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Divisive Prog Albums |
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verslibre ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: July 01 2004 Location: CA Status: Online Points: 19481 |
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The very definition of divisive.
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Cristi ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Crossover / Prog Metal Teams Joined: July 27 2006 Location: wonderland Status: Offline Points: 46851 |
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You're probably right. I have always enjoyed it.
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Lewian ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: August 09 2015 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 15562 |
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I had a look at this from a mathematical angle. Rating any album 3 or 4 stars is pretty normal, so a "divisive" album should have many 5 and 2 or 1 while having a good number of ratings. Looking at typical percentages I'd say that a divisive album should at least have 20% 5 star ratings and at least 10% 2 or 1 star (people come here for the music they like, so there's more going on at the upper end; an album with less than 20% 5 star just isn't very appreciated). Let's have a look at some albums discussed here. Tales from Topographic Oceans just has 7% negative, Brain Salad Surgery has 5%, The Wall has 6% (Final Cut only 14% 5 stars on the other hand, against 28% negative ratings; Ummagumma has 14:18, kind of divisive but not very many who appreciate it highly though I'm one of them), A Passion Play just 5%, Tago Mago 7%, Awake 5%, Frances the Mute 8%. So all these are not super divisive as there are not that many who rate them 1 or 2. ALT on the other hand has only 7% 5 stars against 53% 1 or 2; other well known VDGG don't make 10% 1 or 2 stars, neither most of King Crimson, though Beat with 9:20 looks very negative (I'm one of the 9% to rate it at 5 stars!). The most divisive album I have found is Trout Mask Replica, which collects 40% 5 stars against 20% 1/2 stars. That's quite something. Dream Theater's The Astonishing clocks in at 22% 5 stars, 32% 1 or 2 - in fact 22% 5 stars is quite astonishing with 32% negatives. A View From the Top of The World scores 31:12 (but doesn't have that many ratings), Octavarium 26:11. Dream Theater are pretty divisive indeed, if not Awake. Later Mars Volta's Bedlam in Goliath qualifies with 24:15. Amarok just about makes the cut with 42:11. Zeit is indeed pretty divisive with 30:12. Not quite up there but still in is one of my favourites, My Life in the Bush of Ghosts (30:10). Looking at Zappa, Jazz From Hell misses by an inch with 19:11, other than that I didn't find any that came close to qualifying (occasionally 8% negative for generally appreciated albums). Neither get Gentle Giant in, nor Genesis (far too few negatives up to Wind and Wuthering, far too few 5 stars after), nor Camel (I think of Breathless as divisive, but just 10% 5 stars are not enough for this game). Rush has Power Windows at 22:13 (I don't know that one), otherwise they are not quite as divisive. Let's look at Swans, The Seer has 36:13, To Be Kind 33:15, very divisive! There are more, but they have fewer than 100 ratings; even The Seer and To Be Kind have quite a bit fewer ratings than most other albums I mention here. Just seen: Tangerine Dream Cyclone seemed to be a good candidate to me, but I'm surprised that it only has 8% 1 or 2 stars (personally I like it a lot).
Edited by Lewian - May 08 2023 at 11:50 |
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omphaloskepsis ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 19 2011 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 6908 |
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Does Steven Wilson's "The Future Bites" qualify as "divisive album" under the criteria outlined in your math formula?
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Cristi ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Crossover / Prog Metal Teams Joined: July 27 2006 Location: wonderland Status: Offline Points: 46851 |
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I say it is divisive ,based on what I've seen here on PA and a couple other sites I've visited. People either praise it or totally dislike it.
Edited by Cristi - May 08 2023 at 12:07 |
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siLLy puPPy ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() PSIKE, JRF/Canterbury, P Metal, Eclectic Joined: October 05 2013 Location: SFcaUsA Status: Offline Points: 15456 |
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No it’s not a review. It conveys absolutely nothing about the album just the listeners inability to process it |
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Negoba ![]() Prog Reviewer ![]() ![]() Joined: July 24 2008 Location: Big Muddy Status: Offline Points: 5210 |
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I also dislike Tago Mago. Are you assuming I can't understand or process it?
Ash Ra Tempel's debut is one of my favorite all time albums, BTW.
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You are quite a fine person, and I am very fond of you. But you are only quite a little fellow, in a wide world, after all.
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Cristi ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Crossover / Prog Metal Teams Joined: July 27 2006 Location: wonderland Status: Offline Points: 46851 |
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if it's not a review, report it, tell the admins to get rid of it. ![]() You can argue it's a poorly written, useless review and I'd agree.
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Saperlipopette! ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: December 20 2010 Location: Tomorrowland Status: Offline Points: 13118 |
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^ in Chris H's defence I didn't post the full review (which is why I wrote "from"). I guess there's minimal improvement, but here's the rest: ...Maybe you
need to be on shrooms to get everything out of them? Just a thought...
Well anyways, "Bring Me Coffee Or Tea" is the only listenable track on this album, even the so called "epic" "Halleluwah", which is once again, pointless. It's just a shame "Bring Me Coffee Or Tea" was the first song I heard, because it cost me $2.50. 1 star, DO NOT BUY!... |
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David_D ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15838 |
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Allright! That is a very thorough approach.
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quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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Steve Wyzard ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: March 30 2017 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 3025 |
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3 pages in and so far no one has mentioned two of the most divisive prog albums of all:
Yes: 90125 Genesis: Abacab (I happen to love'em both!)
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David_D ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15838 |
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If anybody could be curious about whether a particular album is divisive, RYM shows rating statistics for all albums.
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quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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Nogbad_The_Bad ![]() Forum & Site Admin Group ![]() ![]() RIO/Avant/Zeuhl & Eclectic Team Joined: March 16 2007 Location: Boston Status: Offline Points: 21675 |
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Using Lewian's formula (that I like)
Steve Wilson - The Future Bites - 10:40 - not divisive, not enough 5 stars Yes - 90215 - 13:25 - not divisive, not enough 5 stars Genesis - Abacab - 6:36 - not divisive just disliked broadly.
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Ian
Host of the Post-Avant Jazzcore Happy Hour on Progrock.com https://podcasts.progrock.com/post-avant-jazzcore-happy-hour/ |
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David_D ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15838 |
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I'd say not on RYM, as the vast majority give it 2-4 stars, but you can have a look at the statistics yourself.
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quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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David_D ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15838 |
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But it's of course still quite a question how exactly define "divisive". |
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quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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Cristi ![]() Special Collaborator ![]() ![]() Crossover / Prog Metal Teams Joined: July 27 2006 Location: wonderland Status: Offline Points: 46851 |
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divisivedĭ-vī′sĭvadjective
Edited by Cristi - May 08 2023 at 13:56 |
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David_D ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15838 |
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And now I discovered that so does PA.
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quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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David_D ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15838 |
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I meant an exact definition in relation to the "mathematical angle", as it's surely a matter of choice. |
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quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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David_D ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 26 2010 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 15838 |
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To begin with, I would juxtapose 4-5 stars against 1-2 stars. |
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quality over quantity, and all kind of PopcoRn almost beyond
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omphaloskepsis ![]() Forum Senior Member ![]() ![]() Joined: October 19 2011 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 6908 |
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I love Big Generator more than 90125. Is that divisive? When it comes to 90125 vs Abacab or Numbers vs Letter albums....I wonder which album do most people feel in the biggest Sellout? I vote Abacab by far, since I adore 90125.
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