The President Was Shot... |
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 64700 |
Posted: November 24 2013 at 18:28 | ||
I was watching The McLaughlin Group (no not the musician) this
weekend ~ not exactly a bastion of liberal yahoos ~ and John himself,
Mr. Grumpy, does not believe the Single Bullet Theory.
Presumably in turn this means he does not believe LHO acted alone.
This is a subtle but new shift in popular conservative thinking.
Shows what fifty years of research into an open case can
accomplish.
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 64700 |
Posted: November 24 2013 at 18:14 | ||
It was indeed bold, especially at the time, for the Subcommittee on Assassinations to conclude there probably was a second gunman "that missed the President", as they put it; meaning there was a fourth shot but it didn't hit JFK. This was a sly way of satisfying the growing consensus of conspiracy and at the same time preventing further inquiry. As scientific as it was, the Dictabelt recording they used was doomed from the moment the scratchy and unlistenable tape was played. The only people who could show any audible gunshots, let alone four, were those with highly sensitive sound equipment and a lot of experience. As I mentioned earlier, what we need is a real recording from that day with normal sound levels. |
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Dean
Special Collaborator Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: November 24 2013 at 18:09 | ||
No one was lying, the 1979 subcommittee were simply interpreting the evidence incorrectly. |
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What?
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: November 24 2013 at 14:13 | ||
It depends which expert you ask. Same with anything really. Some politician in the UK (can't remember who) once said - semi jokingly - when government consults experts on matters of policy, it's important to make sure you choose the experts that agree with the policy before putting anything to the vote. The BBC aired a documentary on the 40th anniversary of JFK's death and "proved" that Oswald could have done it. |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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The.Crimson.King
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 29 2013 Location: WA Status: Offline Points: 4591 |
Posted: November 24 2013 at 12:33 | ||
If there were only 3 shots, why did the Senate Subcommittee on Assassinations in 1979 state that at least 4 shots occurred after examining an audio recording made by a policeman at the event? If anyone was invested in upholding the Warren report and the party line it would have been the 1979 Subcommittee. Was the 1979 subcommittee lying, or was the Warren commission lying?
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 64700 |
Posted: November 23 2013 at 19:34 | ||
Excellent point, and one conspiracy promoters must grapple with. These reporters, all top in their field, can't all have been mistaken or lying. What we need is a clear sound recording matched with the Z film so we could have a better sense of what actually happened. Clint Hill also flatly says three shots. Hill was the only SS agent who reacted. He's the one seen running up to the rear of the limo to help Jackie. |
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 64700 |
Posted: November 23 2013 at 19:27 | ||
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Finnforest
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 03 2007 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 16913 |
Posted: November 23 2013 at 18:53 | ||
point taken |
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Padraic
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 16 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 31169 |
Posted: November 23 2013 at 18:48 | ||
Rebuttal (from a blog): 10.) The majority of Dealey Plaza witnesses said shots came from behind the President, in the direction of the School Book Depository Building. In addition, an even larger percentage of witnesses said they heard EXACTLY three shots fired. No more, no less. And three spent shells (co-incidentally?) were found in the Sniper's Nest. I also find it extremely interesting (and quite telling) that virtually EVERY SINGLE ONE (if not 100%) of the newsmen and reporters riding in the motorcade in Dealey Plaza, who were in a position to immediately report the shooting to the world via media outlets (radio, television, and newswire services), heard EXACTLY THREE SHOTS FIRED. Precisely the number that the "plotters" NEED to have Oswald firing in the Depository. This would include Merriman Smith, Jack Bell, Pierce Allman, Jay Watson, and Jerry Haynes (among still others who reported "3 Shots" to a TV and radio audience before 1:00 PM on November 22nd). Do conspiracy theorists think that all of these various reporters and newsmen were just being nice to the evil plotters by cooperating with their "Three-Shots-Needed" plot/plan? An odd "coincidence" if there had really been 4 to 10 shots fired in Dealey Plaza that Friday. Don't conspiracists think ANY of the reporters just might have heard a DIFFERENT number (other than "3") if the plot involved so many more shots? |
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The.Crimson.King
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 29 2013 Location: WA Status: Offline Points: 4591 |
Posted: November 23 2013 at 18:40 | ||
Perhaps that's exactly what happened...the real hitmen vanished and all that was left was a dope holding a rifle
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Finnforest
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 03 2007 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 16913 |
Posted: November 23 2013 at 18:35 | ||
Yep, not to mention the target was moving. It is hard to believe he could have done *that* well. But what I keep coming back to is....if some powerful dark entity or foreign power were behind this, and wanted to kill him without the trail leading back to them, would they choose to involve an unstable, unreliable misfit with an operation of such magnitude and delicate details? I mean look at Hoffa. The Mob were not always perfect, but they made Hoffa disappear into thin air from a restaurant! Wouldn't more powerful entities want an operation to be even cleaner....with hitmen who just vanished....as opposed to taking a chance on involving a dope. |
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The.Crimson.King
Forum Senior Member Joined: March 29 2013 Location: WA Status: Offline Points: 4591 |
Posted: November 23 2013 at 16:13 | ||
If it weren't for the unexpected occurrence of Abraham Zapruder filming the parade, believing Oswald acted alone would seem plausible (though directly refuted by the testimony of 51 people on the scene who reported shots coming from the grassy knoll). However, the timing of shots established by the Zapruder film make it physically impossible for Oswald to have fired 3 bullets in 6 seconds with that specific rifle (which was known to gun dealers as one of the least accurate rifles ever made in addition to the fact that Oswalds rifle had a defective scope). FBI experts couldn't duplicate this shooting performance with that rifle and Oswald's marine record grades him as a mediocre marksman at best. Add to that the laughable "magic bullet theory" which attempts to explain the near perfect condition of the specific bullet that supposedly caused multiple wounds including shattering Gov Connelly's wrist and there's no way the physical facts support that only 3 shots were fired and that Oswald did the shooting alone. Even the US federal government in 1979 re-examined the facts (The House Select Committee on Assassinations) which included acoustical evidence recorded by a policeman at the scene and concluded there were at least 4 shots and a "probable conspiracy". Who was ultimately responsible? 50+ years later, I doubt we'll ever know, but claiming Oswald was a lone assassin is about as believable to me as claiming space aliens shot JFK.
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dr wu23
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 22 2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 20545 |
Posted: November 23 2013 at 14:35 | ||
Yes, that is interesting and when he was questioned briefly by a press member when they were moving him a short while before Ruby shot him he answered, "No sir I didn't kill anyone."
Some years after that some one did a voice stress analysis when the tech came into being and the results indicated he was telling the truth based on the way those things work.....but then I have no idea how accurate those things are or if Oswald's mental state could pass such a test.
I also recall some expert shooters testing his ability to fire 3 shots accurately in the time needed and they set up the same basic conditions and it was damn near impossible to do it and Oswald was no expert and had a lousy rifle.
It makes one wonder at least.
Edited by dr wu23 - November 23 2013 at 14:37 |
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin |
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manofmystery
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 26 2008 Location: PA, USA Status: Offline Points: 4335 |
Posted: November 23 2013 at 13:39 | ||
It's is important to note that there is some rather intriguing evidence out there that suggests JFK lived on well past Nov. 22, 1963 as a black man and that he didn't pass away until 2002 after helping Elvis Presley defeat a re-animated Egyptian mummy at their east Texas nursing home.
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Time always wins. |
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member Joined: May 27 2005 Location: NE Indiana Status: Offline Points: 28057 |
Posted: November 22 2013 at 22:13 | ||
In the end, any new information would mean very little. Conspiracy theorists will never be satisfied with the offical account of events.
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 64700 |
Posted: November 22 2013 at 21:15 | ||
It is both interesting and unusual that Oswald took no credit or pride in the crime. Most political assassins want everyone to know they did it, and why.
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The T
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 16 2006 Location: FL, USA Status: Offline Points: 17493 |
Posted: November 22 2013 at 17:06 | ||
Lee Harvey Oswald, the ultimate loser.
Now, I would like if a conspiracy was true. But I don't really believe it. |
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dr wu23
Forum Senior Member Joined: August 22 2010 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 20545 |
Posted: November 22 2013 at 17:00 | ||
Who do you think killed JFK?
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One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin |
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The T
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 16 2006 Location: FL, USA Status: Offline Points: 17493 |
Posted: November 22 2013 at 11:14 | ||
By the way, and even though I like JFK (posthumously of course, I didn't even exist back in 1960-3), the CIA and everyone around him planned and tried to execute the murder of another president, Fidel Castro. So it might have been karma-kanic to use prog terms that JFK himself was murdered.
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Atavachron
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: September 30 2006 Location: Pearland Status: Offline Points: 64700 |
Posted: November 21 2013 at 18:37 | ||
^ It's an old theory first presented in a book called Mortal Error. There
is almost no real evidence for it other than a few photos of the agent
in the car behind JFK's with his machine gun drawn after shots were
fired. A couple witnesses said they saw the two SS
men in the President's car holding handguns, but no one has ever
confirmed that.
As for the origin of the Magic Bullet Theory, it was first proposed by Arlen Specter, then a Washington lawyer, who, after talking to gun experts, decided it was both possible and probable a bullet passed through both men. And in fact, it is. But it doesn't tell us anything about who shot the gun(s) and/or who planned the crime, and it became a huge distraction from more important evidence. |
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