Progressive Rock, a part of a certain culture?

The difference between then and now is the social environment. I feel confident to say that most people realize that. I additionally feel that the inconsistency of Progressive Rock took place in western culture. I have had conversations with musicians in Europe over the last 30 years and it would appear that the concept of music ..such as ever expanding is a way of life in Europe. Music in the European cultures seems to thrive on the importance of natural expression in the arts.

Vangelis once said..." When the music drives the composer its natural ....real...When the composer drives the music it's the record business " What he's saying about the composer driving the music? ...I feel that in America and things used to be quite different here. Particularly in the 60s when music of a experimental nature leaked through.

The definition of Progressive Rock today is sometimes discouraging to think about. From all angles it could never be what it once was because of the times we were living in. Unless there was a way to influence people to think that way again. To feel something from creating experimental music, Electronic, Progressive Rock..etc...through a separation from reality. To go inward which is the total opposite of trying to come up with something purposely to please people who want songs about what's relevant now. That's not how Can invented musical ideas. Popol Vuh didn't seem interested in molding their band for the consumer right? So that's what I'm saying...these bands were not trying to be weird or super creative. They were just being themselves. And that's been an on going issue in America in the Jazz community, and also the underground Prog community.

To bring back the original mind set of opening up to be creative as opposed to creating watered down Jazz and redundancy in Prog you'd have to change the environment. There are a number of Neo Prog bands that are very original and completely outstanding..but it's sad to think that in the early 70s...originality outnumbered the contrived. The composers that drive the music for their slave master at Columbia or Warner Brothers. To think that for several years a lot of Progressive Rock bands actually didn't sound alike. Gentle Giant, King Crimson, Curved Air, Genesis, Yes, and Renaissance had only the slightest similarities. I'm not precisely sure how these bands were able to pull that off except for the possibility that their own personal influences sent them off in a direction that was innovative. A lot of bands came across emulating them instead of being influenced to create something else with a difference.

It's possible that record companies put the pressure on new bands to sound like ELP. It's always possible that things changed for the worst because of that. " Does your band have a keyboard player?" " Does he play like Keith Emerson?" "Does he play 2 keyboards at the same time?"

Is it really necessary to be concerned over that? Does that really have anything to do with being creative? What if you responded like.."Well, I actually have my own style of playing if that's alright with you.   People in that industry are notorious for responding like this.."Well, you're not being a team player and we need you to compromise " ...but it's not about a team player or any of that...no..no..that's called reasoning.

The underground Progressive Rock bands of the 70s and 80s were important to me because they played such beautiful music. Conventum, Pulsar, Solaris, Univers Zero, Art Zoyd, Halloween .    The idea that they were genuine was intriguing. Recently I was chatting with a musician from Norway . They explained that Progressive Rock is more accepted in Norway and that the environment is quite the opposite of the U.S. and that generally more people understand Progressive Rock in Norway and are commonly interested in it.

Edited by Jacob Schoolcraft - January 27 2022 at 21:35

It's about the music ultimately. Prog is just a complicated form or pop music and it was in its day a commercial enterprise. It never existed in a vacuum though and the rise in student based politics ('free thinking') must have helped it along. The way things were in the sixties was important to its development. I don't see any cultural element to it though and most fans I see at shows are white and middle class. It's pretty elitist all said and done. 

David_D wrote:  and there is much more than the music itself.

David_D wrote: Lewian wrote: David_D wrote:  and there is much more than the music itself.    What exactly? that what I mentioned

Lewian wrote: David_D wrote: Lewian wrote: David_D wrote:  and there is much more than the music itself.    What exactly? that what I mentioned Sorry, I went through your postings in this thread once more, but still don't know what exactly. You said something like "there's people there's more", but not what there is. Obviously people are needed to play and listen to the music, and I grant you there are some journals and discussion forums/groups, but what else? For example, if I consider this forum, the only topic that makes it special is prog music. Any other topic discussed here could be discussed with the same points of view and the same interest in any forum on anything else.

Edited by David_D - January 29 2022 at 03:45

moshkito wrote: David_D wrote: ... "it's a popular genre with a very large number of bands (including the old ones) and of course even much much larger of listeners." ... Hi, See? This is a problem. If this is the only reason for thinking something is great and "right", then it is the end of "progressive music". The number of bands has nothing to do with it ... how folks take to the new bands and everything else IS. But, if folks, just like you have expressed, continuously make the point that the "much much larger (number) of listeners" is the important thing, then the argument is over ... it's no longer about the music or the subculture ... it's about the fame. More: You don't think that VARIETY knows that its numbers are fake? They don't include a lot of "independents" because they have no numbers for it, which tells you that they created numbers off their 5 stores (same ownership) and multiplied it by 100, and then posted it ... AND, YOU AND A LOT OF UN-SUSPECTING PUBLIC, BELIEVED IT! Even more so for movies, because they want to make sure that their investment brings the money back in times 10 or 20!!!!! So you believe the press which they own, and the notices, and the adverts on TV that make it look good with slick cutting and show! I can't help thinking that "progressive" is not about just another lemming out there ...

Thank you Moshkito for your insight! I appreciate it

David_D wrote: Prog today is certainly diverse from the mainstream Rock, and it's a popular genre with a very large number of bands (including the old ones) and of course even much much larger of listeners. So it's a phenomenon besides the mainstream music culture, and there is much more than the music itself.  The question is what can be said about the present approach of the musicians and the listeners, including the relationship between them.

Edited by David_D - January 29 2022 at 04:36

What motivates musicians? They're artists, creators. 

Edited by Cristi - January 29 2022 at 07:23