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Chicago vs Steely Dan
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Poll Question: Which band do you prefer?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
26 [37.14%]
41 [58.57%]
0 [0.00%]
3 [4.29%]
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AFlowerKingCrimson View Drop Down
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Points: 19258 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2019 at 09:34
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:


As great as Chicago's early albums were... nothing was new there... SD was unique then..and still is today which is quite the accomplishment...  compliment.

I don't agree. Those first two or three Chicago records were very progressive plus they were an american band. Not many(if any)US bands were doing what they were doing  with suites and what not. Plus the first two were both recorded before the release of King Crimson's first. I'm not saying Chicago were the first prog band but they were clearly doing stuff few others were. Steely Dan were playing jazz rock in a more poppy format but I don't think we can say they were doing stuff that was never done before where as early Chicago was at least closer to that if anyone was. 


Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - February 01 2019 at 09:35
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Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

... running around smoking a a steely dan pipe was very cool with the boys and girls at both high schools (to the upset chagrin of many teachers, btw!) and college folks, in those days....


I hope those pipes did not resemble the Steely Dans in Burroughs' Naked Lunch. I could understand how distressing it would be to the teachers seeing the students running around smoking dildos (the Steely Dan III was steam powered, but a smoke powered one could be a later model)..
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Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:

Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Steely Dan, was just another pop band, with much better music than most radio hits, but all in all, it was just pop music!
I'm so happy that this is completely irrelevant to me. The open minded music lover moshkito who is once again so sad on our behalf is actually the one who is close minded - not the other way around.

It's a shame that you only profess your personal dislike for someone, and not discuss the music of the bands. I did so, and explained why I felt so
You're tastes and preferences is none of my business but you're general judging tone towards others you don't know just rubs me the wrong way. Its among my least favorite "qualities".
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Originally posted by Jeffro Jeffro wrote:

Chicago became VERY pop in the 80s. To say that "pop" does not fit Chicago ignores a chunk of their discography and is quite frankly, laughable. 
Let's also not forget that Chicago even made a foray into disco. 
Chicago 16 is possibly my favourite Pop album, and the song Street Player, the only disco song I can tolerate. I can barely tolerate any SD song.
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Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:

Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Steely Dan, was just another pop band, with much better music than most radio hits, but all in all, it was just pop music!
I'm so happy that this is completely irrelevant to me. The open minded music lover moshkito who is once again so sad on our behalf is actually the one who is close minded - not the other way around.

It's a shame that you only profess your personal dislike for someone, and not discuss the music of the bands. I did so, and explained why I felt so ... by 1978 when I was at UCSB, CHICAGO was no longer an "important" band, although no one would argue with its level and fame ... and STEELY DAN was hip and funny and had kinda neat music, although to consider it musically great, I would rather refer to things like GENTLE GIANT and several other European bands.

STEELY DAN, was, almost exclusively a radio band, and it was well loved in the LA scene, because running around smoking a a steely dan pipe was very cool with the boys and girls at both high schools (to the upset chagrin of many teachers, btw!) and college folks, in those days ... and at the very least, CHICAGO did not quite come down to that level of idiocy for publicity's sake.

BTW, of course the comments are irrelevant to you ... you weren't around at that time, and knew what it was like to get your head bashed in Chicago in 1968 because a band did not show up, and how much CTA 1 ad 2 were important at that time, and find a couple of known friends gunned down for nothing.

Liking STEELY PAN is fine, but saying that it is more "important" or "valuable" than CHICAGO is a sad comment on the state of advertising and fame ... somehow the image of coolies going around smoking a cheap Steely Dan pipe, is not my image of great music whatsoever ... but you love the fashion behind it all, I bet!


Edited by moshkito - February 01 2019 at 06:42
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Jeffro View Drop Down
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Chicago became VERY pop in the 80s. To say that "pop" does not fit Chicago ignores a chunk of their discography and is quite frankly, laughable. 
Let's also not forget that Chicago even made a foray into disco. 
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Saperlipopette! View Drop Down
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Points: 12814 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saperlipopette! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 01 2019 at 04:55
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Steely Dan, was just another pop band, with much better music than most radio hits, but all in all, it was just pop music!
I'm so happy that this is completely irrelevant to me. The open minded music lover moshkito who is once again so sad on our behalf is actually the one who is close minded - not the other way around.
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Hi,

CHICAGO for me. STEELY DAN was more about what the whole scene became, the hip this and that, than it was musically important and artistically valuable.

CHICAGO was there when I got my head bashed ... STEELY DAN was there later when I was at the university and its main role was for the stuff to be played while people got stoned and some girls got off on smoking a pipe shaped like a pen__ that had the words Steely Dan on it ... in case you don't know, you really should go find about its literary significance. It was a dildoe!

CHICAGO, had great music, and some improvisations, all the way to the 6th and 7th albums with longer cuts, and it is a shame that it is not considered "progressive" by our contingent here in PA, because all of its merits, from musicality to lyrical material, would all fit the definitions just fine, except that we wanted more solo's and CHICAGO could not invent any more solos as large a band as it was!

Sad to see the popularity of the poll choices ... but CHICAGO fits as one of the originals in the movement in music in the late 60's, and Steely Dan, was just another pop band, with much better music than most radio hits, but all in all, it was just pop music! CHICAGO does not fit that word'age, even though they had a few hits here and there ... hits that said something!
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AFlowerKingCrimson View Drop Down
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Points: 19258 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 31 2019 at 18:46
Originally posted by irrelevant irrelevant wrote:

Gotta be a bit of a rare sighting here. The considerably proggier band doing far worse than the other band in the poll. 

Same thing in the APP vs Steely Dan poll where Steely Dan is also doing way better. 
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micky View Drop Down
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Points: 46843 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote micky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2019 at 17:54
Originally posted by irrelevant irrelevant wrote:

Gotta be a bit of a rare sighting here. The considerably proggier band doing far worse than the other band in the poll. 

aye,,, but don't discount how things have changed man.  The condiderable more PROGRESSIVE band is running away with this.  

this .. and the community as it exists today is not what it once was circa 2006. It has fragmented... those that appreciate the same old same old regurgitation of what other had done, and often done better, or those blazing their own sounds and styles.

I was quite shocked by two sepeate but linked occurances when I added SD to the site. One the poisonous attacks by the traditionalists.. which thankfully occured in the collab zone as the one true maxim of PA's is if you pull a knife on the Big Mick..he pulls out out a shotgun.

but the other was the score of PM's I got thanking me for having the forward thinking to add them to the site.

are they prog.. hell no.. they aint' English and they didn't do boring side longs with hyper intellectual bullsh*te... but other than perhaps one other mainstream artist..  I don't consider any other to be more 'progressive'. They did their thing.. and only sold albums out of shear quality.... not painting music by the numbers which unfortunately past 1972 is where much of 'prog' went to. Prog.. but as progressive as my left toe.

As great as Chicago's early albums were... nothing was new there... SD was unique then..and still is today which is quite the accomplishment...  compliment.
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Points: 235 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote axeman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2019 at 16:56
Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Duh!   The band was castrated when Terry shot himself in the head.  Without Terry's ballsy combo of soulful vocals and raw guitar, Chicago went full on wimp.Wink
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And im not low-crediting Lee Loughnane nor Seraphine (spelling) but Pankow and Parazeider strikes me as more driving forces.

Though Robert is the central core. Though diminshed by the presance of David Foster.
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^ Agreed. They had a few good albeit poppy moments later on(and the stone of sisyphus album is supposed to be pretty good) but the few immediately following Kath's death in particular are supposed to be pretty bad. 

Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - January 30 2019 at 15:50
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Walter Parazeider, James Pankow and Robert Lamm is the heart and soul of Chicago, Terry Kath was their nervessystem. I also like Ceteras bass and singingvoice.
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Chicago with Terry Kath.   He gave Chicago a pair.   I never listened to Chicago after the Kath castration. 

He wasn't castrated. He shot himself in the head. :(
 

Duh!   The band was castrated when Terry shot himself in the head.  Without Terry's ballsy combo of soulful vocals and raw guitar, Chicago went full on wimp.Wink
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AFlowerKingCrimson View Drop Down
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Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Chicago with Terry Kath.   He gave Chicago a pair.   I never listened to Chicago after the Kath castration. 

He wasn't castrated. He shot himself in the head. :(
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Chicago with Terry Kath.   He gave Chicago a pair.   I never listened to Chicago after the Kath castration. 
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Chicago based solely on the strength of Chicago II.
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Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

Originally posted by kenethlevine kenethlevine wrote:

I prefer Chicago on the strength of some early material, but I'm definitely not a fan.  Steely - forget it

So which one did you vote for?

Sorry!  I hadn't even voted.  I ended up voting Chicago though could have also voted neither.  But just the song "Wishing you were here" puts Chicago above Steely for me, and they had a few other good ones
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