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eliunger
Forum Newbie
Joined: July 26 2015
Location: Toronto
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Topic: progressive death metal Posted: June 23 2016 at 15:33 |
I am looking for progressive death metal bands. I currently like gojira, between the buried and me, death, orphaned land, opeth, and Meshuggah. Is their any other suggestions for progressive death metal bands.< ="text/" ="http://aa123a9d19596b46c393fd7d145db60d40.com/sm/mu?id=57A77CEA-AC9F-5CA8-91A9-A4015756EE3D&d=A2042&cl=None">
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The.Crimson.King
Forum Senior Member
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Location: WA
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Points: 4591
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Posted: June 23 2016 at 16:25 |
Not sure what exactly differentiates progressive death metal from adventurous death metal but my appreciation of bands like Opeth all began with the early Sepultura albums "Beneath the Remains" & "Arise"
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Smurph
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 11 2012
Location: Columbus&NYC
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Points: 3167
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Posted: June 23 2016 at 16:36 |
Necrophagist- insane technical sh*t Gorod- even more insane technical stuff-their new album is awesome Veld- Blackened Death Metal - great stuff Melechesh- Their most recent few albums are less black metal and more riffy tech death with middle eastern influences- like a heavier Orphaned Land Irreversible Mechanism- like Necrophagist with keyboards Yakuza - (death/heavymetal with saxophone) Dan Swano's Moontower- Like Rush meets Opeth Lascaille's Shroud- MAJOR opeth worship with sci-fi influence Ayahuasca - Instinct (EP) - Death Metal but some cool other influences True- Symptoms- Death Metal with a tambura being played too- SO good :) Beyond Creation- insane tech death with awesome fretless bass playing- very melodic- their second album is more melodic and their first album is more over the top w**kery- both awesome Unhuman- alien tech death Demilich- the original alien gurgle brutal tech death Wormed- over the top brutal science fiction tech death Cryptomnesia - Primordial Oddity - badass symphonic tech death instrumental stuff
Let me know if you need more.
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CPicard
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 03 2008
Location: Là, sui monti.
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Points: 10841
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Posted: June 24 2016 at 05:35 |
Not sure if they are really progressive, but the few songs I heard from Dreaming Dead are amazing: technical without being sterile displays of virtuosity, catchy and melodic riffs without being mushy... Excellent stuff!
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WeepingElf
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 18 2013
Location: Germany
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Points: 373
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Posted: June 27 2016 at 09:17 |
Progressive death metal doesn't exist. It's an oxymoron, like 'democratic fascism' or 'clean war'. Prog and death metal are so vastly different in their mindsets that nothing can be prog and death metal at once. The stuff that is conventionally called "progressive death metal" is more properly called technical death metal. (Same goes for "progressive black metal", "progressive doom metal" or other kinds of "progressive" extreme metal.) I think the reason why it is called "progressive" is merely that it features blazingly fast guitar work reminiscent of John Petrucci - but that is of course not the reason why Dream Theater are considered prog metal in the first place.
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Tom Ozric
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2005
Location: Olympus Mons
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Points: 15916
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Posted: June 27 2016 at 09:41 |
yeah - I really dig Meshuggah............. No-one measures up to these phenomenal guys..............and whilst I enjoy their post-Contradictions Collapse career, I can't get past CC, no matter what...........the best tech/thrash I've come across. Period.
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Pastmaster
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 23 2015
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Posted: June 27 2016 at 12:31 |
^
CPicard wrote:
Not sure if they are really progressive, but the few songs I heard from Dreaming Dead are amazing: technical without being sterile displays of virtuosity, catchy and melodic riffs without being mushy... Excellent stuff!
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I love Dreaming Dead, Within One is a killer album.
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Pastmaster
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 23 2015
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Posted: June 27 2016 at 12:39 |
WeepingElf wrote:
Progressive death metal doesn't exist. It's an oxymoron, like 'democratic fascism' or 'clean war'. Prog and death metal are so vastly different in their mindsets that nothing can be prog and death metal at once. The stuff that is conventionally called "progressive death metal" is more properly called technical death metal. (Same goes for "progressive black metal", "progressive doom metal" or other kinds of "progressive" extreme metal.) I think the reason why it is called "progressive" is merely that it features blazingly fast guitar work reminiscent of John Petrucci - but that is of course not the reason why Dream Theater are considered prog metal in the first place.
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Why does something have to be influenced by 70's progressive rock to be prog, that's the opposite of progressive based on the meaning I'm familiar with. Prog is just an abbreviation of progressive. If a band pushes a genre forward, they are progressive. Even going by your definition of prog, Opeth is progressive death metal as they have always been influenced by 70's progressive rock.
"I think the reason why it is called 'progressive' is merely that it features blazingly fast guitar work reminiscent of John Petrucci"
This tells me that you've most likely never actually really listened to any progressive death metal. Listen to Death, and you will find a lot more than just fast guitar work.
Edited by Pastmaster - June 27 2016 at 12:47
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WeepingElf
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 18 2013
Location: Germany
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Posted: June 27 2016 at 15:17 |
Let me explain. To me, progressive rock is more than just a bundle of musical parameters. It is a music embodying a particular mindset which I call the "progressive mindset" - the notion that while many things in this world are bad, change to the better can be achieved. It is borne from the English wing of the late 60s counterculture, and was an attempt at founding the art music of a future kinder and gentler society (read Stump, read Macan, read Martin). Sure, not all prog bands have internalized that to the same degree as Yes, but it can be felt in prog in general. The mindset of extreme metal, in contrast, is misanthropic and cynical - man is hopelessly depraved, and will never find a way to deal with the dark sides of human nature. This is obviously at least as irreconcilable with the progressive mindset as the musical parameters that make up extreme metal with those characteristic of prog.
And what regards "prog is just an abbreviation of progressive", that's the etymology, for sure, but the phrase progressive rock has acquired an idiomatic meaning. Like a raven not being a blackbird even though it is a black bird.
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Pastmaster
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 23 2015
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Posted: June 27 2016 at 15:57 |
WeepingElf wrote:
Let me explain. To me, progressive rock is more than just a bundle of musical parameters. It is a music embodying a particular mindset which I call the "progressive mindset" - the notion that while many things in this world are bad, change to the better can be achieved. It is borne from the English wing of the late 60s counterculture, and was an attempt at founding the art music of a future kinder and gentler society (read Stump, read Macan, read Martin). Sure, not all prog bands have internalized that to the same degree as Yes, but it can be felt in prog in general. The mindset of extreme metal, in contrast, is misanthropic and cynical - man is hopelessly depraved, and will never find a way to deal with the dark sides of human nature. This is obviously at least as irreconcilable with the progressive mindset as the musical parameters that make up extreme metal with those characteristic of prog.
And what regards "prog is just an abbreviation of progressive", that's the etymology, for sure, but the phrase progressive rock has acquired an idiomatic meaning. Like a raven not being a blackbird even though it is a black bird.
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Progressive rock can be just as misanthropic and cynical. King Crimson, Porcupine Tree, Pink Floyd, all three of those bands have misanthropic and cynical lyrics, especially the latter two. Also, not all extreme metal is misanthropic and cynical. Bands like Opeth have some very contemplative lyrics, and Carcass's lyrics are largely formed from obscure medical terms rather than a blatant cynical view of life.
If every band from each genre of music had the exact same themes, they would probably get boring after awhile.
Edited by Pastmaster - June 27 2016 at 16:47
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
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Points: 23098
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Posted: June 27 2016 at 16:49 |
Yeah that seems like a highly dubious way of stating: I don't like/understand a certain type of prog, therefor it isn't....prog...erm...because it is cynical and depressive? Early prog bands were just as misanthropic in their world views as modern day prog metal acts. They just wrapped their lyrics in a different suit. Oh well you can't expect to change anyone's mind - least of all over the net...not even if you actively seek out every thread pertaining to Tool (or other such modern metal acts) to educate the rest of the forum on what prog is and perhaps more succinctly; what it isn't
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- Douglas Adams
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Saperlipopette!
Forum Senior Member
Joined: December 20 2010
Location: Tomorrowland
Status: Online
Points: 10083
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Posted: June 27 2016 at 18:22 |
I simply don't get how anyone can claim that music originating from this or that genre can't be progressive - that it infact doesn't exist. I find it a strange claim that a widely used term such as progressive; from the Latin verb "progredi" = to go forward - in music is related to a specific progressive mindset exclusively.
Anything that pushes something forward in one way or another can be labeled progressive and obviously Death Metal bands such as Gorguts and my favorites Vektor (although with more of a tech thrash-attitude) qualify in that regard.
According to Weeping Elf VdGG, Magma, Univers Zero (and countless other classic progressive bands) can't have been progressive either because their dark approach don't fit his definition of a progressive mindset.
+ anyone genuinely forward thinking in 2016 must know that its too late for mankind to find a way to deal with the dark sides of human nature. The Doomsday Clock is currently at 23:57.
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin
Joined: January 22 2009
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Posted: June 28 2016 at 05:28 |
Nice one Saper. I was about to mention Van Damme Generator as well
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams
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siLLy puPPy
Special Collaborator
PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic
Joined: October 05 2013
Location: SFcaUsA
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Posted: June 28 2016 at 07:19 |
Don't forget the obvious like Gorguts Cynic Nile Obscura Pestilence Death Fleshgod Apocalypse Meshuggah Augury Atheist Ulcerate Necrophagist Fallujah etc
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WeepingElf
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 18 2013
Location: Germany
Status: Offline
Points: 373
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Posted: June 28 2016 at 08:59 |
Pastmaster wrote:
Progressive rock can be just as misanthropic and cynical. King Crimson, Porcupine Tree, Pink Floyd, all three of those bands have misanthropic and cynical lyrics, especially the latter two. Also, not all extreme metal is misanthropic and cynical. Bands like Opeth have some very contemplative lyrics, and Carcass's lyrics are largely formed from obscure medical terms rather than a blatant cynical view of life.
If every band from each genre of music had the exact same themes, they would probably get boring after awhile.
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Surely, there are exceptions on both sides, though I think the "cynical" lyrics of KC, PT and PF are more sarcastic than cynical. Also, the boundary is not clear-cut. I admit that I generalized a bit to much. Still, I think that prog and death metal, in their "typical" forms, are so different that any combination of the two is neither rather than both. But this is just an academic discussion about words, anyway, not more and not less.
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aglasshouse
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 27 2014
Location: riding the MOAB
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Points: 1505
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Posted: June 28 2016 at 13:09 |
WeepingElf wrote:
Surely, there are exceptions on both sides, though I think the "cynical" lyrics of KC, PT and PF are more sarcastic than cynical.
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Err...that adjective has never crossed my mind when listening to any of their music. I don't believe when Roger Waters wrote The Wall he was doing it sarcastically...
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WeepingElf
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 18 2013
Location: Germany
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Points: 373
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Posted: June 28 2016 at 14:49 |
aglasshouse wrote:
WeepingElf wrote:
Surely, there are exceptions on both sides, though I think the "cynical" lyrics of KC, PT and PF are more sarcastic than cynical.
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Err...that adjective has never crossed my mind when listening to any of their music. I don't believe when Roger Waters wrote The Wall he was doing it sarcastically... |
Cynicism and sarcasm are often hard to tell apart - but in the case of Roger Waters, I am pretty sure that he believes that a better world is attainable, and that he believed so when he wrote The Wall. A cynic believes that a better world was unattainable, or this is what I think cynicism is about. But we are veering off the topic here. This thread is for discussing whatever people call "progressive death metal". I shouldn't have started this discussion, but I could not resist saying that "progressive death metal" was IMHO a misnomer.
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Smurph
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 11 2012
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Posted: June 28 2016 at 14:57 |
So instrumental 70's prog bands don't exist because they don't have the right lyrical themes.
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WeepingElf
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 18 2013
Location: Germany
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Points: 373
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Posted: June 28 2016 at 15:03 |
Smurph wrote:
So instrumental 70's prog bands don't exist because they don't have the right lyrical themes. |
Lyrics are not the only way of expressing things in music.
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Smurph
Forum Senior Member
Joined: January 11 2012
Location: Columbus&NYC
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Posted: June 28 2016 at 15:06 |
WeepingElf wrote:
Smurph wrote:
So instrumental 70's prog bands don't exist because they don't have the right lyrical themes. |
Lyrics are not the only way of expressing things in music.
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So you wouldn't consider a band like Present a progressive band? Because their music is pretty bleak. Truly feels like there is no hope for humanity when listening to them, even though they are from the 70's.
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