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Divisive Prog Albums
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siLLy puPPy View Drop Down
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Points: 15490 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote siLLy puPPy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 08 2023 at 17:34
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by siLLy puPPy siLLy puPPy wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:

From Chris H review of the incredible Tago Mago by Can (Krautrock is in general more popular anyywhere else but here)
the track "Bring Me Coffee or Tea" off of somewhere, I can't remember at the moment, but
I actually rather liked it. So one day I was poking around some bargain bins, and lo and
behold here it was. I bought it for $2.50, and popped it in the stereo. It couldn't have
been 10 minutes before my mother comes up and says "What is this crap?". I couldn't
agree more Mom! This has to take the cake for the most pointless album ever made. Ever. "Peking O"
and "Mushroom" are two of the stupidest, pointless songs I have ever heard...



that's a review?! Stern Smile And here i thought I was bad at it. (ffs Censored LOL)


That's not a review, it's a pointless rant. Another person who doesn't get it and has a hissy fit about an album beyond his / her comprehension.


well, it is a review it seems. I think some people just forget it's not just what you say (that matters), it's how you say it it's just as important. 


No it’s not a review. It conveys absolutely nothing about the album just the listeners inability to process it

if it's not a review, report it, tell the admins to get rid of it. LOL
You can argue it's a poorly written, useless review and I'd agree. Smile


I honestly don't care enough to waste my time. Pisspoor reviews only reflect the integrity of the person posting them.

https://rateyourmusic.com/~siLLy_puPPy
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siLLy puPPy View Drop Down
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Points: 15490 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote siLLy puPPy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 08 2023 at 17:33
Originally posted by Negoba Negoba wrote:

I also dislike Tago Mago. Are you assuming I can't understand or process it?

Ash Ra Tempel's debut is one of my favorite all time albums, BTW.


Yes. That's exactly what i'm presuming. I didn't like it either at first until i invested a great deal of time in unlocking its secrets.

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Lewian View Drop Down
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Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Originally posted by Lewian Lewian wrote:

Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

1. likes% circa equal to dislikes%

That's a pretty tough one. It'll rule out most albums we have talked about.

Just something to think about, and you have surely more experience to make a more realistic definition, which might be interesting to see. Smile


Well, I'm fine with the one I already have.
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David_D View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Lewian Lewian wrote:

Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

1. likes% circa equal to dislikes%

That's a pretty tough one. It'll rule out most albums we have talked about.

Just something to think about, and you have surely more experience to make a more realistic definition, which might be interesting to see. Smile
                      quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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Lewian View Drop Down
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Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

1. likes% circa equal to dislikes%

That's a pretty tough one. It'll rule out most albums we have talked about.
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David_D View Drop Down
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If to be quite serious about this "divisive" stuff, I'd say:

4-5 stars  -  "likes"
1-2 stars  -  "dislikes"

an album is "divisive" when ratings are:

1. likes% circa equal to dislikes% 
2. likes + dislikes = at least 60% of all ratings
3. minimum 300 persons have rated

But that might be too serious. Big smile
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Lewian View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Nogbad_The_Bad Nogbad_The_Bad wrote:

Using Lewian's formula (that I like)

Steve Wilson - The Future Bites - 10:40 - not divisive, not enough 5 stars
Yes - 90215 - 13:25 - not divisive, not enough 5 stars
Genesis - Abacab - 6:36 - not divisive just disliked broadly.

Yeah, subjective perception of "divisive" can be different from the numbers. I suspect people who give Topographic Oceans 3 stars think they're rather disappointed and negative given how good Yes were otherwise roughly at that time, whereas those who give Abacab 3 stars (even maybe the same people) think they're rather positive as they kind of like the album and rate it better than what they hear from others. Numbers are good at showing such things. Of course if there is a huge number of ratings as for the Yes albums, even small percentages amount to a fairly large number of people.
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Originally posted by Lewian Lewian wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Does Steven Wilson's "The Future Bites" qualify as "divisive album" under the criteria outlined in your math formula?

I say it is divisive ,based on what I've seen here on PA and a couple other sites I've visited. People either praise it or totally dislike it. 

On PA I haven't seen much enthusiasm. Some like it but I don't think very passionately. Maybe it finds more love elsewhere.

You're right
Check out the rating summary on metalstorm



Edited by Cristi - May 08 2023 at 15:29
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Lewian View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Does Steven Wilson's "The Future Bites" qualify as "divisive album" under the criteria outlined in your math formula?

I say it is divisive ,based on what I've seen here on PA and a couple other sites I've visited. People either praise it or totally dislike it. 

On PA I haven't seen much enthusiasm. Some like it but I don't think very passionately. Maybe it finds more love elsewhere.
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Lewian View Drop Down
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Of course my definition of "divisive" is just made up and you can have another one. Particularly I didn't specify a minimum number of ratings overall but I should, for being thorough (maybe 100 or 200). I have my reasons though; I say at least 20% 5 stars as there need to be enough people to defend an album passionately for being "divisive". Also higher ratings are generally preferred, therefore 20% isn't really that much. Almost everybody gives 4 stars to almost everything, so the number of 4 star ratings doesn't really indicate a polarising album, but as I said, you may disagree. Alternatively you can think of an album that has a very few really passionate fans and is not appreciated by many as "divisive" though (I'd defend Beat, ALT, and Ummagumma for sure). I found it interesting how few people actually rate albums such as Topographic Oceans, Passion Play, or even Tago Mago low, given that we have in mind that there are some haters (not necessarily meant in a negative way; I'd give one of these 2 stars myself Cool).
  
Anyway, Steven Wilson comes closer with To The Bone (18:16). You can check it yourself easily of course.


Edited by Lewian - May 08 2023 at 15:23
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omphaloskepsis View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Steve Wyzard Steve Wyzard wrote:

3 pages in and so far no one has mentioned two of the most divisive prog albums of all:

Yes: 90125
Genesis: Abacab

(I happen to love'em both!)

I love Big Generator more than 90125.  Is that divisive? 

When it comes to 90125 vs Abacab or Numbers vs Letter albums....I wonder which album do most people feel in the biggest Sellout?    I vote Abacab by far, since I adore 90125.Wink
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Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Originally posted by Lewian Lewian wrote:

I had a look at this from a mathematical angle. ............
...............
Allright! That is a very thorough approach. Thumbs Up
But it's of course still quite a question how exactly define "divisive".

To begin with, I would juxtapose 4-5 stars against 1-2 stars.
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David_D View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

divisive
dĭ-vī′sĭv
adjective
  1. Creating dissension or discord.

I meant an exact definition in relation to the "mathematical angle", as it's surely a matter of choice.
                      quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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David_D View Drop Down
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Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

If anybody could be curious about whether a particular album is divisive, RYM shows rating statistics for all albums.

And now I discovered that so does PA. Smile
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divisive
dĭ-vī′sĭv
adjective
  1. Creating dissension or discord.

Edited by Cristi - May 08 2023 at 13:56
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David_D View Drop Down
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Originally posted by David_D David_D wrote:

Originally posted by Lewian Lewian wrote:

I had a look at this from a mathematical angle. ............
...............
Allright! That is a very thorough approach. Thumbs Up

But it's of course still quite a question how exactly define "divisive".
                      quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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David_D View Drop Down
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Originally posted by omphaloskepsis omphaloskepsis wrote:

Does Steven Wilson's "The Future Bites" qualify as "divisive album" under the criteria outlined in your math formula?

I'd say not on RYM, as the vast majority give it 2-4 stars, but you can have a look at the statistics yourself.
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Using Lewian's formula (that I like)

Steve Wilson - The Future Bites - 10:40 - not divisive, not enough 5 stars
Yes - 90215 - 13:25 - not divisive, not enough 5 stars
Genesis - Abacab - 6:36 - not divisive just disliked broadly.
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David_D View Drop Down
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If anybody could be curious about whether a particular album is divisive, RYM shows rating statistics for all albums.
                      quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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Steve Wyzard View Drop Down
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3 pages in and so far no one has mentioned two of the most divisive prog albums of all:

Yes: 90125
Genesis: Abacab

(I happen to love'em both!)
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