Friday13th wrote: ^ Neal doesn't do that. Every modern Catholic acknowledges the corruption of the church during Luther's time. My uncle is a monk and tells me how much many Catholic monks revere Luther. Indulgences, witholding communion for political reasons, all these things are universally condemned by all Christians. Luther was an anti-semite, but almost everyone was back then due to widespread ignorance. No one is covering up anything, Neal is just not bogging down a man's inspiring work for his failures.

Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - July 14 2015 at 17:35

sleeper wrote: I don't mind Christian lyrics so much, despite being an agnostic with a serious dislike for religion, but it is entirely dependant on the writing style and delivery. Morse is a simplistic, crass writer that takes his beliefs and shoves it down the listeners throat without any sense of elequence or poetry at all, evoking all the worst kinds or cliches from christian music. Then there's his delivery, with his voice clearly mixed right to the very front leaving absolutely no doubt about what his singing and enhancing his "message". Then there's the fact that he's broken record, singing about the same damned subject on every bloody song for 15 prolific years. Then there's his music, which has zero identity of any kind. If it wasn't for the obvious absence of Dave Meros thundering bass tones, there'd be absolutley no way to tell his current music apart from his run in Spock's Beard (crappy lyrics aside). Or Transatlantic. Or Dream Theater in the instrumental sections. This might have been acceptable 15, 20 years ago when there were far fewer bands playing a modern take on Symphonic Prog and the musicians were all younger with more to say, but today these bands are ten a penny from the same group of people that have done it all before a dozen times over. Musically he has nothing left to say that we haven't all heard already multiple times. It's not this is the only way to get his beliefs across in music either. Kerry Livegren wrote about Christianity a lot for Kansas and Proto-Kaw, and whilst the former doesnt interest me musically much, neither of them bother me in the slightest lyrically, even when I know it's religion they're singing about. The difference is talant (a subjective opinion, I know).

Right on the money, Sleeper. Perhaps if Morse was a more talented lyricist, we might not be having this conversation. Lyrics are supposed to move people emotionally, not move people away from the music. Morse has this effect more than any other pro religious lyricist that I know of, and I've heard quite a few in my time.

Edited by SteveG - July 14 2015 at 15:20

^ Neal doesn't do that. Every modern Catholic acknowledges the corruption of the church during Luther's time. My uncle is a monk and tells me how much many Catholic monks revere Luther. Indulgences, witholding communion for political reasons, all these things are universally condemned by all Christians. Luther was an anti-semite, but almost everyone was back then due to widespread ignorance. No one is covering up anything, Neal is just not bogging down a man's inspiring work for his failures.

Friday13th wrote: miamiscot wrote: I honestly believe Neal's conversion was the best thing that could have happened to him - spiritually and musically. Before that he wrote some nice stuff (see Spock's Beard V and Transatlantic Bridge Across Forever) but all his best work came after: Testimony, One, ? and Sola Scriptura are all among the finest albums ever recorded. And this is, in my opinion, in no small part because he had purpose. He had a destiny. Those records (whether you're a Christian or not) are inspired works.   Yes, I'm a huge fan. That in no way diminishes what he has accomplished.   I'm with this guy!

Agree with you! It seems his creativity took wing. I like Testimony more than his SB and Transatlantic works. Some of his other solo works sound less inspired but I still find something to enjoy like Lifeline and Testimony 2 (second disc).

As a christian I have no problems with his lyrics. Actually it's a plus for me. It's hard to find such good christian prog. I also enjoy any good music with positive message (or feel) but I wouldn't want to listen to something negative or satanic.

Musically I see Neal Morse as "the Mozart of prog". He's a master of musical hooks. This memorable melodies are really compelling to me. His composition can be simple or/and advanced. His discography is vast plus constant concerts ...

Interesting discussion...

miamiscot wrote: I honestly believe Neal's conversion was the best thing that could have happened to him - spiritually and musically. Before that he wrote some nice stuff (see Spock's Beard V and Transatlantic Bridge Across Forever) but all his best work came after: Testimony, One, ? and Sola Scriptura are all among the finest albums ever recorded. And this is, in my opinion, in no small part because he had purpose. He had a destiny. Those records (whether you're a Christian or not) are inspired works.   Yes, I'm a huge fan. That in no way diminishes what he has accomplished.

Personally i don't care if lyrics praise God, Satan or the Easter Bunny. If i like the music the lyrics are secondary. I like lots of Christian and Gospel, but i also like Satanic metal like Mayhem. I even like those cute Easter songs from my childhood. Good music is good music regardless of philosophical leanings. As for Mr Norse, he is hit and miss with me. He has some great music but his sheer output tends to repeat itself a lot whether it be in the Spock's Beard days, the solo stuff or with Transatlantic

I don't mind Christian lyrics so much, despite being an agnostic with a serious dislike for religion, but it is entirely dependant on the writing style and delivery. Morse is a simplistic, crass writer that takes his beliefs and shoves it down the listeners throat without any sense of elequence or poetry at all, evoking all the worst kinds or cliches from christian music. Then there's his delivery, with his voice clearly mixed right to the very front leaving absolutely no doubt about what his singing and enhancing his "message". Then there's the fact that he's broken record, singing about the same damned subject on every bloody song for 15 prolific years. Then there's his music, which has zero identity of any kind. If it wasn't for the obvious absence of Dave Meros thundering bass tones, there'd be absolutley no way to tell his current music apart from his run in Spock's Beard (crappy lyrics aside). Or Transatlantic. Or Dream Theater in the instrumental sections. This might have been acceptable 15, 20 years ago when there were far fewer bands playing a modern take on Symphonic Prog and the musicians were all younger with more to say, but today these bands are ten a penny from the same group of people that have done it all before a dozen times over. Musically he has nothing left to say that we haven't all heard already multiple times.

It's not this is the only way to get his beliefs across in music either. Kerry Livegren wrote about Christianity a lot for Kansas and Proto-Kaw, and whilst the former doesnt interest me musically much, neither of them bother me in the slightest lyrically, even when I know it's religion they're singing about. The difference is talant (a subjective opinion, I know).

Can we add all the other prog rock bands that have a religious theme in their lyrics.......Why is only one artist getting scrutinized?

Lyrics "CAN BE" an important part of the whole thing, not always. Which importance can have "Toka Taye Tay Toka" or "Mitto mutto" sung by Jon Anderson?  (Jon and Vangelis Private Collection and Olias of Sunhillow)