-level prog band that not recorded an album until 1991and it's treated better than Marillion. Probably very young people voted in this poll.
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"Du gehst zu Frauen? Vergiss die Peitsche nicht!"
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LSDisease
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 29 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 494
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 03:52 |
Horizons wrote:
Marillion is awful and just a copy of a band they wish they were 10 years prior. Their music is boring and uninspired. |
if that statement comes from a math rock / post rock fan it's ok. I don't expect someone who worships math rock to understand Marillion's music.
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"Du gehst zu Frauen? Vergiss die Peitsche nicht!"
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer
Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 16130
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 04:09 |
I vote Forgotten Sons.
Sorry, I like PT but I find TSMS boring.
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
Status: Offline
Points: 23104
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 04:49 |
LSDisease wrote:
King Crimson776 wrote:
LSDisease wrote:
Still 8 deranged jackasses voted for PT. This place is becoming too weird.
| I'd get it if we were talking about Kayo Dot or some sh*t, but PT is totally prog, and has been one the most popular bands in the style for years now. I like Marillion but they are too pop to be a first tier band (lyrically one of the best though). | It's not that level man. It's like choosing Citroen over Ferrari. I really don't get it. Porcupine Tree is some C-level prog band that not recorded an album until 1991and it's treated better than Marillion. Probably very young people voted in this poll. |
In your opinion of course
PA is all about diversity. If you can't handle that, then this is probably not the place for you.
I love both but will give the edge to PT.
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams
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LSDisease
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 29 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 494
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 05:02 |
^it's not an opinion, it's a fact;) PT is overrated.
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"Du gehst zu Frauen? Vergiss die Peitsche nicht!"
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
Status: Offline
Points: 23104
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 05:09 |
Ahh you see, we could've used something vaguely tongue-in-cheek earlier, instead of all this bickering.
When people first get to know each other on here, it is far easier to tell when they are pulling legs. I'm not sure anybody got that from your previous posts.
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams
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sleeper
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 09 2005
Location: Entropia
Status: Offline
Points: 16449
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 05:49 |
^I don't think he is, I haven't seen a post from LSDisease where he hasn't been an arrogant jackass who believes everybody elses opinion is worthless.
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Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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genbanks
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 08 2010
Location: Argentina
Status: Offline
Points: 956
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 06:18 |
King Crimson776 wrote:
I thought it was self-evident but basically, neo is not as complex as symphonic or other prog subgenres. It has more standard song forms, and is therefore closer to pop music. It's about as complex as prog metal I guess (prog metal is just 'busy', not actually complex).
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Still a subjective opinion...read this
"While the Neo-Progressive genre initially consisted of artists exploring a modernized version of Symphonic Prog, these days artists coined as Neo-Progressive cover a multitude of musical expressions, where the common denominator is the inclusion - within a progressive rock framework - of musical elements developed just prior to and after 1980. The Neo-Progressive genre in it's refined form thus covers a vast musical territory, to some extent covering all existing subsets of progressive rock and also searching out towards genres as different as new age on one side and punk and metal on the other."
Source P.A.
In the case of this poll the songs that are compared here, IMO Forgotten Sons has a musical structure unless with the same level of complexity than Sky moves sideways. And to say that Forgotten sons it is not too poppy is something like to say Beethoven it is not too jazzy, I mean it is some nonosense statement.
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genbanks
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 08 2010
Location: Argentina
Status: Offline
Points: 956
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 06:22 |
And tired of this silly debate now I will vote...I love both songs, both too are really amazing, and as I said before to choose one of them seems too difficult. Yesterday a I was looking my Recital of the script DVD and the peformance of Forgotten Sons is just incredible powerful, an early Marillion trademark. For now the symphonic approach of this song makes me vote for it.
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
Status: Offline
Points: 23104
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Posted: July 31 2014 at 06:23 |
sleeper wrote:
^I don't think he is, I haven't seen a post from LSDisease where he hasn't been an arrogant jackass who believes everybody elses opinion is worthless.
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I know. I was merely trying the friendly way.
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams
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