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Dean
Special Collaborator Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 02:51 | ||
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What?
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Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Offline Points: 5101 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 05:08 | ||
Should Cameron resign if the Yes wins?
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chopper
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 13 2005 Location: Essex, UK Status: Offline Points: 19957 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 06:06 | ||
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chopper
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 13 2005 Location: Essex, UK Status: Offline Points: 19957 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 06:07 | ||
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 06:55 | ||
^^^ Indeed, it's one thing Cameron can't be blamed for. Scotland has arguably been shafted by successive UK governments for generation. At long last they have the right to vote to be shafted by their own government.
That said, I hope we all stay together. If we don't, my fingers are crossed for the Scots, and I wish them well, but I have a hunch they'll need a little more than just good wishes from me... |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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chopper
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 13 2005 Location: Essex, UK Status: Offline Points: 19957 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 07:41 | ||
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Dean
Special Collaborator Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 07:50 | ||
No but he signed the Edinburgh Agrement that makes it all legal and possible. That single signature is essentially callmeDave voting on behalf of the entire English, Welsh and Northern Irish population.
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What?
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The Dark Elf
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: February 01 2011 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 12764 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 08:46 | ||
Hmmm...if Scotland secedes I wonder if it will foreshadow a return of the Troubles in Northern Ireland. It would certainly give the Republicans the impetus to seek reunification with Eire.
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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology... |
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Cactus Choir
Forum Senior Member Joined: July 26 2008 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 1035 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 09:02 | ||
It certainly raises some interesting questions, like who the Loyalists in Ulster would be "loyal" to - Scotland (where most originate from) or the remaining UK? Edited by Cactus Choir - September 18 2014 at 09:06 |
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"And now...on the drums...Mick Underwooooooooood!!!"
"He's up the pub" |
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Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Offline Points: 5101 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 09:11 | ||
I think many British could blame him for having underestimated that a Yes was a real possibility. He was overconfident that come the moment of truth Scots would not dear to split. It seems clear by now that that was a very big error of judgement which can cost a high price to Britain.
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chopper
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 13 2005 Location: Essex, UK Status: Offline Points: 19957 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 09:21 | ||
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 09:28 | ||
It was difficult to predict and of course the vote is still to close to call. Equal numbers of Scots DON'T want independence. Lets not forget that.
I take enormous pleasure blaming Cameron for everything from the weather to dog turds on playing fields - obviously - but this isn't something that can be hung on him imo. Indeed, the opposition would also be guilty of under estimating the strength of feeling in the yes camp, if this were the case. That said, I did think that all three manin parties did look desperate running up to Scotland in a show of uncharacteristic solidarity at the 11th hour. |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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geekfreak
Forum Senior Member Joined: June 21 2013 Location: Musical Garden Status: Offline Points: 9872 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 09:41 | ||
yes or no that is the ?
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Friedrich Nietzsche: "Without music, life would be a mistake."
Music Is Live Two people are better off than one, for they can help each other succeed. Keep Calm And Listen To The Music… < |
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The T
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 16 2006 Location: FL, USA Status: Offline Points: 17493 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 09:44 | ||
I hope the YES wins. Self-determination of the peoples of the Earth is always good even if we end up with 12346 little countries everywhere... Then they will just start re-uniting again and we'll go back to a healthy number around 300 hundred. And maybe finally empires will come back and will reduce that even further.
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Padraic
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 16 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 31165 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 09:54 | ||
My biggest issue is that Salmond is often unrealistic is how he thinks things are going to play out after a Yes vote.
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someone_else
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: May 02 2008 Location: Going Bananas Status: Offline Points: 24019 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 10:03 | ||
I hope the Yes wins because this will give Brussels a good smack in the chops that they have deserved for so long.
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Cactus Choir
Forum Senior Member Joined: July 26 2008 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 1035 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 10:09 | ||
It does seem a bit 'wing and a prayer' with uncertainties being dismissed as not a problem. Would the European Union let Scotland in, given several EU states are worried about their own separatist movements? Would the Nato nuclear alliance admit a country that has just booted such weapons out? Why would a newly independent country want its monetary policy in effect controlled by the Bank of England? I think the Scots would probably get rid of Salmond pretty quickly once he'd served his purpose of getting independence. |
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"And now...on the drums...Mick Underwooooooooood!!!"
"He's up the pub" |
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Padraic
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: February 16 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 31165 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 10:18 | ||
It's worse than that: not only does he think EU membership is guaranteed, but that they'll be "fasttracked" because they're a successor state to an EU member, never mind that he was told time and time again that they would have to apply through the normal channels and processes. Also (European friends, please help me out), aren't new EU members required to adopt the euro? (i.e., the UK was "grandfathered" in).
I don't think Scotland wants to be part of NATO, so no worry there, even though they'll still benefit from the alliance should it come down to it. (some of the silliest internet talk has involved Putin invading Scotland) The currency issue is the worst of all - he's convinced himself a currency union will happen despite, again, being told over and over by Westminster that it absolutely will not. Why he thinks a representative from an independent country will have a say in the deliberations of the BoE is beyond my comprehension. |
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 10:21 | ||
Will it? How? Salmond ultimately wants an independent Scotland to be part of the EU, maybe even join the single currency. One point that is broadly and deliberately missed in the debate is that Salmond actually doesn't want independence at all. He wants full EU membership, which regardless of how one feels about the EU, is the polar opposite of independence. To have their monetry policy, social policy, employment legislation etc passed in a foreign country by people they haven't elected seems bizarre to me. They moan about the hold Westminster has had over them for so many years, but I'm wondering how much better off and independent they'll be as an EU economic basket case, indebted to the ECB and IMF for decades. If it goes that way that will put paid to Salmonds socialist wet dream, because they may be forced to sell off their public services to the private sector to pay their debts. |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 10:31 | ||
Looks like some pro independence thugs are starting to show their true colours. Not very British...
Guardian article Edited by Blacksword - September 18 2014 at 10:32 |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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