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SteveG View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Why Punk?
    Posted: August 26 2015 at 14:25
The perceived enemy of progressive rock, what caused the rise of punk rock in the seventies and why does its short reign still resonate today?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 14:35
Punk might not have invented the entire "do-it-yourself" ethos of setting up your entire independent infrastructure of underground record labels, concert venues etc. separate from the mainstream music industry, but it certainly popularized that approach to doing things in music back in the late 1970s and early 1980s.

Then there's the fact that punk seems to function as a "cultural movement" first and a genre of music second. Here in Denmark, the hardcore punk music scene seems to have functioned as a meeting nexus and common social glue for people with far-left political loyalties. To the point that one of the first things that our newly elected right-wing government did after inauguration was to declare special emergency police action against crusties. (for vandalism rather than squatting though)


Edited by Toaster Mantis - August 26 2015 at 14:40
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 14:35
Good question mate. Punk tried to kill prog, and failed miserably.
'We're going to need a bigger swear jar.'
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 14:36
Don't know much about punk but all I know is people got fed up of 20 minute long songs. Who knew? On another note Punk had a lot to do with the image as well. (Looking and living the punk lifestyle) 

Edited by moosehead - August 26 2015 at 15:09
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 14:38
Originally posted by Floydoid Floydoid wrote:

Good question mate. Punk tried to kill prog, and failed miserably.
Yes, but it threw in a few good punches before it finally kicked off.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 14:39
I think artists like Patti Smith get overlooked and her recordings still stand out.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 14:59
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by Floydoid Floydoid wrote:

Good question mate. Punk tried to kill prog, and failed miserably.
Yes, but it threw in a few good punches before it finally kicked off.


And to be honest, by the late 70's (post- 'Animals') prog was going a bit stale.
'We're going to need a bigger swear jar.'
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 15:15
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

The perceived enemy of progressive rock, what caused the rise of punk rock in the seventies and why does its short reign still resonate today?
In my opinion, the music industry was looking for the next big thing" so they were repackaged already existed U.S. garage rock and British pub-rock, called it "punk", somehow they managed to capture it on vinyl (what wasn't easy to find the band who could recording something in studio that to be listenable because mostly of those 70s garage rock / pub-rock bands were "great" live in the bars /pubs and in small underground venues but terrible in the studio) and that's it. On other side, a very important moment for the music industry was that that the punk music, unlike Prog and 70s Rock, was cheap to record, but the Punk music LPs and singles weren't cheaper for the buyers; punk was created by the industry as an ideal field for exploitation, actually.
However, Punk was too simple to figure out, you know, "you've got an idea - make a song and play", and that quickly become boring even for the punk-rockers themselfs, so the bands with some talent were changed the music direction into more artistic post-punk. Also, Punk was a (sh*t) way of life that disappeared along with its protagonists who get older or, in worst cases, died by heroin overdose.
Anyway, the fact is that the Punk was the last big movement of youth
.


Edited by Svetonio - August 26 2015 at 15:24
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 15:27
Originally posted by Svetonio Svetonio wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

The perceived enemy of progressive rock, what caused the rise of punk rock in the seventies and why does its short reign still resonate today?
In my opinion, the music industry was looking for the "next big thing" so they were repackaged already existed U.S. garage rock and British pub-rock, called it "punk", somehow they managed to capture it on vinyl (what wasn't easy to find the band who could recording something in studio that to be listenable because mostly of those 70s garage rock / pub-rock bands were "great" live in the bars /pubs and in small underground venues but terrible in the studio) and that's it. On other side, a very important moment for the music industry was that that the punk music, unlike Prog and 70s Rock, was cheap to record, but the Punk music LPs and singles weren't cheaper for the buyers; punk was created by the industry as an ideal field for exploitation, actually.
However, Punk was too simple to figure out, you know, "you've got an idea - make a song and play", and that quickly become boring even for the punk-rockers themselfs, so the bands with some talent were changed the music direction into more artistic post-punk. Also, Punk was a (sh*t) way of life that disappeared along with its protagonists who get older or, in worst cases, died by heroin overdose.
Anyway, the fact is that the Punk was the last big movement of youth
.
 
Uhm no? have you ever heard of something called Hip-Hop. A youth movement that began because they couldn't even afford their own instruments to play.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 15:35
^^ Young people don't move these days Tongue
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 15:39
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

^^ Young people don't move these days Tongue
 
Not a good joke. Hip hop movement started way back in the 70s'
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 15:39
Originally posted by moosehead moosehead wrote:

Originally posted by Svetonio Svetonio wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

The perceived enemy of progressive rock, what caused the rise of punk rock in the seventies and why does its short reign still resonate today?
In my opinion, the music industry was looking for the "next big thing" so they were repackaged already existed U.S. garage rock and British pub-rock, called it "punk", somehow they managed to capture it on vinyl (what wasn't easy to find the band who could recording something in studio that to be listenable because mostly of those 70s garage rock / pub-rock bands were "great" live in the bars /pubs and in small underground venues but terrible in the studio) and that's it. On other side, a very important moment for the music industry was that that the punk music, unlike Prog and 70s Rock, was cheap to record, but the Punk music LPs and singles weren't cheaper for the buyers; punk was created by the industry as an ideal field for exploitation, actually.
However, Punk was too simple to figure out, you know, "you've got an idea - make a song and play", and that quickly become boring even for the punk-rockers themselfs, so the bands with some talent were changed the music direction into more artistic post-punk. Also, Punk was a (sh*t) way of life that disappeared along with its protagonists who get older or, in worst cases, died by heroin overdose.
Anyway, the fact is that the Punk was the last big movement of youth
.
 
Uhm no? have you ever heard of something called Hip-Hop. A youth movement that began because they couldn't even afford their own instruments to play.
I had in mind the youth movement that was based on rock.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 15:40
Reading people's description in this thread of punk culture makes me wonder... how many of you have actually met any real live punks? I've got a lot of friends in that milieu, and none of them fit the stereotype you describe at all.

Punk created by the industry as an ideal field for exploitation? I thought punk did more to liberate rock music from the centralized music industry's exploitation than any other scene, by creating its own do-it-yourself distribution network. Not to mention I know plenty of people who still live by the ideals of punk culture, as ridiculous as it may seem to outsiders, or that a lot of the punk musicians I know are very talented instrumentalists even if they don't focus on long sprawling epics.
"The past is not some static being, it is not a previous present, nor a present that has passed away; the past has its own dynamic being which is constantly renewed and renewing." - Claire Colebrook
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 15:43
Originally posted by moosehead moosehead wrote:

Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

^^ Young people don't move these days Tongue
 
Not a good joke. Hip hop movement started way back in the 70s'
I was pointing for Svetonio's post, but seriously what major movement appeared in the last 20 years? Ermm
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 15:51
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

Originally posted by moosehead moosehead wrote:

Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

^^ Young people don't move these days Tongue
 
Not a good joke. Hip hop movement started way back in the 70s'
I was pointing for Svetonio's post, but seriously what major movement appeared in the last 20 years? Ermm
Be more specific next time you pointed to my comment ontop of it. And there has been none since the generations before us has f**ked everything upfor the current youth. Thank you to all you old geezers out on this forum.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 15:54
I think punk became quickly obsolete once experimental punk and no-wave started showing up
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 16:26
Originally posted by Toaster Mantis Toaster Mantis wrote:

Reading people's description in this thread of punk culture makes me wonder... how many of you have actually met any real live punks? (...)
I knew many of them very well, and few of them were very popular punk musicians. We know each other from the same block - it was just so happened that I lived in the same block with the guys who are now "legends" of 80s scene in Belgrade. But almost all of them are gone by heroin overdose.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 17:46
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

The perceived enemy of progressive rock, what caused the rise of punk rock in the seventies and why does its short reign still resonate today?
 
Punk was the perceived enemy of all music other than punk.
LOL
 
Frankly, I  never cared for any of the punk stuff though there was definitely energy there.


Edited by dr wu23 - August 26 2015 at 17:48
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 18:07
Hmmm. As someone who grew up in NYC and was a young adult in the seventies, I can give you my take on the NYC punk scene, for what it's worth.
First off, NYC was the pits in the seventies. Greenwich Village became a rundown slum after the folk artists split for greener pastures and the fledgling punk scene was a kind of embodiment of the decay of the city, spiritually and morally.
 
It was not uncommon to see someone like Paul Simon in a summer Central Park concert and then checkout the punks at CBGB's. Most punk bands were actually good musicians that played down their chops and played very sloppy sets as that's what the music called for.
 
Sventonio is correct on one key point. Album sales were becoming big business in the seventies and record company scouts were all over NYC. That's how bands like Blue Oyster Cult got their start along with people like Billy Joel. Both were from neighboring Long Island.
 
I, and my friends, generally preferred to escape the city drudgery by going to Madison Square Garden and seeing bands like ELP, Pink Floyd, Yes and Tull. We actually thought the whole punk thing would just be contained to NYC and eventually die out.
 
The so-called first wave of the Velvet Underground and the MC5 were a joke. They were not popular in NYC and the Velvets actually took up residence in Boston, Mass. The MC5 stayed at home in Detroit, I assume.
 
Punk did eventually die out and pretty quickly but not before doing a whirlwind on both coasts, crossing the Atlantic and spawning New Wave. That's how I remember it. Very quick and not making a lot of sense, even to a native New Yorker.
 
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 26 2015 at 18:49
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

Originally posted by moosehead moosehead wrote:

Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

^^ Young people don't move these days Tongue
 
Not a good joke. Hip hop movement started way back in the 70s'
I was pointing for Svetonio's post, but seriously what major movement appeared in the last 20 years? Ermm
EDM (existed before but rose to popularity in the 90s). Grunge. In the 00s, revivalism.

Edited by Polymorphia - August 26 2015 at 18:51
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