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rogerthat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2021 at 08:32
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Originally posted by Grumpyprogfan Grumpyprogfan wrote:

Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

The problem with Twitter is it's too crude and virtually anyone can butt in with any kind of 'opinion' where opinion could be simply a euphemism for vile personal insults. 
Sounds like a description of PA, sometimes.

PA is an extremely well moderated forum. We do get flare ups and rows here, but they are, in truth, an e caption and not the rule.

We don’t often get the type of moronic comments you see on social media at large.

Yeah, that remark might be ok in a facetious vein but there's simply no comparison between whatever arguments you see here and Twitter.  Twitter is just impossibly ugly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2021 at 11:28
Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

Yeah I stopped using Pacefook a good while ago (4-5 years?) and my life has been so much easier.
It’s basically just a platform for lying about how great/horrendous/fantastic/awful one’s life is...and then of course taking a photo of situations in order to prove to everyone else that you indeed experienced something in your life.

I realise I am coming off like an old man.
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Edited by Catcher10 - April 08 2021 at 11:29
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote someone_else Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2021 at 11:31
I have an account on Veestboek1, but I usually keep a rather low profile these days. I have very mixed feelings about those so-called social media and the negative ones prevail. It's just because some things I gladly use have tied themselves up to Veestboek. I don't have a Twitter account and Instagram is a playground for those teenage girlie-girlies who want to play the top model's part in their own bubbles, methinks.

I hate the idea of being connected 24/7 and the internet of things.

1The name Veestboek is derived from an almost forgotten Dutch word and means The book of farts and burps.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Awesoreno Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2021 at 14:19
Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:


That’s just being hip these days. A photo of anything is proof...that you indeed took a photo. The question beckons though...how much of life’s genuinely interesting and satori-like moments does one truly experience with a camera between the event and oneself?
That’s my main gripe with Facebook. Everything is so superficial. A neverending quest for likes and faux accomplishments.
Truth be told, I thought it was a great idea to begin with...but the more I see of it the more I am reminded of Narcisus and his love affair with his own reflection.

You're describing Instagram and Twitter with the need to constantly document things. Facebook is for spreading misinformation through disreputable news sources and creating comfy cultural echo chambers so you never have to question whether you're wrong or not now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote progaardvark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2021 at 14:51
I don't seem to be having the bad experiences others are on Facebook. I'm "friends" with or follow multiple musicians, many of them in the hallowed PA database. It's nice to see posts from them announcing what they're working on and many times they're much more personal than you'd expect. A lot of my "friends" post funny one-panel comics or memes, and I in turn also do this when I have the time.

Now that's not to say that I've had to deal with trolls and such in the past. You just unfriend them. Sure, that sets my Facebook account up to be an echo chamber of sorts. But that's OK. My life doesn't depend on Facebook and there are better sites out there for doing research. Like others have said, it's another way of keeping in touch with family.

One other benefit to Facebook: genealogy of living people. When public records on Ancestry.com only get you so far with tracing a tree into the present, sometimes finding living people on Facebook opens up more current family relationships and details that otherwise are unavailable. 

So rather than treat it as "that lousy social media," think out of the box and treat is as a resource for your hobbies, for your interests, and, in my case, for data to help me fill in family trees. To each his/her own.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hercules Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2021 at 15:42
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

Originally posted by ssmarcus ssmarcus wrote:

Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

I know FB is anathema to a lot of people who frequent these forums,


Yea, but for the rest of humanity, forums are anathema period. I get we suffer through it here because beggars can't be choosers. But why did the existing facebook functionality have to suffer? 

I used to be a member of many forums, and a moderator of a couple, They are definitely a relic from the past, so it’s kind of appropriate the PA forums linger on. The PA forums is not only the only one I am still a member of, but it’s the only forum I know that still exists. Every other forum I have ever been part of no longer exists. I have no doubt there are other forums still out there, of course, but they are probably as antiquated as this one. That’s not a criticism, by the way. Merely a statement of fact.


I am interested, Nick, as to why forums should be seen as a relic of the past. I am not on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, or any other of these social media sites. I find them all rather pointless, excepting when I do research for work or PABT. I far prefer forums to share opinions, and I lurk on PE, occasionally posting there, a couple of Star Trek forums, and other cultural sites.

Facebook: Definition - a place where ignorant, self-opinionated people meet to make enemies of each other.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lazland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2021 at 16:07
Originally posted by Hercules Hercules wrote:

Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

Originally posted by ssmarcus ssmarcus wrote:

Originally posted by nick_h_nz nick_h_nz wrote:

I know FB is anathema to a lot of people who frequent these forums,


Yea, but for the rest of humanity, forums are anathema period. I get we suffer through it here because beggars can't be choosers. But why did the existing facebook functionality have to suffer? 

I used to be a member of many forums, and a moderator of a couple, They are definitely a relic from the past, so it’s kind of appropriate the PA forums linger on. The PA forums is not only the only one I am still a member of, but it’s the only forum I know that still exists. Every other forum I have ever been part of no longer exists. I have no doubt there are other forums still out there, of course, but they are probably as antiquated as this one. That’s not a criticism, by the way. Merely a statement of fact.


I am interested, Nick, as to why forums should be seen as a relic of the past. I am not on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, or any other of these social media sites. I find them all rather pointless, excepting when I do research for work or PABT. I far prefer forums to share opinions, and I lurk on PE, occasionally posting there, a couple of Star Trek forums, and other cultural sites.

Facebook: Definition - a place where ignorant, self-opinionated people meet to make enemies of each other.

Yeah, that’s generally how I feel about it. A mate of mine asked me not long ago, millions of people can’t be wrong, to which I responded, yes they can, and very often are.
Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2021 at 19:11
I like the "granularity" of this forum vs. Facebook!  Many interesting topics, easy of starting a new topic, share music videos on YouTube etc. 

Facebook?  Bah!!  Pox upon them!!  Dead
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jaketejas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2021 at 21:50
If you want to know what’s wrong with Facebook, watch the Friendface episode of IT Crowd.

Friendface

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Progishness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2021 at 00:00
It is said that Twitter is where you make friends with people you know that you'll never meet.

And Facebook is where you're found by people you hoped you'd never see again.
"We're going to need a bigger swear jar."

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2021 at 00:29
Originally posted by progaardvark progaardvark wrote:

I don't seem to be having the bad experiences others are on Facebook. I'm "friends" with or follow multiple musicians, many of them in the hallowed PA database. It's nice to see posts from them announcing what they're working on and many times they're much more personal than you'd expect. A lot of my "friends" post funny one-panel comics or memes, and I in turn also do this when I have the time.

Now that's not to say that I've had to deal with trolls and such in the past. You just unfriend them. Sure, that sets my Facebook account up to be an echo chamber of sorts. But that's OK. My life doesn't depend on Facebook and there are better sites out there for doing research. Like others have said, it's another way of keeping in touch with family.

One other benefit to Facebook: genealogy of living people. When public records on Ancestry.com only get you so far with tracing a tree into the present, sometimes finding living people on Facebook opens up more current family relationships and details that otherwise are unavailable. 

So rather than treat it as "that lousy social media," think out of the box and treat is as a resource for your hobbies, for your interests, and, in my case, for data to help me fill in family trees. To each his/her own.

I do use FB for all the same advantages you mention.  Rather, but for these advantages, I would long ago have deleted my account.  I hold my nose and ignore the toxicity but it's not pleasant.  See, what do you do when the 'trolls' posting malicious propaganda are your friends or relatives?  Sounds like you haven't been in that situation very often, but I have.  In certain countries, it's a lonely furrow to remain a liberal (especially, er, a centrist, supposedly the root of all evil) even though people in these countries, like mine, continue to assail the imaginary strawman of an evil liberal nexus having a stranglehold over institutions. You discover sides of people you otherwise like that you wish you hadn't.  And a simple unfollow cannot make you 'unsee' that. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote octopus-4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2021 at 05:03
I have never been a FB user and I have recently closed my Linkedin account, too.
PA is enough for me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote progaardvark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2021 at 15:14
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

Originally posted by progaardvark progaardvark wrote:

I don't seem to be having the bad experiences others are on Facebook. I'm "friends" with or follow multiple musicians, many of them in the hallowed PA database. It's nice to see posts from them announcing what they're working on and many times they're much more personal than you'd expect. A lot of my "friends" post funny one-panel comics or memes, and I in turn also do this when I have the time.

Now that's not to say that I've had to deal with trolls and such in the past. You just unfriend them. Sure, that sets my Facebook account up to be an echo chamber of sorts. But that's OK. My life doesn't depend on Facebook and there are better sites out there for doing research. Like others have said, it's another way of keeping in touch with family.

One other benefit to Facebook: genealogy of living people. When public records on Ancestry.com only get you so far with tracing a tree into the present, sometimes finding living people on Facebook opens up more current family relationships and details that otherwise are unavailable. 

So rather than treat it as "that lousy social media," think out of the box and treat is as a resource for your hobbies, for your interests, and, in my case, for data to help me fill in family trees. To each his/her own.

I do use FB for all the same advantages you mention.  Rather, but for these advantages, I would long ago have deleted my account.  I hold my nose and ignore the toxicity but it's not pleasant.  See, what do you do when the 'trolls' posting malicious propaganda are your friends or relatives?  Sounds like you haven't been in that situation very often, but I have.  In certain countries, it's a lonely furrow to remain a liberal (especially, er, a centrist, supposedly the root of all evil) even though people in these countries, like mine, continue to assail the imaginary strawman of an evil liberal nexus having a stranglehold over institutions. You discover sides of people you otherwise like that you wish you hadn't.  And a simple unfollow cannot make you 'unsee' that. 

No, I guess that I haven't been in that situation much. Most of the folks I've unfriended were not actually real friends or relatives, though I have unfriended a couple actual friends, a couple co-workers, and one distant relative. I'm sorry you've had these experiences. If I were in your situation I think I'd hold my nose and try to ignore it too. It all comes down to how valuable your positive experiences are as opposed to the negative ones. Once it gets past a tipping point is when you start questioning whether it's worth the stress spending time on Facebook (or any other social media platform).


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Easy Money Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2021 at 16:50
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

Originally posted by progaardvark progaardvark wrote:

I don't seem to be having the bad experiences others are on Facebook. I'm "friends" with or follow multiple musicians, many of them in the hallowed PA database. It's nice to see posts from them announcing what they're working on and many times they're much more personal than you'd expect. A lot of my "friends" post funny one-panel comics or memes, and I in turn also do this when I have the time.

Now that's not to say that I've had to deal with trolls and such in the past. You just unfriend them. Sure, that sets my Facebook account up to be an echo chamber of sorts. But that's OK. My life doesn't depend on Facebook and there are better sites out there for doing research. Like others have said, it's another way of keeping in touch with family.

One other benefit to Facebook: genealogy of living people. When public records on Ancestry.com only get you so far with tracing a tree into the present, sometimes finding living people on Facebook opens up more current family relationships and details that otherwise are unavailable. 

So rather than treat it as "that lousy social media," think out of the box and treat is as a resource for your hobbies, for your interests, and, in my case, for data to help me fill in family trees. To each his/her own.


I do use FB for all the same advantages you mention.  Rather, but for these advantages, I would long ago have deleted my account.  I hold my nose and ignore the toxicity but it's not pleasant.  See, what do you do when the 'trolls' posting malicious propaganda are your friends or relatives?  Sounds like you haven't been in that situation very often, but I have.  In certain countries, it's a lonely furrow to remain a liberal (especially, er, a centrist, supposedly the root of all evil) even though people in these countries, like mine, continue to assail the imaginary strawman of an evil liberal nexus having a stranglehold over institutions. You discover sides of people you otherwise like that you wish you hadn't.  And a simple unfollow cannot make you 'unsee' that. 
I get feeds and opinions from friends and relatives that I disagree with entirely, but I still want to see all of this because I want to know what other people are thinking and what kind of propaganda is making the rounds these days.
I post very little on FB myself, but I scroll through the feeds occasionally, it serves a purpose similar to channel surfing with a TV remote. I got rid of my TV 10 years ago, so things like youtube and other websites are my entertainment when I feel like goofing off.

Edited by Easy Money - April 09 2021 at 20:06
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ExittheLemming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2021 at 06:16
I feel a bit conflicted about the whole social media debate as i used to get a ton of spam emails but after closing my Facebook page these ceased almost instantaneously. Although I do take seriously the real mental health issues and tragedies directly attributable to anonymous abusers and I understand how many feel the owners of Google, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram etc should be held more accountable for their user content: Aren't we in danger of blaming the paint factory for the graffiti here?. isn't the posting of vile, hateful and indefensible messages on line an education and parenting issue at source? (we can maybe also throw in mental health to that list?)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2021 at 06:36
Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

I feel a bit conflicted about the whole social media debate as i used to get a ton of spam emails but after closing my Facebook page these ceased almost instantaneously. Although I do take seriously the real mental health issues and tragedies directly attributable to anonymous abusers and I understand how many feel the owners of Google, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram etc should be held more accountable for their user content: Aren't we in danger of blaming the paint factory for the graffiti here?. isn't the posting of vile, hateful and indefensible messages on line an education and parenting issue at source? (we can maybe also throw in mental health to that list?)
Yup, I certainly don't think this is something FB or Twitter can 'fix'.  If this is what social media brings out of us, we need to fix ourselves.  Maybe that's a slight upside of cancel culture.  I mean, just BECAUSE you are using a computer or a phone to communicate doesn't mean  you should unleash racist BS.  So there being a price for that isn't a bad thing (though the mob outing people who didn't actually say anything bigoted is bad with a capital B). But what I am driving at is some sort of social code falling in place as to what you can say in social media (the same as polite society) is a better solution than people getting suspended from FB for alleged insults or abuses.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2021 at 06:38
One thing that FB, Twitter, Youtube could all do is something that's already done here on PA and on other internet forums.  Which is to simply screen out cuss words.  When you find your cuss words hidden by asterisks, you will start to use them less frequently.  I am sure IF they wanted to, these big and mighty giants could do THAT.  Rather, they should have done that long ago.  It would have saved them the trouble of attending Congressional hearings where they are threatened with regulation.  But where a forum like this tries to keep things in reasonable order, the SM giants were greedy and goaded vile speech because more usage was good for their bottomline, plain and simple. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2021 at 02:56
Originally posted by progaardvark progaardvark wrote:

I don't seem to be having the bad experiences others are on Facebook. I'm "friends" with or follow multiple musicians, many of them in the hallowed PA database. It's nice to see posts from them announcing what they're working on and many times they're much more personal than you'd expect. A lot of my "friends" post funny one-panel comics or memes, and I in turn also do this when I have the time.
...

Hi,

With one large bit of difference ... in many cases you are not allowed to reply to the post ... and that keeps a lot of "comments" out of it.

In PA, the idea of "freedom" and "openness" is actually all right, with the exception that PA has not had the folks interested in maintaining a good relationship with many artists, and even go so far as interviewing them ... one look at one person, who was interviewed and his work is criticized widely, shows you why I would imagine that a lot of artists are not interested in PA ... too many "social media" fans, that have no respect for the music itself, or for the artist, for that matter.

Sometimes, in these situations, the comments need to be moderated to help the music and the artist ... and this is something that PA is not capable of doing to help keep/maintain "progressive music" or "prog rock" in good hands and with critical comments ... the majority of comments about the music have no informational value, except that person X would rather have this or that, and certainly not what he/she is discussing.

Having opinions is fine, but not respecting the art itself, is another story ... but in this social media world, the art is not valuable and does not mean enough to anyone, as its content gets diluted and distorted to the point of worthless. Same thing, for someone making the call to do a concept piece and then break apart the pieces so they fit a "song" format and in the process really hurt the whole thing ... in my eyes ... 

But a group like PA, maintaining a person to get interviews and various discussions, is a problem, when the interest is always leaning towards "favoritism", than it is towards an objective study of the artist and his/her work. AND, PA does not have the Admin number of folks to help maintain the bad comments and responses out of the threads, something that a lot of people do not find fun, and interesting. AND, as an artist, would turn me off ... I'm OK with critical/intelligent comments, but I draw the line between that and the stupid comment response that has nothing to do with the whole thing except showing some personality traits that are not very respectful, or cool.

IF, we are going to be in FAVOR of the artists, we have to unload a lot of "personal favoritism" so that the ugly comments don't hurt the whole thing ... and in this area, I'm not sure that PA has that conceptual interest in their whole thing ... it's just another database out there that can not appreciate the artistry as much as it should to help the music we love.

The problem? I doubt that we love the whole thing as much as we think, when all we reply to are the same posts about 3 or 4 bands ... 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Progishness Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 13 2021 at 09:46
I note that PA's old Twitter account (which I used to follow) has been suspended by the twitter powers that be. Does anyone know the back story to this?
"We're going to need a bigger swear jar."

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