Anyone a fan of rap

I loved Rage against the machine when i was younger and first got intrested in music but they played Metal/rap, and yes some eminem songs was very good i think, havent any albums by him but i liked some songs yes i did. but no im never was a big fan and now days i dont lisen to any rap. But my sister lisen to much rap and yes some of it is preety good i have to say some very bad.

kenmeyerjr wrote: Gee, if the genre has been around 20 years and has not disappeared, you think that might give you a clue that it is a valid genre? I have to admit, the close mindedness of many of the people here give me pause to associate myself with prog.

1. We listen a genre that's hated or ignored by 99% of the people.
2. We never cared for what DJs or magazines say
3. We spend thousand of dollars in the music we love
4. We care about a broad genre that includes influences of Rock, Classical, Jazz, Folk, etc.
5. We never cared for charts.
6. We're always ready to experiment.

I guess we're anything but close minded, and sorry If I'm not scared because you refuse to associalte with Prog Rock, because you always say the same thing and you're always back.

Some people refuse rappers the status of real musicians on the grounds that they neither play an instrument, nor have musical knowledge.

Rap music was actually the first genre that spoke to me on some level (mind you, I was 12! ). Nevertheless, I think it's a valid genre, and I can still listen to some of the better acts (A Tribe Called Quest, The Roots, Pharcyde, Outkast, Dälek, early Don Johnson Big Band etc.) when the feeling strikes me.

50 Cent and MTV rap in general, is absolutely terrible, though.

Teaflax wrote: kenmeyerjr wrote: Oh, and Tea, there is nothing fake about Springsteen's working man image...obviously, he is not living on welfare, but I think he has earned both is salary and his status. And, considering how much he donates of both is money and time to things like food banks and such, I think the time has come for people to stop dumping on him just because he is successful. I don't dump on him because he is succesful, I dump on him because A) he sucks, B) his style is an image just as much a Mötley Crüe's eyeliner, scarves and teased hair were, C) he sucks and D) he's part of the "honesty and feeling are the only things that matter in art" movement that has been dragging music down for so many years. Also, because he sucks.

Ivan_Melgar_M wrote: Visitor13 wrote: That's the difference between you and some us, you trust blindly in what other persons say, we have enough confidence to trust in what we believe.    Iván

I hate rap- always have. What I want from music is superlative musicianship or superlative vocals- preferably both. Rap, at least in my experience has neither. Too much of it is sampled from old funk records from the 60s/70s and I do not relate to the ranting vocals that doesn't equate to anything I'd call singing. Controversial maybe, but I've had that opinion for years and have heard nothing to make me change my mind. It is the genre alongside dance music that I loathe above all else. It just doesn't agree with me at all...

Teaflax wrote: Ivan_Melgar_M wrote: Not only because they don't play instruments or have knowledge, but mostly because the music they play mostly lacks of elements of the music such as melody Let's see: A) The voice is an instrument.   I always thought that (read older posts about multi instrumentalists) but to speak fast is not equal to sing IMHO, I believe rap is some form of  poetry (Not new BTW, Spanish poets used to read their works backgroiunded by Flamenco guitar players who made increddible music). B) Melody is not the be-all and end-all of music. If it were, the mostly identical - and, mind you, very easy to write - melodies of most Blues (and much Rock) would disqualify it from any serious discussion.}   Not the only element, but I believe one of the most inportant. And your word about melody are absurd because you can make millions of different melodies and BTW agaun the toimming in Rock is much more similar than the melodies.   I believe that melody is not everything, but music needs it. C) Timing is a much more rare and difficult to achieve commodity than the ability to play scales.   Tead the previous. D) Whether you play an instrument or not isn't an indicator of the relative complexity of what you are doing. Playing a twelve bar Blues or regular Pop/Rock bass line is much, much easier than being a truly good rapper.   In foirst place, the playing instrument is only a copy from another post to answer it, but anyway, I valñuate higher a band that plays their instruments and writes their music than boys/girls bands that only perfoprm what others did   There must be millions of rappers in USA alone, you can find one in every corner without having the minimum knowledge of musical theory so hard, it cant be.   But a good Rock band is not so easy to find. E) Sometimes the groove is the thing (or "thang"). The difference between a Minneapolis groove, a Washington DC Go-Go groove and Clyde Stubblefield (that's James Brown's drummer - the most sampled man in the world) groove is subtle, and extremely difficult to differentiate between when playing. I have a friend who spent years learning how to drum, spent hours practicing, and even attended PIT in Los Angeles. He could probably play with most of the Prog bands I've heard, except for the very upper echelon of complexity - the guy is mad skilled. But he quit playing when he realised that he could never make it into Prince's band - he could not accurately find the groove. Vangelis could never made it yto Yes and Elton John could never made it to King Crimson (Both made auditions) and this says nothing about their skyills, only that they were not the kind of musicians those bands were searching for.   F) All art that is unique and/or difficult to emulate is valid. If anyone can do it, it's pointless. Not just anyone can rap on the level of Eminem - hell, few untrained people could rap like 50 Cent, and he sucks.   I believe all Rap sucks, at least all what I heard, and I heard more rap performers than Rock bands.   Iván

Oh, lord...

Yeah, there's a rapper on every street corner in the USA, and there's a flamenco guitarist on every block in Madrid and a fiddler on every roof in Krakow. Are you for real?

It's at least as hard to find a good rapper as it is to find a good Rock band. And rapping is not "to speak fast" - if it were, then you could do it now, and I promise you that even if you spent a week with a coach practicing, you wouldn't stand at chance at making the cut, and you certainly couldn't come up with the goods in a freestyle rap battle, where you have to improvise your lyrics as you go.

I've heard two different aspiring rappers try to do Eminem's The Real Slim Shady, and even though they'd both rehearsed it meticulously, they were so obviously off - even though they knew it all by heart. Groove is hard, ask any professional musician, and they'll agree.

Conversely, I heard some kids play Iron Man outside my window last Saturday (don't ask), and they wer godawful, but they got that song down. I like that song a lot, but it is NOT hard to play.

Seriously, you are free to feel that in order for you to enjoy music, it needs to have melody. There is nothing at all wrong with that - it's definitely one of my main criteria in most music I listen to - just not all. This is why Blues bores me, it is entirely predictable, because it has very strict conventions and the melodies seem entirely incdental rather than worked out and polished to be just right.

Anyways, you're free to feel Rap sucks (just like I freely think that Springsteen and Live suck), but it's silly to think it's any easier than it is to play yer average everyday Pop/Rock.


Edited by Teaflax - June 04 2006 at 23:08

Teaflax wrote: Kanye West is safe, dumbed-down mainstream crap with a veneer of sophistication that's as fake as Bruce Springsteen's "working man" image. There is so much more inetersting stuff going on in the underground, and pleanty of rappers who are much, much better than he is. Jean Grae. No one can touch her - that's the first thing you need to know. Quasimoto/Madlib/Yeterday's New Quintet, Dr Octagon/Kool Keith, MF Doom, Aesop Rock, RJD2, Innerstance Beatbox, DJ Shadow and many more are far more creative and progressive than the safe, cross-overy blandness of Kanye.