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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
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Points: 28057
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Posted: December 04 2005 at 10:14 |
ANDREW wrote:
I PREFERE 70's PROGRESSIVE BY FAR.NEO-PROG IS BORING, EXCEPT FOR SOME BANDS LIKE PORCUPINE TREE, THE FLOWER KINGS, ARS NOVA, GERARD, PAR LINDH, TOCCATA, TRESPASS, GLASS HAMMER, NUOVA ERA, ROMANTIC WARRIORS, EMPIRE, AND SOME OTHERS... |
As far as I know, NONE of those bands are neo-prog.  
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ANDREW
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 21 2005
Location: Italy
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Points: 3064
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Posted: December 04 2005 at 10:13 |
I PREFERE 70's PROGRESSIVE BY FAR.NEO-PROG IS BORING, EXCEPT FOR SOME BANDS LIKE PORCUPINE TREE, THE FLOWER KINGS, ARS NOVA, GERARD, PAR LINDH, TOCCATA, TRESPASS, GLASS HAMMER, NUOVA ERA, ROMANTIC WARRIORS, EMPIRE, AND SOME OTHERS...
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Joined: April 27 2004
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 22:55 |
King of Loss wrote:
Neo-Prog to mean basically means Poppier, slightly less complex than Symphonic Prog. A band like Marillion or Dream Theater (Neo-Prog Metal) characterizes this. |
I believe we shouldn't mix Neo Prog with Neo Prog Metal, because are different sub-genres, from different decades, Neo Prog is older than Prog Metal (As defined) so it's obviousthat Neo Prog Metal comes long after Neo Prog.
But poppier? I don't think so,
Less complex? surely
Iván
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Soul Dreamer
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 17 2005
Location: Netherlands
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 22:55 |
Back in 1982 I was giving up on symphonic rock (not called "prog" by then) after the "ATTWT" of Genesis and "Drama" and subsequent albums of Yes (you see I'm a bit older than average here...). Marillion saved the day for me... When I heard Fish sing "So here I am once more..." I was hooked and became a huge fan of them. They carried the torch of symphonic rock through the '80 and for that I'm awfully grateful to them. So for me Neo-Prog is "Yummy" (also IQ I like very much)
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stonebeard
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Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 22:52 |
Simple medodies, sure. But "poppier?" Surely not for a good number of Neo-prog songs/bands. And I would say Pendragon (TMO as and example) rivals Yes and perhaps even Genesis in complexity.
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King of Loss
Prog Reviewer
Joined: April 21 2005
Location: Boston, MA
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Points: 17060
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 22:48 |
Neo-Prog to mean basically means Poppier, slightly less complex than Symphonic Prog. A band like Marillion or Dream Theater (Neo-Prog Metal) characterizes this.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 22:39 |
Lateralus_66 wrote:
People have many pre-concepts about neo-prog. Furthermore, the “experts” had given to this sub-genre a non-accurate definition, specially this part:
“The music holds a much more lush sound than general rock, but lacks the sophistication of truly symphonic progressive bands like Yes or amel. Instrumentally, the bands tend to be characterized by a "noodling" approach that focuses on dynamic solos, and at its best, neo-prog lyrics are deep, insightful, and acerbic. Whether neo-prog is diluted progressive or adventurous pop depends on the point of view of the listener — most progressive rock listeners are likely to find the genre dull and unchallenging, while fans of AOR will find the mix more interesting than most rock bands. Although all of the major bands are still producing albums, the classic era of neo-prog effectively ended when vocalist Fish left Marillion in 1987.”
IMHO, I think:
1) Neo-Prog is located 1,000,000 light years from Pop/AOR, and just around the corner of the “truly symphonic progressive” rock music. 2) Neo-Prog has tons of albums better than “Open Your Eyes” or “Big Generator”. 3) How is possible that “the classic era of neo-prog effectively ended when vocalist Fish left Marillion in 1987”, when 19/25 of the Neo Progressive key albums are edited > 1987 ?
Possibly, the only problem with neo-prog is there are on the road many “Salieris” and just a few “Mozarts” ...
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I believe this is not a very accurate definition, some people believe Neo Prog started with A Trick of theTail and nobody can assure when their golden era finished, I would risk to say that with the release of Hybris in the early 90's.
I stay with the shorter and more precise definition from GEPR, :
Neo-Progressive
Symphonic rock done in a typically more simple or commercial format. Also very lush but lacking the complexity of the upper bands.
Bands
Marillion, IQ, Pendragon, Aragon, etc. |
Doesn't mention AOR or Genesis influence, not inaccurate or unproved info, just a simple cold musical definition is in us to find more if we feel we can be interested.
Iván
Edited by ivan_2068
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
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Points: 28057
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 22:34 |
Lateralus_66 wrote:
People have many pre-concepts about neo-prog. Furthermore, the “experts” had given to this sub-genre a non-accurate definition, specially this part:
“The music holds a much more lush sound than general rock, but lacks the sophistication of truly symphonic progressive bands like Yes or amel. Instrumentally, the bands tend to be characterized by a "noodling" approach that focuses on dynamic solos, and at its best, neo-prog lyrics are deep, insightful, and acerbic. Whether neo-prog is diluted progressive or adventurous pop depends on the point of view of the listener — most progressive rock listeners are likely to find the genre dull and unchallenging, while fans of AOR will find the mix more interesting than most rock bands. Although all of the major bands are still producing albums, the classic era of neo-prog effectively ended when vocalist Fish left Marillion in 1987.”
IMHO, I think:
1) Neo-Prog is located 1,000,000 light years from Pop/AOR, and just around the corner of the “truly symphonic progressive” rock music. 2) Neo-Prog has tons of albums better than “Open Your Eyes” or “Big Generator”. 3) How is possible that “the classic era of neo-prog effectively ended when vocalist Fish left Marillion in 1987”, when 19/25 of the Neo Progressive key albums are edited > 1987 ?
Possibly, the only problem with neo-prog is there are on the road many “Salieris” and just a few “Mozarts” ...
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I couldn't disagree with that statement more.
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Lateralus_66
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 03 2005
Location: Fiji
Status: Offline
Points: 118
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 22:32 |
People have many pre-concepts about neo-prog. Furthermore, the “experts” had given to this sub-genre a non-accurate definition, specially this part:“The music holds a much more lush sound than general rock, but lacks the sophistication of truly symphonic progressive bands like Yes or amel. Instrumentally, the bands tend to be characterized by a "noodling" approach that focuses on dynamic solos, and at its best, neo-prog lyrics are deep, insightful, and acerbic. Whether neo-prog is diluted progressive or adventurous pop depends on the point of view of the listener — most progressive rock listeners are likely to find the genre dull and unchallenging, while fans of AOR will find the mix more interesting than most rock bands. Although all of the major bands are still producing albums, the classic era of neo-prog effectively ended when vocalist Fish left Marillion in 1987.”IMHO, I think:1) Neo-Prog is located 1,000,000 light years from Pop/AOR, and just around the corner of the “truly symphonic progressive” rock music. 2) Neo-Prog has tons of albums better than “Open Your Eyes” or “Big Generator”.3) How is possible that “the classic era of neo-prog effectively ended when vocalist Fish left Marillion in 1987”, when 19/25 of the Neo Progressive key albums are edited > 1987 ?Possibly, the only problem with neo-prog is there are on the road many “Salieris” and just a few “Mozarts” ...
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"A mind is like a parachute. It does'nt work if it's not open." - Frank Zappa
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 21:31 |
ivan_2068 wrote:
stonebeard wrote:
ivan_2068 wrote:
Not as challenging as good old Symphonic, but there are some good bands and albums like Masquerade Overture by Pendragon.
Iván
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You're a Marillion fan, right Ivan?
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Now seriously, I like some Fish era songs, but not a Marillion fan, even when I consider Script for a Jester's Tear a very good album.
Iván
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Well, not many people like all of Marillion's output, but I think almost everyone likes a few Fish-era songs at least.
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Ivan_Melgar_M
Special Collaborator
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Joined: April 27 2004
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 21:26 |
stonebeard wrote:
ivan_2068 wrote:
Not as challenging as good old Symphonic, but there are some good bands and albums like Masquerade Overture by Pendragon.
Iván
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You're a Marillion fan, right Ivan?
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Now seriously, I like some Fish era songs, but not a Marillion fan, even when I consider Script for a Jester's Tear a very good album.
Iván
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 21:16 |
OldFatherThames wrote:
In general, I find it crap and annoying...cheesy too...Marillion has some great stuff especially Script with Forgotten sons.
ivan_2068 wrote:
Not as challenging as good old Symphonic, but there are some good bands and albums like Masquerade Overture by Pendragon.
Iván
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I don't know how is the album in its entire, but I listen to the mp3 on this site and really, I don't think prog can be more cheesy than that (oh yes, maybe there is more to this world by the flower kings ). IQ has some great stuff, but na.....not my cup of tea, really !
NOT YUMMY...
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If you don't like The Masquerade Overture, I'm afraid you don't like neo-prog. That album, aside from maybe Script for a Jester's Tear, Clutching at Straws and Misplaced Childhood, is IMO the best neo-prog has to offer, and deserves to be included in the Top 25 on Progarchives.
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OldFatherThames
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 02 2005
Location: Canada
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Points: 317
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 21:02 |
In general, I find it crap and annoying...cheesy too...Marillion has some great stuff especially Script with Forgotten sons.
ivan_2068 wrote:
Not as challenging as good old Symphonic, but there are some good bands and albums like Masquerade Overture by Pendragon.
Iván
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I don't know how is the album in its entire, but I listen to the mp3 on this site and really, I don't think prog can be more cheesy than that (oh yes, maybe there is more to this world by the flower kings ). IQ has some great stuff, but na.....not my cup of tea, really !
NOT YUMMY...
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stonebeard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 27 2005
Location: NE Indiana
Status: Offline
Points: 28057
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 21:02 |
ivan_2068 wrote:
Not as challenging as good old Symphonic, but there are some good bands and albums like Masquerade Overture by Pendragon.
Iván
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You're a Marillion fan, right Ivan?
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Lateralus_66
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 03 2005
Location: Fiji
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Points: 118
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 20:56 |
SUPER yummy
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"A mind is like a parachute. It does'nt work if it's not open." - Frank Zappa
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Ivan_Melgar_M
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 20:50 |
Not as challenging as good old Symphonic, but there are some good bands and albums like Masquerade Overture by Pendragon.
Iván
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Destrio
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 04 2005
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 193
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 20:44 |
I like Marillion
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Forgotten Son
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 13 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 1356
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 20:30 |
If there is a tastier Prog sub-genre, I haven't tasted it yet.
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BebieM
Forum Senior Member
Joined: November 01 2004
Location: Germany
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Points: 854
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 19:09 |
Marillion yummy, rest not that yummy
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sleeper
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 09 2005
Location: Entropia
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Points: 16449
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Posted: December 03 2005 at 19:05 |
I love neo prog(at least what I've heard)
Marillion is one of the best bands of the moment.
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Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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