Is RPI sung in English - really RPI?

symphonicman wrote: I understand what you mean. I was just thinking. What if there is a band that has the Italian sound and language that is not from Italy. There's Krautrock bands that isn't from Germany. There's Zeuhl bands that isn't from France. There's no Rock Progressivo Italiano bands that isn't from Italy though.

True but Zeuhl and Kraut doesn't have the french or german nationality in the genre description and there's a reason for it: Both are about specific musicgenres to a larger extent. If most RPI-bands had sung in english RPI wouldn't have existed as a sub-genre at PA. The music itself isn't unique-sounding enough for that. We also say Japanese Zeuhl, Polish Jazz and its its mainly about geography.  

^Of course I know that. Still far from the same.

Saperlipopette! wrote: ^Of course I know that. Still far from the same.

I agree there's a difference between RPI and Krautrock/Zeuhl regarding the nationality of the artists in the genre, and that RPI is closely, although not entirely, connected with the usage of the Italian language, I just don't understand how you can use nationality in genre description as an argument when German is mentioned in the Krautrock genre description, and it's in the the name of the genre. Nit-picking, I know, but still...

^ Or perhaps Germany? 

I'm certainly no expert on RPI (and it's not one of my favorite styles...which is basically symph or eclectic anyway..) but as several have mentioned or alluded to here , I'm not sure why there even needs to be a genre for that. There is no French, Swedish, etc category for other foreign 'sounding' prog bands.

Raff wrote: dr wu23 wrote: I'm certainly no expert on RPI (and it's not one of my favorite styles...which is basically symph or eclectic anyway..) but as several have mentioned or alluded to here , I'm not sure why there even needs to be a genre for that. There is no French, Swedish, etc category for other foreign 'sounding' prog bands. I'm not even sure why we have a 'Krautrock' sub genre....by that reasoning there should be a 'Britrock' sub genre for quintessentially British sounding prog....etc. Why aren't the basic genres enough...symph, eclectic, proto, prog related, fusion...etc?   I have heard all the reasons before but if anyone wants to try and convince me of the rationale for these categories ....have at it.       If you believe the subgenre is not legit, and nothing anyone will say will change your mind, why do you even bother to ask? We did spend a lot of time and effort in writing down a very comprehensive definition of RPI - drawing down on my first-hand experience as someone who was there (in Italy, I mean) at the time the subgenre developed. I now realize that we probably shouldn't have bothered.

I did reread the actual RPI page (been  quite a while since I first read it..) and the multi paragraph explanation of the RPI origins and the reasons for why a sub genre was created. I understand better now why some believe it deserves it's own niche and sub genre. I can't say I agree fully with all of the arguments, but I do understand why it  has been accepted as  a prog area all it's own.

dr wu23 wrote:   As you can see I have been here about 5 years with a number of posts and been listening to prog from the beginning of what was considered prog.......and I never said the 'genre' wasn't 'legit' (your word btw..)...whatever that means, and did say 'have at it'. My question is why is it necessary when there aren't any for the other countries....Krautrock being the exception to the rule apparently. I have , of course, read the RPI 'explanation' but it seems to be more a rationalization that's about those who like the genre for their own reasons  than why it's necessary since RPI is primarily symphonic  prog .

First of all, thanks for re-reading the definition and finding something to appreciate. Before I bow out of the discussion for good, I'd just like to comment on the bolded part of your quote. That kind of reasoning - i.e. that people want to push their own agenda, regardless of evidence - was behind some of the nastiest confrontations in the Collab Zone, with personal insults flung left, right and centre. Personally, though I am Italian born and bred, I cannot even say I am a fan of RPI as many people are here. However, without the development of a vibrant prog scene in the early Seventies (when I was in my pre-teen years), I would probably not have got into prog as I did.

everyone did a great job putting that definition together. It was a real team effort.

However the thing to recognize.. and likely the main selling point to M@X who had to authorize this...

what is the PRIMARY mission of this site.. other than cataloging.. it is to faciliate discovery of all these wonderful bands and albums we have added.   Regardless of whether RPI is or is not 'valid' in people's opinions..  what it did was place groups in a logical section where people who want to discover the vast wealth of the Italian prog scene can find these groups.

As I told M@X..  the person who gets into Italian prog via PFM doesn't give two sh*ts about whether BANCO is symphonic.. Osanna Heavy Prog.. Area is Avant Fusion.. they naturally flow together...

it is like the way groups are classifed in the tradtional sub-genres..  are Yes symphonic.. are Genesis syphonic. .who knows. Those are very often personal opinions on the music.. what they are though.. are naturally grouped togehter.. even though they sound vastly different. They are natural being grouped together.

TGM: Orb wrote: micky wrote: everyone did a great job putting that definition together. It was a real team effort. However the thing to recognize.. and likely the main selling point to M@X who had to authorize this... what is the PRIMARY mission of this site.. other than cataloging.. it is to faciliate discovery of all these wonderful bands and albums we have added.   Regardless of whether RPI is or is not 'valid' in people's opinions..  what it did was place groups in a logical section where people who want to discover the vast wealth of the Italian prog scene can find these groups. As I told M@X..  the person who gets into Italian prog via PFM doesn't give two sh*ts about whether BANCO is symphonic.. Osanna Heavy Prog.. Area is Avant Fusion.. they naturally flow together... it is like the way groups are classifed in the tradtional sub-genres..  are Yes symphonic.. are Genesis syphonic. .who knows. Those are very often personal opinions on the music.. what they are though.. are naturally grouped togehter.. even though they sound vastly different. They are natural being grouped together. Exactly that.