Cheesy Prog is....?? |
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Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Offline Points: 5127 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 12:39 | ||
Funny how we all have such different perceptions.
To me cheesy has never had anything to do with music being overblown or pretentious.
That someone says that ELP, Wakeman or Genesis Return of The Giant Hogweed is cheesy is completely against my perception of the term.
I have always associated the term to pseudo-prog which has a lot of commercial and pop leanings, perfect examples being the poppiest songs in Neal Morse's Lifeline such as The Way Home, God's Love and Children Of The Chosen (and having nothing to do with the religious lyrics, I mean the musical style).
Or the poppiest songs of Moon Safari (such as The Gods of Flowers Past in Blomljud which even with a lenght of nearly 10 min it's clearly based on pop chord progressions and melodies but with prog arrangement).
Ayreon indeed have a few cheesy ones.
In other words songs which are basically pop songs and then arranged into a proggy fashion by adding a couple of time breaks here and there, a gilmouresque solo, the instrumentation etc.
Although the cheesiest prog band must surely be Bunchacheeze Edited by Gerinski - July 13 2012 at 12:42 |
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HolyMoly
Special Collaborator Retired Admin Joined: April 01 2009 Location: Atlanta Status: Offline Points: 26133 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 12:13 | ||
I used the word "cheesy" in college to describe guys who hit on girls all the time. For music that I consider a bit embarrassing for its ingratiating manner with an absence of irony, I use the word "corny".
Edited by HolyMoly - July 13 2012 at 12:15 |
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My other avatar is a Porsche
It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased. -Kehlog Albran |
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HolyMoly
Special Collaborator Retired Admin Joined: April 01 2009 Location: Atlanta Status: Offline Points: 26133 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 12:11 | ||
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My other avatar is a Porsche
It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle if it is lightly greased. -Kehlog Albran |
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cstack3
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: July 20 2009 Location: Tucson, AZ USA Status: Offline Points: 6794 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 11:54 | ||
Agreed. "Your Own Special Way" by Genesis on W&W always comes to my mind as cloyingly sweet cheese. This definition of "cheesy" seems to nail it down for me: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=cheesy "This is an important word and nobody has it right yet. What it means is: Trying too hard, unsubtle, and inauthentic. Specifically that which is unsubtle or inauthentic in its way of trying to elicit a certain response from a viewer, listener, audience, etc. Celine Dion is cheesy because her lyrics, timbre, key changes, and swelling orchestral accompaniment telegraph 'I want you to be moved' instead of moving you." Edited by cstack3 - July 13 2012 at 11:56 |
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 11:37 | ||
Another Day by the same band. Your Own Special Way...even Mad Mad Moon to some extent. I think Collins's rendition is the culprit in both cases. |
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bb1319
Forum Groupie Joined: February 25 2012 Status: Offline Points: 84 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 11:34 | ||
Suzy Creamcheese, this is your conscience speaking. |
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"I'd say that what we hear is the quality of our listening." -Robert Fripp
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darkshade
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: November 19 2005 Location: New Jersey Status: Offline Points: 10964 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 11:21 | ||
A little earlier in his discography, but do you remember Suzy Creamcheese? |
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The Doctor
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: June 23 2005 Location: The Tardis Status: Offline Points: 8543 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 10:53 | ||
I think of cheesy as being way over the top. Rick Wakeman performing an ice show of King Arthur comes to mind as the cheesiest of cheesy prog.
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I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you?
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Snow Dog
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 23 2005 Location: Caerdydd Status: Offline Points: 32995 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 09:46 | ||
But not "cheesy"
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AlexDOM
Forum Senior Member Joined: February 02 2011 Location: Indianapolis Status: Offline Points: 775 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 09:42 | ||
Return of the Giant Hogweed by Genesis comes to my mind.
It's such a fun song
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HackettFan
Forum Senior Member Joined: June 20 2012 Location: Oklahoma Status: Offline Points: 7946 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 09:18 | ||
Hmm... I think of anything cheesy as being commercialized. Frank Zappa expounds upon the term cheese inside one of his album jackets. I can't remember which album, You Are What You Is maybe. It's been a long time since I read it, but it still guides my interpretation of the word.
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tamijo
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 06 2009 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 4287 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 07:40 | ||
Not only modern "prog metal" ballads are cheesie, we also got some cheese dripping Anderson song along the way.
Infact i was begging my record dealer, to get me the first edition vinyl, instead of the second edition he had on stock. Just because i wanted the otherwise great album, not to start with this. I was crazy about Yes/Anderson, back then, but this and a few other tracks was too slimy. Nowadays i generally find Yes to be a bit cheesie, but still like to listen to them, now and then.
Edited by tamijo - July 13 2012 at 07:47 |
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Prog is whatevey you want it to be. So dont diss other peoples prog, and they wont diss yours
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sleeper
Prog Reviewer Joined: October 09 2005 Location: Entropia Status: Offline Points: 16449 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 07:11 | ||
Ayreon are the kings of cheese. And no, cheesiness is not good in music.
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Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23098 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 06:50 | ||
But yeah, on a more serious note, I guess it refers to prog that is overblown, somewhat plastic and by the numbers so to speak. I am not naming names here, because I won't pull this thread into the gutter. I will say this though, a lot of the modern production values that now seem tattooed onto the genre itself, to me at least, unwillingly maybe - stands for most of the cheese this style of music has to offer. The lacking warmth and "noise" of the production literally lures cheese into the music.
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams |
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 06:43 | ||
An example of 'cheesy' prog, imo, would be 'Surrounded' by Dream Theater.
I actually really like that song, but hey.. I don't regard over the top music as 'cheesy' To me the term has always meant music that overplays the sentimental, so it by no means refers to just prog rock. Any musical genre can fall victim to cheese. Indeed, in the world of power ballads, the more cheese, the better..so it seems. |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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tamijo
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 06 2009 Location: Denmark Status: Offline Points: 4287 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 05:35 | ||
There is a knive made for cutting Progressive Cheese : Ergo Progressive Cheese exist
Edited by tamijo - July 13 2012 at 05:37 |
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Prog is whatevey you want it to be. So dont diss other peoples prog, and they wont diss yours
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cstack3
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: July 20 2009 Location: Tucson, AZ USA Status: Offline Points: 6794 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 05:17 | ||
Yeah, I'd have to agree with that! Even worse....I attended the Dream Theater show in Chicago a few years back. Opening for DT were "Zappa Plays Zappa," which is sublime and not to be missed....."Scale the Summit," an instrumental, guitar-prog band from Texas that channels Fripp's gamelan music.... .....and THIS mess, "Big Elf"!! Music for raging headaches! I submit this as proof positive of the existence of prog cheese: |
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friso
Prog Reviewer Joined: October 24 2007 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 2505 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 05:08 | ||
It's about putting mainstream Beegee-like pop sillyness into progressive rock, with Kansas being one of the best examples.
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Sagichim
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: November 29 2006 Location: Israel Status: Offline Points: 6632 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 04:17 | ||
Dream Theater is pretty sticky.
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Tapfret
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / Retired Admin Joined: August 12 2007 Location: Bryant, Wa Status: Offline Points: 8577 |
Posted: July 13 2012 at 02:10 | ||
I would call this photo a more classic version of the P word. This here be cheesy. |
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