Neal Morse - An Agnostic's View

Just for completeness, the Catholic Church was not the only one. Hortodox Christians were and are still present in Eastern Europe from Greece to Russia

I guess I just don't understand the consistent rips against Neal...I get the point, but what I don't get is the need to keep going on about how much his lyrics offend or aggravate.

Edited by Flucktrot - July 16 2015 at 07:22

Flucktrot wrote: I guess I just don't understand the consistent rips against Neal...I get the point, but what I don't get is the need to keep going on about how much his lyrics offend or aggravate. If you don't like it, don't listen to it.  The same applies for other debates. I personally think the death growls on Opeth's stuff sounds like crap. I can't stand them, actually. Instead of trying to convince others how bad it is, I just don't listen to Opeth much. IT's a dealbreaker for me, but I can still respect why people like it, and it's still prog, so I want to see the band keep doing well. Team Morse, all the way!

Moogtron III wrote: I must say I am a shocked by some of the lyrics that Iván quoted from Neal Morse. I'm a protestant pastor and I admire Luther for taking people back to studying the Bible themselves. But I can't get behind any anti-catholic and anti-jewish propaganda, even when put in its proper time. And I realize now that I do have a problem with some of Neal Morse's lyrics. I wish that the ecumenical path would be taken more often. In my (small) city, as the pastor of the protestant church, I'm head of the city council of churches. That council includes the Roman-Catholic church, the protestant church, the Roman-Catholic ecumenical Focolare movement and an evangelical congregation. Together we come in each others' church services, we do diaconal projects together, we respect each other in each other's traditions. And we learn from each other. But it's the road less travelled...

Ivan_Melgar_M wrote: Moogtron III wrote: I must say I am a shocked by some of the lyrics that Iván quoted from Neal Morse. I'm a protestant pastor and I admire Luther for taking people back to studying the Bible themselves. But I can't get behind any anti-catholic and anti-jewish propaganda, even when put in its proper time. And I realize now that I do have a problem with some of Neal Morse's lyrics. I wish that the ecumenical path would be taken more often. In my (small) city, as the pastor of the protestant church, I'm head of the city council of churches. That council includes the Roman-Catholic church, the protestant church, the Roman-Catholic ecumenical Focolare movement and an evangelical congregation. Together we come in each others' church services, we do diaconal projects together, we respect each other in each other's traditions. And we learn from each other. But it's the road less travelled... Thanks God for communities as your's As a historical fact, Angelo Roacalli (Later John XXIII), was consecrated Archbishop in Mesembria Bulgaria predominantly Orthodox and anti-Roman Catholic. Because of he great number of Orthodoxs, the priests weren't able to give the last ritual to dying people, so Roncalli went to the Orthodox houses and gave the Extreme Unction following the Orthodox Rituals and never tried to convert anybody when giving this rite. This caused a negative reaction in  Catholic sectors who believed he was abandoning his people and the Vatican sent a visitor to verify if there were enough conversions and if not, he would be removed...The day the visitor Cardinal reached, thousands of Orthodox persons and even the bishop, were at the door of the Catholic Church shouting we're all Catholics . That's the same thing you are doing in your community shouting we're all Christians and speaks well about you. Thanks Iván

Yes he is.. perhaps he missed his protigee and perpetual pain the ass, the symphonic prodigal son who returned after spening years wandering the wasteland of the internet like Cain from Kung Fu.

Let's hope he starts going into something we disagree with (shouldn't be hard haha) watch the fireworks begin.  Neal Morse is a sh*tstain. Let's get something fun.  Come on Ivan. For old times sake. The thread will be an explosion of blue and red font. Good times!

Hey... someone suggest Jon Lord for Symphonic

of course I do...

couldn't agree with you more on the B,R,&F card.  I was a hellion on that when younger..iI remember having footballs thrown at me when I tried to lecture people on the flight of the Chinese dissidents in college in the 80's... f**king frat boys.....but it is something I have always felt very strongly about..  and far from the bullsh*t notion that one become more conservative as they grow older...in fact have gotten more passionate and strident about it as I've gotten older.

If Morse had NOT pulled the religion card.. we just would have ignored him as we do all the number of bands and artist we think suck or whose music simply don't connect. However .. he was out of bounds and deserves all the grief he gets for it.  Not only the people here.. but musicians then.. should heed the wise Mick.  Leave the lyrics to pop singers.. you are a prog artist.. just play the music man. Leave the pseudo intellectual bullsh*t to the true owners of it..  the academics.


Edited by micky - July 16 2015 at 14:05

Sooo...I'm supporting bigotry...like the confederate flag is supporting slavery? Or is some other analogy better?

SteveG wrote: I studied theology too. Until I realized it was about religion. Silly me.

Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:   snip snip Are you threatening? Don't worry I know history and as Peruvian very well informed about Spanish Conquista and the role of the Church trying to stop the Spanish conquerors, but i'm not here to talk about history, I'm here to talk about a guy using music to insult our most  holy beliefs, and gaining money wioth that. But if somebody wants to talk about history, I can also play the game in another thread.

Chill brother, chill.

I don't doubt that Christians of Morse's leaning hate the Catholic church. These idiots seem to hate more than they love. Now please, I beg of you, do not make me go and read every Morse lyric. That would be inhuman.   Look, I think you have made some valid points , my comment was meant to refer to the necessary cleaning up of the Catholic church at the time of the reformation. I seem to have painted myself into a corner where I am seen as a Morse defender when everything he stands for regarding religion I find utterly abhorrent. 

Was he talking about all your saints ? If so then yes, he is wrong but I took it to be a reference to the undeniable fact that the Catholic church and indeed the Judao Christian Islamic religions in toto have purloined an awful lot from older traditions and that includes the rebranding of certain figures as Christian saints. Again it would appear that Morse is more concerned with his loathing of the church than anything else but there is some truth in what he says. 

Regarding the Sack, that quote was made after the event and while yes Luther and his followers may well have applauded, the sack was not at his behest.  It remains a valid point that a large part of Charles' army was Catholic and that the Sack was not a specifically anti Catholic event. I do not defend Luther for his other failings, I merely say that you cannot lay the Sack of Rome at his feet.

Threatening ? No way man. Threatening anyone, other than with more gasbagging on my part, is not my way. I did remark quite early on in this very thread that perhaps it was more suited for an Off Topic forum but as everyone else simply carried on then so did I. As for a history lesson then hell yeah, I'd be more than happy to take that elsewhere. Your knowledge of theology may well outstrip mine but I was raised a Christian in a devout Christian home, educated in a Christian (albet Anglican not Catholic) school and was half expected to enter the Priesthood. Thankfully I realised the whole thing was/is a complete load of tosh and while I care not if others wish to worship their so called Gods I remain quite content with my agnosticism bordering on atheism. (As I cannot disprove God's existence I cannot say with 100% certainty that God does not exist so even though I don't believe he does.)

 


 



Edited by t d wombat - July 16 2015 at 18:57